Starting 40K

[Kulgan]

Hello everyone, I'm a Fantasy player and I'm looking into starting with 40K. I have very limited experience playing 40K ( two battles with a Black Templar/Grey Knight force and one with Blood Angels )

I can buy the Black Templar force for a very cheap price but I'm not sure I want to play with them. I was looking at the different armies on the GW site and the Space Wolves caught my eye. I also like the grey colour schemes a lot !

 

My question is; how do Space Wolves play in warhammer battles? What are their strong/weak points. How do they differ from standard space marines?

 

And a very specific question : are the Wolves ( doggies ) any good? Because I actually have some painted Wolves from a WH Fantasy army ( the ork and goblin wolf rider wolves )

 

Many thanks for answering, and hopefully granting me some insight in the Space Wolves.

 

 

Kulgan

[clanfield]

HI AND WELCOME

 

the wolves play as a close support force rapid fire and assult or counter assult ,we dont lack long range wepons but things rack up that way

if you like the color thats a big start funny enough thats why i painted my first squad many many moons ago, are the wolves the best i think so not only are we the closest you can get to heros in 40k were also very good at what we do with excellent background material ecxellent conversion and painting options to down right bad ass space vikings who enjoy ale and elk ..cooking the elk is a option

 

your obvously atracted to the chapter but take your time and read some stuff check out lexicum and read some of our history or acquire battle of the fang or any of the ragnar books for a read by the ice bears left...er claw

 

hope this helps

[hendrik]

welcome to the fang whelp have an ale while i tell you something about the wolves.

 

flufwise we're very different from any other astartes! not only do we actually care about the average guy(sallies do this too) but our bodies are also superior to them! the wolves have got far superior smell and eyesight too i believe when compared to other marines. add to this the canis helix what makes us immune to chaos (as widely accepted) and you can definetly see why the wolves are so different from any other chapter.

 

gamewise we've got some of the besst troop choices available, as well as excellent heavy support in the form of long fangs. but that's not all offcourse! we've got other nice units such as lone wolves, fenrisian wolf packs(so you can actually field a pack of those goblin wolves),etc,etc. not to mention we can get up to 4 HQ's. don't expect any fnp though(unless you field a lone wolf).

 

anyway, i'm not the person you should ask about gaming since i still seem to lose every fight with my wolves :rolleyes:

[Wulfebane]

Read these:

 

BnC Space Wolves FAQ

 

Space Wolves blog

[red_starrise]

From firsthand experience playing Wolves & vanilla marines what Wolves do well is denial.

 

Simply put, Grey Hunters hold the line extremely well & are excellent for keeping objectives. Blood Claws being a troops choice are unruly, at best, but yet when used right, are excellent at knocking occupying forces off of objectives & then holding them or yielding them to Grey Hunters to hold.

 

Between Blood Claws, Thunderwolves & Grey Hunters the Space Wolves are just great at denying objectives to enemies. They are also excellent at the 24" game, however, they do get a bit eclipsed at this by Grey Knights.

[Grimtooth]

From firsthand experience playing Wolves & vanilla marines what Wolves do well is denial.

 

Simply put, Grey Hunters hold the line extremely well & are excellent for keeping objectives. Blood Claws being a troops choice are unruly, at best, but yet when used right, are excellent at knocking occupying forces off of objectives & then holding them or yielding them to Grey Hunters to hold.

 

Between Blood Claws, Thunderwolves & Grey Hunters the Space Wolves are just great at denying objectives to enemies. They are also excellent at the 24" game, however, they do get a bit eclipsed at this by Grey Knights.

 

One point I agree with the above, is that when Blood Claws are used, they really shine as a smoke'em and find the next target. They are NOT a unit to camp an objective for a turn as their strength lies in the first round of combat that they charge a unit. That being known, don't let them get stuck in for more then just a couple of turns. Give them support of a Wolf Priest and a WGPL, and just let them raise hell.

 

This is more of in lists that you want to have fun and enjoy the ruckus that Blood Claws can create outside of a competitive tournament scene.

[Kulgan]

Thank you all for the answers. I'm still having a hard time deciding to start SW's or another 40K army. ( Grey Knights or Black Templars are the other candidates so far )

 

If I may very briefly summarize what seems to be the strongpoints of the army, and/or what I like to build to:

 

 

* Longfangs with missile launchers ( I really really like missile launchers! )

 

* 10 men Tactical squads with the wolf standard, a meltagun for armour and what else? Mark of wulfen worth it?

 

* A basic predator ( is keeping this cheap wise? )

 

* Cheap transports for troops - do you use multiple tactical squads all in Rhino's ?

 

* Wolf pack ( I have painted wolves, so this is a no brainer even if they're not worth the points )

 

* Skyclaw assault pack with a Wolf Guard attached to provide more frost/power weapon attacks? I seem to be judging their mobilty highly.

 

* Close combat dreadnought, equipped with heavy flamer and twin-linked heavy flamer : I figure melta gun in the tactical squads, missiles from the longfangs and then flamers in the dreadnought to form a decent all round fire base ?

 

* Do you add a wolfguard with a stormshield to a unit of longfangs, to take those AP 3 and better hits?

 

* How to field and use scouts in a good manner? ( I think more assault based because of their slightly different stats when compared to regular SM scouts )

 

 

Once again my deepest thank you for whomever will answer my noob questions.

 

 

Kulgan

[red_starrise]

If I may very briefly summarize what seems to be the strongpoints of the army, and/or what I like to build to:

 

* Longfangs with missile launchers ( I really really like missile launchers! )

 

A good unit, but I personally prefer to mix them up w/ more than JUST missile launchers, but that's my personal tastes

 

* 10 men Tactical squads with the wolf standard, a meltagun for armour and what else? Mark of wulfen worth it?

 

Well, this will depend on what you want them to accomplish. 10 Grey Hunters w/ 2 meltaguns, a power fist, wolf standard & mark of the wulfen are pretty good against armor, but I prefer 8 grey hunters, 1 melta, a power fist, a wolf guard w/ combi-melta & power fist, wolf standard & mark all in a rhino.

 

* A basic predator ( is keeping this cheap wise? )

 

So-so. Space Wolves don't lack in anti-infantry guns, usually either an annihalator (all lascannons) or a mix of autocannons & lascannons is better for wolves, at least I've found. But then, so are vindicators.

 

* Cheap transports for troops - do you use multiple tactical squads all in Rhino's ?

 

In my lists, all my squads, save for my mass of Blood Claws, are mounted, either in razorbacks or rhinos (I usually run a pair of rhinos & a trio of razors at 2500 pts including long fang transport).

 

* Wolf pack ( I have painted wolves, so this is a no brainer even if they're not worth the points )

 

Wolves are very specialized & unless you're taking them w/ a wolf lord or to run along w/ thunderwolves they're so-so at best but if you really want them, by all means.

 

* Skyclaw assault pack with a Wolf Guard attached to provide more frost/power weapon attacks? I seem to be judging their mobilty highly.

 

Pretty sure a wolf guard can't lead these guys, they have to have an independent HQ character lead them. Keep in mind, they're not assault marines for several reasons: 1- they have WS & BS of 3, so think scouts w/ jump packs & power armor. 2- they will not shoot if they're too close to an enemy unless lead by an HQ as they HAVE to charge if they can unless reined in. 3- their special rules make them more dangerous on the charge than an assault squad, but they don't hold up as well in later rounds.

 

* Close combat dreadnought, equipped with heavy flamer and twin-linked heavy flamer : I figure melta gun in the tactical squads, missiles from the longfangs and then flamers in the dreadnought to form a decent all round fire base ?

 

That's an ok choice but unless you drop pod it, odds are it will never see combat & if you do elect to drop pod then I'd prefer a multi-melta for the ability to slag armor.

 

* Do you add a wolfguard with a stormshield to a unit of longfangs, to take those AP 3 and better hits?

 

It depends on the game, alot of times I'll lead my AT pack w/ a TDA wolf guard w/ storm shield.

 

* How to field and use scouts in a good manner? ( I think more assault based because of their slightly different stats when compared to regular SM scouts )

 

That's a hotly debated topic around here. Alot of people swear by using them as a suicide squad w/ a melta gun. I've used them in several configurations, but I do like them as snipers as well because they are BS4, only Ratlings are BS4 & they sure can't take a charge the way SW scouts can.

 

I hope I've been a little bit helpful. Also, look around, there's lots of FAQs & tactica articles if you look for them. I'm sure you'll find useful info in those as well.

[Wulfebane]

Correct, WG cannot join Skyclaws, only Blood Claws and Swiftclaw Bikers.

 

 

I love my scout snipers. Like red_starrise says, nearly everyone considers scouts as suicide squads and throw-away units. I think this is absurd.

 

Wolf Scouts are the veterans of our army (alongside Long Fangs and Dreads), not some fresh-from-training recruits that have yet to go through the Blooding.

 

Our Blood Claws are the recruits, and their statline demonstrates that, but that in no way makes them a throw-away unit. For one, their points cost is too high for that, and two, when used correctly, can decimate the enemy.

 

 

@Kulgan - once again, I highly recommend that you read http://space-wolves-grey.blogspot.com/

 

It has compiled at least 3 different tactical uses for each codex entry on Space Wolf units. Some of the questions that you posed today leave me to believe that you didn't bother.

[arizonajirt]

So, If Wolf Guard can not join Sky Claws, then really what is the point of them being able to take jump packs? I can put wolf guard on a bike and lead swift claws, but why not sky claws?

[Kulgan]

Again thanks for the answers. And I did spend roughly 4-5 hours reading through the entire forum, looking for general ' knowledge ' topics, topics with plenty of replies meaning meaningfull discussion, I went through entire pages of links with reports, blogs, tips hints. But you should know it's insanely difficult to absord all this information in a single day if you are starting with so little background information. In every blog when people describe their builds I spend 10 minutes per sentence trying to figure out what TDA ( still don't know where the D comes from ) means.

 

You are correct saying I did not read everything yet, includeing the link you shared, but I'm going to. I'm just not planning on reading every single bit of SW tactica ( I do have a job/life ) before asking questions.

 

 

 

Kulgan

[Kulgan]

Space Wolves blog

 

=> I'm reading this right now and I must say it's a great read. Both in readability as well as the actual information inside it's an A++ article(s)

[Wulfebane]

Space Wolves blog

 

=> I'm reading this right now and I must say it's a great read. Both in readability as well as the actual information inside it's an A++ article(s)

 

 

-____-

 

 

Atleast you're reading it! =P To be honest, when I started back up from an 8 year hiatus, that blog saved me a lot of rules/tactical frustration.

 

TDA = Tactical Dreadnought Armour. No idea when or why it started being called 'Terminator' armor.. aside from the obvious bada$$ery.

[CainTheHunter]

So, If Wolf Guard can not join Sky Claws, then really what is the point of them being able to take jump packs? I can put wolf guard on a bike and lead swift claws, but why not sky claws?

 

If You are feeling lucky and adventurous, You can take a whole pack of jump pack Wolf Guards and pretend them being Vanguard Vets at insanely high points cost :).

[Wulfebane]

So, If Wolf Guard can not join Sky Claws, then really what is the point of them being able to take jump packs? I can put wolf guard on a bike and lead swift claws, but why not sky claws?

 

If You are feeling lucky and adventurous, You can take a whole pack of them and pretend them being Vanguard Vets at insanely high points cost :).

 

By 'them' I think he means a whole pack of WG with jump packs.

 

As to the WHY, I can only speculate, but I would think it'd be due to the Skyclaws being the only BC unit able to take a MotW model. I don't know if removing the option of 2x MotW models in a single unit somehow balances out that particular BC pack (especially since WG can join Scouts and GH packs, both of which can take MotW), but that would be my guess.

[CainTheHunter]

By 'them' I think he means a whole pack of WG with jump packs.

 

Indeed! I will rectify my previous post for sake of clarity :)