Food For Thought Question...

[DAG42]

The squad marking thread got me thinking. If vet squad takes the place of a tactical in the army. Why doesn't it count as a troop choice as well? There must be another reason than just game terms...JMO.

[Azrael Turnbull]

Good question, DAG42. You are right with your first assumption, however; it is purely for game terms. It stops people from choosing veterans all the time over Tactical squads. Yes, there are other ways, like limiting the amount of veterans you can take in an army etc, but this is just the way they decided to do it.

 

Yes, they should be able to fill the rolls of their less experienced brothers by being able to hold on to objectives; but if you look at the bigger picture, there are many units that should be able to hold them when they can't. I believe that having troops being the only unit that can hold an objective is purely an attempt to prevent power gaming. I think they should make a minimum points cost instead of unit amount like in Fantasy, but bump it up to at least a third of the total points limit, rather than just a quarter. Do you think that this would make a better alternative than the 'only troops can hold objectives' approach? ;)

[DAG42]

I'm not at all familiar with the fantasy rules as I'm not a player. But I was looking at it from the perspective of DA player with a lack of troop choices. When compared to BA , SW and some of the other armies.

[pueriexdeus]

Game wise I have found it beneficial to pair Combat Sqds of Troops with either full Devastator or Vet Sqds on the obj. For the movement to contact I tend to split a full Tac Sqd and add an Aslt Sqd w/JP Chappi to take the op's obj. Generally I do tend to hold my obj, and either take or contest the OP's.

[Brother Immolator]

Lets face it:From a realistic prespective all soldiers should have been able to capture objectives.But if that was the case then the tactical squads would have no meaning.You would replace them with vets or devs.

[rpnightsend]

This thread got off topic quite quickly...

My on-topic comment (and an attempt to make the point of why this is fluffy) is that veterans would not be tasked with something as menial as holding an objective, no matter how important. I know that sounds strange, but think of the "only troops hold objectives" in terms of this: Veterans would not be wasted holding an easily defensible position (as objectives often are) in a smaller conflict (that is, non-apocalypse games). Instead they should be charging headlong into the enemy, or supporting the basic troops to shore up the defense of these objectives (as pueriexdeus plays). The deployment of a veteran unit would be something a commander would have to consider carefully, and he wouldn't want to park them on an objective when their wargear and training allows them to take a more agressive combat role.

 

From a rules standpoint, I love the way 5th edition encourages the use of troops. I was sick of playing 4th ed. games where my opponent would deploy all his crazy elite and fast attack units, etc, and then plop 2 minimum squads down and say "oh, here are my troops". I also like kill points over victory points, as they prevent players from just spamming troops choices too. Azrael, your suggestion would probably work too, but remember that GW does make a conscious effort to seperate fantasy and 40k as different games, and I think the way the current 40k force org chart rules are fine.

[DAG42]

I try to keep realistic out of games because if it does arguments can spring up. I guess with our scouts being gone to elites it just got me thinking when I was looking at the markings thread. I've played through all these DA dex's and I miss some things we used to have and starting to get bored with this 1 mainly, but I can't bring myself to play another army. I've built Emperors Children but board with Chaos and none of the others interest me at all.

[rpnightsend]

try some xenos. My Vanilla Marines and Dark Angels are still my favorite, but I take my Speed Freaks out for a literal and figurative spin now and again and have a lot of fun with them

please don't execute me for heresy for suggesting that.

[Brother Immolator]

Champers stormbolter::::How filthy xenos lovers came in the rock?

And blasts away at rpnightsend.

[rpnightsend]

I'm not a xenos lover. I just have become acquanted with their battle style do to my use of polymorphine... thats actually a good question... could a space marine use polymorphine?

[stonhinge]

In my mind, veteran squads are the equivalent of a Special Forces team - they're there to seize objectives, but holding is better suited to the "standard" guys.

[Brother Immolator]

I'm not a xenos lover. I just have become acquanted with their battle style do to my use of polymorphine... thats actually a good question... could a space marine use polymorphine?

 

Silence!Let Asmodai decide your fate!Lulz!

[rpnightsend]

yes stonhinge, thats exactly what I said before, but in a few more words.