Close Combat Dreadknigts

[Sir Clausel]

I have seen a lot of people runing DKs as PT, NGS and HI. Which I think is quite nice.

But I have been using them with only PT and NGS. So purely close combat monsters. Or really? Well I wouldnt call them monsters as most times they lose a wound or 2(sometimes die) before getting to combat and cant really deal with that many threats.

 

I find them particially good at killing support sqauds. The Devs/Havocs and so on. Really the units standing in the back and shooting.

 

What I wanna know: Do people use them like this? And what do you guys use DK for generally?

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

I don' t know man, they don't really dish out a lot of CC attacks. Leaving home the ranged weapon cuts their effectiveness in half IMHO.

 

I am planning on running mine with a HI and a PT and that is it. Which is already expensive enough as it is.

[barenone]

I run them like that, i use it and my interceptors to harass dev squads and priority targets. It is amazing in cc with the interceptors. I do however keeps the weapons on even though it makes it expensive the amount of firepower you can lay down before you go cc can put any unit to the grave, Also the weapons help it to take out strategic armor as well making it well worth the cost of extra weapons, in my opinion it does anyway.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I would much rather have an NDK. One well placed template can win games.

 

G :D

[Something Wycked]

My army centers around Interceptors and Dreadknights with the PTHIGS combo you mentioned; they work very nicely as support for each other.

 

If you don't give the DK a ranged weapon, he stands around like a goon during the shooting phase doing nothing productive.

 

I use the DK to weaken anything I'm going to send the Interceptors against and to handle the heavy stuff that the Interceptors would have trouble with.

[Sir Clausel]

Yeah but since no of the weapons is better than AP 4 their shooting attacks aint gonna make that much damage. And you cant shot while you are in combat which you are most of the time.

But I havent thought of runing them allong side Interceptors. That sound like a good idea.

[Archon_77]

I'm somewhat torn here as I do see the benefit of a CC oriented monsterous tank opener that also serves as a good thing to draw fire away from more important (scoring) units BUT my problem with running a DK CC is that it really doesn't mesh as well as a pure shooty DK does with the special abilities of DK's, namely Teleport Shunt. I don't know how many games I have won because I simply had the right unit in the right place at JUST the right time. With a shooty DK, I can move 12", Teleport 30" and THEN OPEN FIRE with a heavy incinerator and a pie plate. If I were to run a pure CC DK, I couldn't do anything after shunting.

What I actually do is run 2 dks, one shooty and one with a NGS and a Heavy Psycannon, thus getting the best of both worlds with one, and an extremely mobile shooting platform with the other.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

With a shooty DK, I can move 12", Teleport 30" and THEN OPEN FIRE with a heavy incinerator and a pie plate.

 

I hope you don't mean you can can do all of that in one turn. You use the shunt instead of moving normally.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

If you outflank an NDK with a PT and HI basically he can blast any squad on the table with his template. It's great for removing an enemy scoring unit tucked away behind terrain. I like to hit multiple enemy tanks in the rear with the template... Works great versus dark eldar skimmer spam.

 

G :D

[The Holy Heretic]

I wouldn't send the NDK after anything infantry in CC. Its simply not killy enough. Where it excels is in taking out the big targets that needs whackin' with a real big stick. The HI however is great for putting pressure on the infantry, while you take out tanks/MCs.

[Sir Clausel]

The thing about outflanking is really nice thinking. I havent thourgt of that. Then it wont take alot of fire before getting into combat. So tjat might be doable.

it may not kill a lot of models per assalut phase but remember it can run units downc and if the unit dont have a hidden pf which most devs and the like dont have its pretty much every combat it wins. Simply because they cant kill it veryy easily.

[Elric the Silvercoat]

The thing about outflanking is really nice thinking. I havent thourgt of that. Then it wont take alot of fire before getting into combat. So tjat might be doable.

it may not kill a lot of models per assalut phase but remember it can run units downc and if the unit dont have a hidden pf which most devs and the like dont have its pretty much every combat it wins. Simply because they cant kill it veryy easily.

Who needs a pf when a 5 LC Termies and Termies Chap can kill it. Well that is what happened to someone I know. The thing didn't get a wound back at the squad. The thing with Dreadknights is that they will be murdered by assaulty units. They don't have enough Toughness or Attacks to kill a unit by themselves but they can tarpit good. If you don't give them a ranged weapons really use them to mop up units, tarpit stuff, and hunt monstrous creatures.

[number6]

I would never run a DK without a shooting weapon upgrade. Rather than teleporter and greatsword, I'd run it teleporter and heavy incinerator. Almost the same points, but WAY more useful in the task the OP posited. (I.e., running down and destroying "support" squads like devastators and long fangs.) Those units are going to be pulped in close combat as it is, with or without a greatsword. But you don't want to pop up in front of them and then invite them to soak you with missiles (or whatever it is they're carrying). Rather, you want to pop up in front of them and then burninate a bunch of them dead right then and there, greatly reducing their ability to hurt you in their turn, and also making them that much more vulnerable to a follow-up assault on your next turn. It would also force the opponent to devote more resources to dealing with your DK than might otherwise be warranted.

 

It's not that anything is wrong with the greatsword. It just isn't as useful as the incinerator for the tactical use that you want. So if points are limited, ditch the greatsword in favor of the incinerator. It's not like a DK isn't scary in assault just because it doesn't have a greatsword. It still is a mighty bad-ass monstrous creature!

[Elric the Silvercoat]

You can always run him with the Hammer. Its cheaper than the Sword and it makes him str 10 he still strikes in Int Order and he will Instant Death anything with Toughness 5 or less without havn't to do a Psyker Test for the Force Weapon.

[thade]

I'm with number6 (and others) here: a purely CC-oriented DK isn't going to inflict as much damage on the opponent's forces as one with a ranged weapon. Keep in mind that as a Monstrous Creature (with Hammerhand to boot) the DK is still going to be vicious in CC, even without a CC weapon upgrade. The ranged weapon means even if he can't close in combat this turn he'll still be able to hit something very hard.

[Gentlemanloser]

Rather, you want to pop up in front of them and then burninate a bunch of them dead right then and there, greatly reducing their ability to hurt you in their turn

 

Thing is, do you *really* need the Incinerator for that? If you're charging them anyway, then they can't shoot you in thier turn. They'll either be dead from your assault, or still in assault with you.

 

That being said I *hate* the fact we're incouraged to wate the MCs ability to use two shooting weapons and am starting to think that maybe the Psilencer could be quite useful on a NDK.

 

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself, so why not give it a squads worth of Storm Bolter shots? And if you're going that route, then why not couple that with a Heavy Incinerator and make the NDK more gun line, with it's inhernatly potent MC prowess in CC as base (Power Weapon and 2d6 Penetration for nothing!).

[thade]

That being said I *hate* the fact we're incouraged to wate the MCs ability to use two shooting weapons and am starting to think that maybe the Psilencer could be quite useful on a NDK.

 

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself, so why not give it a squads worth of Storm Bolter shots?

I share these thoughts. I like the idea of the NDK having a large volume of pre-charge shooting. The fact that it would make short work of the occasional demon prince is just the frosting. <3

[Elric the Silvercoat]

That being said I *hate* the fact we're incouraged to wate the MCs ability to use two shooting weapons and am starting to think that maybe the Psilencer could be quite useful on a NDK.

 

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself, so why not give it a squads worth of Storm Bolter shots?

I share these thoughts. I like the idea of the NDK having a large volume of pre-charge shooting. The fact that it would make short work of the occasional demon prince is just the frosting. <3

And why not add the Daemon Hammer to it aswell (I think its only 10 points).

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself, so why not give it a squads worth of Storm Bolter shots?

 

Eh???

 

It is more than a squad of GKTs, points-wise. And now you are advocating throwing on even more points?

 

NDKs are not the most points-efficient things in the world... they are already very pricey with a PT and an HI. Sure, it would be fun to roast a unit and shoot it with that silly psilencer, but I don't think that'd be a great use of points.

[Sir Clausel]

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself, so why not give it a squads worth of Storm Bolter shots? And if you're going that route, then why not couple that with a Heavy Incinerator and make the NDK more gun line, with it's inhernatly potent MC prowess in CC as base (Power Weapon and 2d6 Penetration for nothing!).

 

At my 2k list I run 2 DKs with PT and NGS which move quickly forward and try to engage support units. 1 DK with GP and HI which try to move up midfield and lay fire down on the opponent. Which Im thinking is quite effective.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The Gatling psilencer is not worth the points. As Fred said the NDK already costs a lot with the PT and HI.

 

G ^_^

[Gentlemanloser]

It is more than a squad of GKTs, points-wise.

 

-_-

 

4 x GKT

 

160 Points.

4 x T4, 2+ Save Wounds

8 x S4 Shots

8 x S4 CC Attacks

 

1 x NDK with Gattling Psilencer

 

165 Points.

4 x T6, 2+ Save Wounds

12 x S4 Shots

4 x S6 CC Attacks

 

1 Terminator down from a 'squad', the NDK is quite comparable to a squad of GKT. It has half the CC attacks, but at a higher S with 2d6 Penetration naturally. With a Gattling Psilencer, it has more SB shots than a Squad of GKT. With T6, it's more durable than an equivalent amount of GKT, and doesn't lose prowess when it takes wounds.

 

Without the hideously expensive PT, it's just as fast as a squad of GKT as well.

[Elric the Silvercoat]

It is more than a squad of GKTs, points-wise.

 

-_-

 

4 x GKT

 

160 Points.

4 x T4, 2+ Save Wounds

8 x S4 Shots

8 x S4 CC Attacks

 

1 x NDK with Gattling Psilencer

 

165 Points.

4 x T6, 2+ Save Wounds

12 x S4 Shots

4 x S6 CC Attacks

 

1 Terminator down from a 'squad', the NDK is quite comparable to a squad of GKT. It has half the CC attacks, but at a higher S with 2d6 Penetration naturally. With a Gattling Psilencer, it has more SB shots than a Squad of GKT. With T6, it's more durable than an equivalent amount of GKT, and doesn't lose prowess when it takes wounds.

 

Without the hideously expensive PT, it's just as fast as a squad of GKT as well.

And that isn't even making the GKT a legal squad and not getting upgrades for them.

[Gentlemanloser]

It's nearly a squad of GK Terminators in itself

 

Nearly, as in 4 out of 5...

 

And if you buy a Psycannon for them, you've just given more points to spend on the NDK...

[nurglez]

I use 2 DK's, 1 with PT, HI and GS and the other with PT and HI (only because I made him with just his fists and I'm keeping him that way -_- ).

 

Yes, a dedicated assault unit will wipe out a DK. but how many dedicated assault units should be able to reach him? I sometimes out flank them, or normal reserve them, and then when they come on, they "can" shunt if they want, or they can just walk on. Don't pick a fight with anything that can beat you, and you should do fine :D (although, I have had my dk take a charge from a 6-7 strong chaplain led death company and survive it.

 

I often use my DK's to reach the vehicles my psycannon's cant. and a str 6 cover ignoring weapon is awesome, I would never take a second weapon, as due to wound allocation it will mess it up (my 2 dk's pack 2 out of 3 cover ignoring weapons in my army, the 3rd is Draigo's sanctified flame, that doesn't even have an ap....).