Demoulius Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 Hey guys. finished the campaign in about 12 hours (pretty good i think) and went to give multiplayer a shot. and i have to say there are alot of things making me say what the :cuss right now... Il start of with my biggest gripe (and im not sure if this is due to the game or due to a connection that went bad overnight) lag this game is lagging like hell.... some examples of what i mean: I get shot 2 times in the face with certain bolt weapons and i die. ok, fair enough. enemies on the other hand surive full seconds of body shots from me wielding the same weapon and same perks yet they kill me by firing back (which is basicly the situation i described earlier, only now reversed and im still the one who dies) they still have a good portion of their health left... ;) other example: meltaguns. these puppies just blaze right through people, like they should in the fluff! thing is the range is limited. fair enough. when i fire these things point blank at enemies though it doesent seem to fase them... and i dont mean to say i miss, assault marines charge right at me, i pull the trigger right before he is in melee range and nothing happens... sure i hit him (or so it shows on my screen) yet hes still standing and now introducing his chainsword/powerweapon/thunderhammer to my face.... (sometimes i hit them 3 times, get killed and they have like 50% health left....uh...what? B) ) Not to mention the assault marines that start hacking away at the air 5 feet away from you and manage to kill you by slicing at nothing. people suddenly teleporting (not rolling away just moving from spot to spot instantaniously) when you try to hack at them with a melee weapon... i can count the number of games where my connection was green on 1 hand (2 fingers) and all the others i had 3 yellow ones or worse... Ive played enough fps games to know when i cant beat the lag :down: its not constant though and seems to happen the most when people get up close and personal or when lots of fighting happens at the same spot. i can play a ton of other games lagfree and my internet browsing speed is really fast so i kind of doubt its my internet connection :huh: #2. something else that im not to much a fan of (other might be) having to gain levels to play the game that you paid money for. you start out as a tactical marine with a bolter....thats it. no acces to other weapons, no acces to other classes and the really good (or at least semi helpfull) perks come in pretty late in the game. your opponents could be swining thunderhammers at you and could be bombarding you with plasmacannons :down: whilst all you can is fire back with an (unupgraded) bolter and hope you get lucky headshot or something... doesent seem very beginners friendly (as in people just starting to play online) to me... #3 things not beeing very true to the fluff. i can appreciate that this is a game and that they want to make gameplay as balanced as possible, but could someone please tell me how plasma does less damage to a person then a bolter round does? plasmaburns and melts their armour yet they are ok beeing hit by it since their health doesent suffer that much from beeing molten to a pill of slag...apparently.... :geek: #4 only 4 maps (i think) and 2 gametypes... hurrm... i guess they will add more in the future but it seems abit bare... maps are starting to get boring fast. sorry for this little rant but after a few days of trying to like the online gameplay im abit disapointed in these things. the lag makes playing a raptor/assault marine almost impossible at times and trying to kill an assault marine in time before he guts me is a painfull prospect. if im not caught off guard its basicly the question whos got the best skills/least amount of lag. with the latter always having the upperhand... nothing as lame as standing behind a marine firing a melta in his back only to find out hes not standing there at all, rather hes in a corner besides you toting a heavy bolter and you just ran into his field of fire :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Millar Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 Most of the lag problems will be down to poor host selection which will hopefully get patched, other games have had this issue within a week or two of release. The whole character progression that isn't very newbie friendly is a big problem with a lot of games now days. The amount of people who like this as opposed to those who don't must be pretty significant as it's a very popular inclusion in multiplayer, oh well :) . The plasma pistol was probably made the way it is for balance issues, you said yourself about the unfair progression and having a balanced selection of weapons lessens the advantage of higher level players somewhat. I totaly agree that only 4 maps on release sucks, hopefully some new ones are included in the free DLC in October. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872329 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader of Dorn Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 yeah the games lags, every MP does. I ts likely a patch will work but you'll still get bad games. lag issues only annoy me if i know someone is abusing it - lagswitchers for example. Theres 5 maps i think, the horde mode sounds good there needs to be Co-Op with this badly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872333 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demoulius Posted September 10, 2011 Author Share Posted September 10, 2011 the healthy selection of weapons lessons the pain somewhat, but its a teethpullingly painfull trip to make. as soon as you get the good weapons and perks and you can at least give them a run for their money. the game is very enjoyable when the lag doesent (or hardly) pop up! sadly however the games were im lucky not to lag my arse off are in the minority... having just unlocked the plasmacannon ive had some good fun with it, as you only need to roughly know where they are to kill them with a charged blast :D likewise, softening up targets with grenades (either by a lucky hit or calculated throw) also makes the fights possible to win. otherwise i generaly need to have a jump on my enemy or have an opponent with a very unsteady aim to win :P or if you are the one outgunning your opponent :) thing is, in a straight up fight with all this lag going on its very hard to win out. like i said though its generaly only when people get close to me so the generic bolter is oddly enough the weapon im most adapt at using ^_^ glad to see im not on my own in this boat. i hadent even taken hosts with bad connections into account -_- suddenly explains why a few people always have good connections while the rest dont :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872343 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash113 Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 All of your complaints except the number of maps and gametypes sound like lag to me. Not game programming or balance, leave the room and find another. Even with all the problems connecting on the PS3 I've still been able to find various lobbies without too much time and the lag, while problematic sometimes, has usually been fixed by finding a different lobby with better hosts. As for the weapons and levels, I don't get the complaint. I had a little trouble starting off as a tactical marine but a bolter is still a bolter and I managed a better than 1:1 Kill/Death in my first match and did better in the subsequent matches. The Dev and Assault unlock pretty quick as do most of the weapons. By level 20 you should have pretty much all the weapons (save the Vengeance Launcher I think) and a good selection of perks and even armor variations to mess with. It's more about playing your class well and less about what that class is or even what your weapon is. I still die to Bolters fairly often and the Heavy Bolter never runs out of style. Plasma is also pretty darn good, my Plasma Pistol burns through enemies pretty quickly and the Rifle even better. Unlocking equipment gives you a sense of purpose and accomplishment, not just letting higher level people feel superior. Besides I always find that superiority deflates with a few bolt rounds to the face. I'm also not that irked by the lack of maps or game types, the game types are solid and the maps well laid out and interesting. I prefer quality over quantity and am greatly looking forward to the survival mode when it comes out next month. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872390 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 I have had exactly one game that was really laggy and I ended up leaving it because it was so bad. Other than that, I haven't any significant issues with lag and I'm at level 19. For reference I play on PS3 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872408 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heru Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 I haven't lagged yet on PC, and I'm at level 22 (only been playing for two days). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872457 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 the humble bolter is one of the better weapons in the game, and the perk that makes it realy good (kraken rounds) is aquired by using it, not by leveling up. also in my experience, the chainsword is by far superior to the thunder hammer. and the "copy loadout" option can allow you to get any perk/weapon combination the enemy has regardless of your level. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872754 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artein Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Every weapon specific perk is earned by using this specific weapon. Class perks are gained through leveling. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872853 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demoulius Posted September 11, 2011 Author Share Posted September 11, 2011 i know how the perks are unlocked... and yea, when Mr.Millar mentioned the problem might be related to hosts ive started to check every time when im laggy and just about everytime its a bad host.... finding a new one solves the lag problem most of the times so that doesent bother me as much anymore ;) im slowly starting to be more humored by it then dissapointed to. after killing a assault marine (as an assault marine) and jumped 50 feet away and STILL getting caught in his last vengeance is only humorish. who could have known they carried demolisher cannon shells in their jumppacks? the problem i have with leveled progression is that you force people to play alot to get to the weapons and perks that they want. i have no problem with playing the game itself... im already lvl 29 (almost lvl 30) so ive long ago unlocked all the weapons and perks (one left at lvl 31 if im not mistaken) that i care about awarding players with perks is one thing. not giving them anythign to start with is something else entirely. (teleport homer helps indirectly, it doesent make anythings stronger or give you an edge.... you can spawn people if they even bother to try to...) and makes for a very tough tstart. its basicly personal preference. i dident like the early levels. the 'copy loadout' function is a really nice touch though. made it less a pain and showed me abit of what perks work well together :) the complaint about the maps still stand. i find 5 maps very slim pickings. i hope they bring out some more maps soon. aside from the small choice i have to say that the maps are very well made though. good sense of flow, its easy to flank in alot of cases yet there are spots that are easy to defend as well. (bottleneck in shattered bridge for example) overall it produces some very interesting gameplay :) about the gametypes. i dont understand why free for all i missing (anni is basicly team deathmatch, why no true deathmatch?) likewise there is no capture the flag (or power core or dirty little secret...) its easy to come up with gametypes. why they are missing though is anyones guess... sieze ground is the only true teamplay related game and only playing that gets boring after an hour or two... look i dont dislike the game. otherwise i would stopped playing and caring a long time ago :P im just dissapointed by some things (which as we found out is largely related to bad hosts) and think some things could have been done better... Il just wait patiently for new maps and gametypes to come out :) im not lvl 41 yet and have plenty of things left to unlock :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2872991 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningWolfFenris Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Even an un-upgraded bolter is still useful, the trick being you need to work with your team. This is less of a lone wolf style game and more of a situation where you use teamwork to quickly kill enemies. All the other issues sound like lag. If it's a consistent problem for you it might be in part due to your internet connection. What speed it your connection? How many mbps? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Il start of with my biggest gripe (and im not sure if this is due to the game or due to a connection that went bad overnight) lag As peeps have said, the poor host selection is a large factor...however you can try a few things local to you to try and make it better. Start out bottoming out your graphics settings. No, really. Try it out and see if it improves. If it doesn't at all, then turn em back where they were. If it does improve, start increasing the settings in little bits until you find a sweet spot. ...they still have a good portion of their health left... :blink: Lag is a factor here too, but - as always in these games - combat is crazy. If you're taking shots to your face from more than one shooter (and you may not always be aware of all the shooters: lots of these maps have very good firing lanes for snipers) and you're hitting your target center of mass, you are going down first. other example: meltaguns. these puppies just blaze right through people, like they should in the fluff! thing is the range is limited. fair enough. when i fire these things point blank at enemies though it doesent seem to fase them.. (sometimes i hit them 3 times, get killed and they have like 50% health left....uh...what? ;) ) Melta gun range isn't just Point Blank. It's literally near-touching the target. If you are right-in-his-face and your shot cone contains his head, he's dead. If you are out of effective range (veerrry easy to be out of effective meltagun range) and/or the head's not in the shot, he'll kill you and you'll see that his armor/health remaining were a frustrating 0%/2% or the like. i can count the number of games where my connection was green on 1 hand (2 fingers) Then I strongly recommend cutting down your graphics settings. If your ping is stellar and you never have smooth games, bottom those settings down to crap-tastic and see if that helps. If your machine is a laptop or something, it's time to upgrade. <3 If you think "But I run these other games, or even this other 3D awesome-looking game and those have no problems?!" It could be that SM resends info to you based on what players are in the match, where they are, and it may not cache effectively or otherwise be not-the-most-optimal right now. Extra work that your system is doing is going to slow the world down for you in a frustrating, almost unplayable way. Seriously. Try lowering your settings. #2. something else that im not to much a fan of (other might be) having to gain levels to play the game that you paid money for. ....doesent seem very beginners friendly (as in people just starting to play online) to me... Two things here. First...if a guy one-shots you with a lascannon, select "Copy Loadout" and then shoot HIM with his own stupid lascannon. As for frustrating with leveling in games...I find I actually enjoy the leveling aspect, as it gives a reason to play; a sense of progression. could someone please tell me how plasma does less damage to a person then a bolter round does? I actually find plasma to be far more effective than bolters. The pistol fires so fast that it's deadly at engagement range (while I hop around out of meltagun range); the rifle is very accurate and strong; usually four or five center of mass shots drop him, whereas the boltgun takes significantly more shots. The plasma cannon is awesome. Very, very awesome. #4 only 4 maps (i think) and 2 gametypes... hurrm... i guess they will add more in the future but it seems abit bare... maps are starting to get boring fast. Maps are few but I find them to be pretty well balanced and I really enjoy Seize Ground. I do expect they'll add more; DLC is all the rage these days. As it is we're getting co-op in a month or so. Oh, and try turning down your graphics settings. ;) All the way down into ugly mode. See if that improves it, then turn them up slowly until you find the sweet spot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873612 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawgiver 67 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I still can't get online to play. For some reason my router won't let me into any lobbies. I have no problem with C.O.D but when I try with SM all I get is the occasional sound of another players' voice. I have a ps3. Any helpful ideas would be appreciated. Very frustrating!!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873675 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningWolfFenris Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I still can't get online to play. For some reason my router won't let me into any lobbies. I have no problem with C.O.D but when I try with SM all I get is the occasional sound of another players' voice. I have a ps3. Any helpful ideas would be appreciated. Very frustrating!!!! If it's anything like Xbox360 it's probably because of a Strict NAT. Basically the firewall on the router might be restricting it. You need to access the router options and change this. I've found tutorials online for 360 so I assume there should be some for PS3 as well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873728 Share on other sites More sharing options...
klisof Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I still can't get online to play. For some reason my router won't let me into any lobbies. I have no problem with C.O.D but when I try with SM all I get is the occasional sound of another players' voice. I have a ps3. Any helpful ideas would be appreciated. Very frustrating!!!! This is a known bug with the ps3 version of space marine. I have the same problem, sometimes if I leave it I can connect to a game in about half an hour :lol: you can get the latest info here: http://www.spacemarine.com/gb/forums/topic/4457 one work around is to start a private game, the bug only seems to affect public matchmaking. edit - a patch is being worked on. the error message about NAT settings is on the bug list as being wrong on the ps3 as well. If other games work ok, I would not try altering you router settings until after the next patch Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873729 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawgiver 67 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Thankyou for your help brothers. Much appreciated. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2873758 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathwing70 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 funny thing is, the game actually has 5 maps ;) Takes me alot of thinking to actually count them all. Not sure why that is.. they are in a way big enough to provide a good experience (with only 16 players - 8 a team theres plenty of room to run around). Bolter with kraken and targetter (just improves accuracy most noticable on full auto fire) can even make stalker bolter snipers roll away/take cover/fall over dead. You really notice the difference when you switch back to a 'normal' bolter... Chainsword is probably the most forgiving melee weapon because of it's speed. Thunderhammer is usually a 1 hit kill weapon (it is with the special ability) but you have to surprise your victim or he'll have all the time needed to get out of the way. Ofcourse lag is a big player with slow weapons... But your enemies will also have lag so you have to imagine the lag is on your side half the time aswell with them cursing the bad host... Plasma weapons strip off armour really fast, 1 charged shot after that usually takes out all of their health aswell... Bolt weapons on the other hand deal very well with victims that have no more armour. 1 small thing that bothers me on some maps is they are mirrored. However all marines are right-handed, and I guess since it's 3rd person, on some maps, some parts of cover 1 team is able to hide behind and shoot from the right side while the other team has to shoot from the left side... How do I explain this... the marines shooting from the right side of cover are able to hide most their body behind it and just have their gun poking out. While the marines shooting from the left side have to expose themselves fully and cannot benefit from the cover. When the maps are mirrored this obviously gives 1 team much more benefit from cover than the other... Fortunately there are master-crafted grenades, no longer "just" used for stripping armour :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2874244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disruptor_fe404 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Having installed the game and hit up a 3-hour stretch last night, I can safely say that I didn't encounter any of these issues you speak of, which tells me it's the game's netcode (and that it could do with a bit of a fix). I haven't much to add on the experience point front, but I will say that I'm always a fan of such things, because I like having something persistent to play towards in multiplayer games (which lessens the pain if I end up sucking at it. Which I don't. So maybe this isn't valid any more. I still like persistent levels and things though). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2874677 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The MP is great fun, generally, but quite frankly the MP is unfinished. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2874895 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disruptor_fe404 Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Having logged another hour on the multiplayer tonight, I will say that five maps feels insufficient. And that we could do with more game modes, like perhaps a proper assault-style map (a la Unreal Tournament or FarCry). Exterminatus will likely go some way in extending the multiplayer longevity. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2875307 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demoulius Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 Thanks for the feedback guys :D It completly slipped my mind that i could lower my settings ^_^ while ive had alot more games under my belt now the lag hasent imrpvoed but i found a (somewhat) solution to it. when fighting with someone and they are moving away i try to fire where they would be in a fraction of a second and it works wonders :) about the plasma: im VERY fond of the plasmacannon and tend to kill myself at least once or twice each game ;) (mostly when a raptor/assault marine gets close and i just have a blast charged up and reast ^_^ ) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2876764 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningWolfFenris Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Having logged another hour on the multiplayer tonight, I will say that five maps feels insufficient. And that we could do with more game modes, like perhaps a proper assault-style map (a la Unreal Tournament or FarCry). Exterminatus will likely go some way in extending the multiplayer longevity. I really agree with this. The lack of maps is really quite annoying, as I find myself falling into a pattern I know works for any given map. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2881024 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SickSix Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 When talking about lag can you state what system your using? I use PC/Steam and yes, sometimes the lag is terrible but then I just exit the match and find a new one. One issue I guess is that they use a peer-to-peer system on the PC at least. So far, I think the MP is fine. I actually think that only two game modes is nice for release because your garuanteed to find a game and not go searching between 8 different modes to try and find a big enough match. 4 maps is kind of a bummer. However, if you learn how to play a map with one class, then switch it up and try another. Some maps lend themselves to certain classes. The player progression can be rough but you know, they included 'Copy Loadout' for a reason. And if you play 'Sieze Ground' you level up MUCH faster. They really need to modify the xp gains for 'Annihilation' to be on par with 'Sieze Ground' (imho). Ok, I am also going to gripe about the Melta Gun. Is there a damn trick to killing people with that thing? I very very rarely EVER survive more than one blast from a melta gun yet sometimes (oftentimes) I have to hit people 2-3 times, and sometimes they still get me first. What the hell is the trick to it????? I have pretty much abandoned the Tactical Marine and stick to Assualt 80% of the time and the other 20% I play devastator and guard my teams closest 'flag' on certain maps. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2881391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Gotta be right next to 'em to be sure of the melta-kill. Since it isn't always perfect, I give 'em a blast with the melta to strip armor, then quickly switch to storm bolter to hose them down. Has been working nicely for me! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2881442 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 One issue I guess is that they use a peer-to-peer system on the PC at least. This is because it was originally slated to be a console only game and PC was added at the last minute. So they weren't able to add dedicated servers. Whether they will now or not is up for debate, though there seems to be a big outcry for them. Ok, I am also going to gripe about the Melta Gun. Is there a damn trick to killing people with that thing? I very very rarely EVER survive more than one blast from a melta gun yet sometimes (oftentimes) I have to hit people 2-3 times, and sometimes they still get me first. What the hell is the trick to it????? As Seahawk said you need to hit them point blank with it in order to one shot people. The other thing if you have to hit them with the whole blast. Unless they are already damaged, it won't do the trick otherwise. I have found that it just takes practice to get good with it. Also I take the serrated combat knife and if they aren't dead after the melta I knife them to finish them off. (which BTW will 2 hit kill an ASM from full health) Honestly the melta isn't a bad weapon at all though a lot of people bitch about it. It's really short range and that means if you stay out of the danger zone then you can kill the melta gunners easily. The worst weapon by far is the Plasma Cannon. It takes no skill at all to walk around a corner with a shot already charged and lob a blob of plasma with an AOE that is the size of kansas and kill like 5 people. It needs to better reflect how it works in the tabletop, most notably that you should have to stand still to charge it. I also wouldn't mind seeing that splash damage reduced and when it overheats damaging it's user. Other than that, I can't really complain about the MP. I've had a lot of fun and the only times I haven't are when the other team is like 90% ASM. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/238194-space-marine-multiplayer-dissapointed/#findComment-2881865 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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