*Furyou Miko Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 These were put together with the idea of creating a group of units to take the roles of different FoC slots, much the same way that the Grey Knights codex gained a slew of new types of Grey Knight (Purifier, Purgator, Paladin...), although Heavy Support proved difficult to fill. I therefore offer: Two Elites, one Troops, and two Fast Attack choices for Codex: Sisters of Battle. I will admit, however, that Ramielim exist solely to provide a reason to keep all those Storm Bolter armed Sisters from the old squad box! Oh, and another Hospitaller profile, based off James Swallow's Hammer and Anvil. Wargear San Leor Blade: The traditional weapon of the original Daughters of the Emperor, every Sister owns a San Leor blade... but only those who have special talent, or have foresworn the trappings of the modern Sisterhood still wield them in battle. A San Leor blade is a Master-Crafted Close Combat Weapon that grants the wielder +1 Strength if they do not handle another weapon. Longbow: An ancient weapon, and in the hands of a properly trained Daughter of the Emperor, still lethal. A Longbow is a two-handed ranged weapon with the following profile: Rng: 30" S: 3 AP: 6 Rapid Fire Some Longbows may be loaded with 'Condemnor' power-stakes, changing their profile accordingly: Rng: 30" S: 5 AP: 6 Rapid Fire, Psi-shock Adjudicator Boltgun: A field-applicable modification to the standard bolter, the addition of an M.40 Targetting System and Stalker shells turns this traditional side-arm into an effective, if cumbersome, sniper rifle. An Adjudicator Boltgun is a two-handed ranged weapon with the following profile: Rng 30" S4 AP5 Heavy 1, Sniper Chainstaves: Double-ended chainsaws with adamantium teeth, a Chainstave counts as two Rending Close Combat Weapons that grant the bearer a +1 bonus to their Strength score. If the weapon Rends, roll 1d6 instead of 1d3 additional armour penetration. Valetudinarian Gauntlet: A Valetudinarian Gauntlet is a Rending Close Combat Weapon. Hymnal of Trust: This honoured tome calls upon the eternal guardian spirit of the Emperor. A unit carrying the Hymnal of Trust improves its Shield of Faith save to 4+. Hymnal of Martyrdom: The Hymnal of Martyrdom contains chants and battle-prayers that steel the wielder against Chaos. A unit that includes a model carrying the Hymnal of Martyrdom may ignore any ability that requires a Psychic Test to activate on a roll of 5+. Aspiriate Cloak: These adamantine mantles are created after the design of the honoured relic of St Aspira, who stood before a thousand Traitor Guard and marched into the valley of death to decapitate their Commander. The Aspiriate Cloak improves the armour save of the wearer by 1. Imperial Plate: This heavy, archaic chainmail-and-plate composite armour grants the wearer a 5+ save. Narthecium: A model carrying a Narthecium grants her unit Feel no Pain. Inferno Grenades: These firebombs are used to saturate the area before a unit with flames to prevent them being easily assaulted. They count as Defensive Grenades. Hospitaller/Lelahelim Lelahelim 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 8 3+ The Lelahelim stand apart from those Sisters Non-Militant of the Orders Hospitaller from where they hail. Though they rise from the ranks of the Hospitallers, they have found a second calling in the Emperor's sight. They are his angels of mercy, bringing death to those who desire it and giving life to those who deserve it. Hospitaller/Lehalim {Unit Attachment}..........20 Points Infantry 1 Lehalim Bolt Pistol Close Combat Weapon Narthecium Power Armour Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Feel no Pain Options: The Lehalim may exchange her Close Combat Weapon and/or Bolt Pistol for one of the following:Bolter: free Valetudinarian Gauntlet: 3 points Ophelian Choir/Pahalim Pahalim Superior 3 4 3 3 2 4 2 9 2+/3++ Pahalim 3 4 3 3(4) 2 3 1 8 2+/3++ The Pahalim are the guardians of the Sororitas. Nicknamed 'Ophelians' because it is so rare to see them away from their home on Ophelia VII, they stand guard with storm shield and bolter against the darkness. Pahalim are born, not trained, and only those who show unwavering fortitude and resilience are inducted into their number. They are marked out by their Aspiriate cloaks and blazing storm shields, and it is said that when battle is upon them their armour blazes with the power of their belief, turning aside weapons that would slay an Astartes outright. Pahalim{Elites}..........125 Points Infantry 1 Pahalim Superior 4 Pahalim Bolter Storm Shield Aspiriate Cloak Krak grenades Inferno Grenades Power Armour Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Mantle of Ophelia Immolator Venator Rhino Repressor Options May be joined by up to 5 additional Pahalim: 23 points/model May be joined by a Hospitaller: 20 points Any model may swap her Bolter for:A Chainsword: Free A Bolt Pistol: Free A Hand Flamer: 2 points [*]One model may carry a Simulacrum Imperialis: 20 point [*]Up to one in every five models may take: Storm Bolter: 3 points Flamer: 5 points Meltagun or Inferno Pistol: 10 points [*]The Pahalim Superior may replace her Boltgun for: Storm Bolter: 3 points Power Sword or Combi-Flamer, Combi-melta or Combi-plasma: 10 points Condemnor Boltgun or Plasma pistol: 15 points Mantle of Ophelia: This Act of Faith is used in the Movement Phase. Unlike most Acts of Faith, it lasts until the end of the player's next Movement Phase. The unit ignores any attacks from weapons whose Strength is 6 or above. Ascetic Choir/Mehabelim Mehabelim Superior 4 4 3 3 1 4 3 10 5+ Mehabelim 4 4 3 3 1 4 2 9 5+ Within the Orders of the Adepta Sororitas there are those who believe that the only way to expunge the stain upon their souls incurred by Vandire is to return to their origins on San Leor in their entirety. These are the Mehabelim, who have forsworn the usage of Imperial weapons and doctrine. They fight as the Daughters of the Emperor once fought, with blade and bow, clad in simple mail. Their faith is all the purer for their sacrifice. Aescetics/Mehabelim {Elites}..........80 Points Infantry 1 Mehabelim Superior 4 Mehabelim San Leor Blade Longbow Imperial Plate Hymnal of Trust (Mehabelim Superior only) Pure Faith Acts of Faith Shield of Faith Relentless Sacrificial Purity Options: The unit may include up to 15 additional Mehabelim: 14 points/model Up to one in every five models may take Condemnor stake ammunition: 5 points One model may carry a Simulacrum Imperialis: 20 point Pure Faith: Such is the example and purity of these ascetic Sororitas that they inspire those around them to greater acts of heroism. All units with a model within 6” of the Mehabelim choir gain a +1 bonus to activating Acts of Faith. Sacrificial Purity: A life of hardship and self-denial in Sisterhood spurs the faithful to everlasting glory. This Act of Faith is used in the Assault phase. Every model in the unit gains +1 to their Strength score for every casualty the unit has suffered (To a maximum of S10). If the unit has suffered ten or more casualties, their attacks also count as Power Weapons. Initiate Choir/Afrielim Erelim Superior 3 4 3 3 1 3 2 9 3+ Afrielim 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 7 3+ While not as individually powerful as an Astartes Scout, the initiates of the Adepta Sororitas are invariably better equipped. Because they do not have to wait for a Black Carapace implant to mature, Sisterhood initiates can be equipped with power armour from the beginning of their careers. There are records of Sisters as young as fourteen serving on the battlefield, although in general the Sororitas prefer to protect their initiates until they are ready for frontline duty. In times of great need, however, the Initiates are formed into Afrielim squads, armed with Adjudicator pattern bolters and led into battle by veteran Sisters Militant. Afrielim {Troops}..........110 Points Unit Type 1 Erelim Superior 9 Afrielim Adjudicator Boltgun Frag Grenades Krak Grenades Power Armour Rosarius (Erelim Superior only) Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Eternal Hope Rhino Repressor Options The squad may be joined by up to 10 additional Afrielim: 10 Points/model The squad may be joined by a Hospitaller One model may carry a Simulacrum Imperialis: 20 point Any Afrielim may swap her Adjudicator Boltgun for:A Bolter: Free A Bolt Pistol and Close Combat weapon: Free [*]Up to one in every ten models may take a Special Weapon: Storm Bolter: 3 points Hand Flamer or Flamer: 5 points Meltagun: 10 points. [*]Up to one in every ten models may take a Heavy Weapon: Heavy Bolter: 5 points Multi-Melta: 10 points Heavy Flamer: 20 points The Erelim Superior may replace her Adjudicator Boltgun for: Storm Bolter: 3 points Power Sword or Combi-Flamer, Combi-melta or Combi-plasma: 10 points Condemnor Boltgun or Plasma pistol: 15 points Eviscerator and Bolt Pistol: 25 points Eternal Hope: This Act of Faith is used in the Movement Phase. Unlike most Acts of Faith, it lasts until the start of the player's next Movement Phase. The unit gains Regeneration (4+). Strike Choir/Israfim Israfim Superior 4 3 3 3 1 4 2 9 3+ Israfim 4 3 3 3 1 4 1 8 3+ Canoness Minoris Severine of the Order of the Ebon Chalice was the first to equip Sisters Militant with the Eviscerators of fallen Repentia during the desperate Battle of Frater Signum. The Orkish dreadnoughts were proving resilient to the Sisters' bolters and meltagun, leading to the loss of many brave Sororitas to their assorted blades and crude weapons. The weapons of the Israfim have since been refined, but the tactics of engaging high-value enemy targets at knife range have not. Israfim {Fast Attack}..........110 Points Infantry 1 Israfim Superior 5 Israfim Bolt Pistol Chainstave Krak Grenades Frag Grenades Power Armour Hymnal of Martyrdom (Israfim Superior only) Acts of Faith Deathbringer Assault Shield of Faith Immolator Rhino Repressor Venator Options: The unit may include up to 5 additional Israfim: 17 points/model The unit may be joined by a Hospitaller: 20 points One Israfim in every five may take a weapon from the following list:Storm Bolter: 3 points Flamer: 5 points Meltagun: 10 points [*]One model may carry a Simulacrum Imperialis: 20 point [*]The Israfim Superior may replace her Chainstave for: Power Weapon or Inferno Pistol: 10 points [*]The Israfim Superior may take Inferno Bolts: 5 points Deathbringer Assault: This Act of Faith is used in the Assault phase. The Israfim's attacks cause Instant Death. Storm Choir/Ramielim Ramielim Superior 3 4 3 3 1 4 2 10 3+ Ramielim 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 9 3+ The Ramielim bring the fury of the Emperor's thunder down upon their foes. Highly mobile, they pour a steady rain of bolt shells down upon their foes until all that remains is a smouldering wreck as their high-explosive ammunition conveys the Emperor's wrath. Ramielim{Fast Attack}.......... 110 Points Infantry 1 Ramielim Superior 4 Ramielim Storm Bolter Bolt Pistol Krak grenades Frag Grenades Power Armour Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Divine Punishment Rain of Death Immolator Venator Rhino Repressor Options May be joined by up to 5 additional Ramielim: 15 points/model May be joined by a Hospitaller: 20 points One model may carry a Simulacrum Imperialis: 20 point Any model may swap her Storm Bolter for:A Bolt Pistol: Free A Combi-Flamer, Combi-Melta or Combi-bolter: 10 points A Condemnor Boltgun: 15 points [*]The Ramielim Superior may exchange her Bolt Pistol for: A Power Weapon: 10 points A Plasma Pistol: 15 points Divine Punishment: This Act of Faith is used in the Shooting phase. Any unit that must make a Leadership check of any sort due to shooting from the Ramielim must do so at a -3 penalty. Rain of Death: Such is the intensity of a Ramielim barrage that any unit that suffers at least one wound from their shooting must make a Pinning check. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 The Sororitas Plate used by Mehabelim needs defining in the wargear section. Judging by the statline, it's armor with a 5+ save, but making that a bit clearer would be good. They also need some indication of how many additional sisters can be added to the squad and what upgrades they can take. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2893457 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 Ok, fixed that... what do you think of the units themselves? concept-wise, implementation-wise, etc... also, not sure on the pricing for most of them, hence the blank spaces. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2893503 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 Fun units, work well in the context of the WD dwarf 'dex, although I'm not especially partial to that 'dex :P Couple of thoughts; for the Pahalim, the act of faith allowing them to ignore strong hits, but not lesser hits just feels kinda off, considering how it might feel in gameplay (Plasma? That's nothing! OhcrapLasgunsrun!). Maybe have 'em be unable to be wounded on a roll better than a 4+? On Afrielim, probably worth defining the stats of the Stalker Boltgun; the version in the marine 'dex (which is only used by a special character) is 36" Rending, Pinning, Heavy 2, which seems kinda powerful for a weapon that's only given to initiates. Maybe drop the Rending, or drop it down to Heavy 1? Like the idea of Ramielem, they sound pretty fun. Keep in mind that since Rain of Death can be triggered by a single wound, that the unit should probably have a relatively high initial cost, but relatively cheap additional models. The Hospitaler stuff is interesting, I assume the Gauntlet is from Hammer and Anvil? Might be worth relegating the Gauntlet to being an upgrade, though, since it doesn't seem to be standard wargear for every Hospitaler. On the note of Venators; you could probably keep some of the more Mechanicumy things (apart from perhaps Servitors) in the default options for a Sister's Venator by mentioning its often crewed by a member of an Order Pronatus, who seemed to be tasked with collecting/maintaining tech relics for the Eccleisarchy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2893515 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 I agree with Tibby that the Pahalim's Act of Faith seems a bit odd, for much the same reason he mentioned. For cost, I would say low/mid twenties per model; they might be massively durable, but they don't have a huge amount of hitting power. The Mehabelim should probably have their crossbows switched to assault weapons; the condemner portion of the combi-weapon in Codex:GK is assault, and a single-shot 24" Heavy Strength 3 shot is pretty close to worthless. Not to mention that a heavy weapon seems like an odd choice for a unit whose AoF is really geared towards close combat. Giving all of the Initiates Stlakter-Pattern bolters seems a bit off; the stalker-pattern is supposed to be for expert markswomen, after all. Like Tibby said, stats will matter too. Ramielim seem a little light on shooting upgrades for a shooting specialist squad. I'd also say the combi-weapons (including condemner) should come down in price, to account for the fact that they're replacing storm bolters. Also, I can't help but notice the general lack of upgrades options for superiors; only Ramielim have them. That probably need correcting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2893549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 The Pahalim were designed that way deliberately, actually - They shrug off heavy fire and special stuff, but their vulnerability is to the common man, the every-day hero. Unit leader upgrades I hadn't really thought about. The new codex doesn't really give many options. How does this sound (in reverse order): Israfim Superior can swap Chainstave for Power Weapon or Hand Flamer, and can take Inferno Bolts. Erelim Superior (for the Afrielim) can take the standard Battle sister Superior upgrades. Mehabelim Superior gets no upgrades. That's kind of the point of the unit. No fancy toys. Regarding the crossbows - I can't justify them being Assault weapons. They're neither rapid-firing nor indiscriminate. They are, in fact, fairly crap in a world of guns. How about if I changed Sacrificial Purity to affect ranged weapons as well (+1 Str and AP1 at 10 casualties)? Pahalim Superior should be fine with the standard Codex Sister Superior upgrades too... How many points do you think for the Valetudinarian Gauntlet, then? Regarding Stalker Boltguns, I'd say this profile is suitable? Rng 30" S4 AP5 Heavy 1 Sniper since they're basically modified Bolters, they should retain the S and AP, I think, but the range and accuracy are improved, so +6" and Sniper. Edit: Put up preliminary points costs and Upgrades as above. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2893785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 How many points do you think for the Valetudinarian Gauntlet, then?You could probably get away with making it a 2 or 3 point upgrade (there's some precedent for non-multiple-of-five-points upgrades in theHenchmen unit) - it isn't exactly overwhelming on the squad medic!Regarding Stalker Boltguns, I'd say this profile is suitable? Rng 30" S4 AP5 Heavy 1 Sniper Looks pretty good, maybe tweak the name to something sisters-y, since it's now a fairly distinct weapon? Adjudicator Boltgun, maybe (I see the phrase 'Adjudication of God" every now and then). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2894270 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 7, 2011 Author Share Posted October 7, 2011 Adjudication is a fancy wy of saying Judgement. Hm. Works. 3 points, then, for the VG? Same as Bolter to Storm Bolter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2894476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 Another New Unit for the list; Daemonifuge Choir/Nurielim Wardmistress 4 4 3 3 1 3 3 10 3+ Nurielim 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 9 3+ The Nurielim are in fact a tiny Order in their own right. They were created and trained in secret by Ephrael Stern, hidden from the prying eyes of the misguided Ordo Malleus who believe them to be daemonkin. They appear in times of need, guided by the witchery of the Black Library they call home. They are more than mere Sororitas – they are Daemonifuge. Nurielim{Elites}.......... 105 Points Infantry 1 Wardmistress 4 Nurielim Chainsword Bolter Krak grenades Frag Grenades Power Armour Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Aura of Faith Lightning Purge Immolator Venator Rhino Repressor Options May be joined by up to 5 additional Nurielim: 20 points/model May be joined by a Hospitaller: 20 points The entire unit may exchange their Chainswords and Bolters for a Jump Pack and two Bolt Pistols (Count as twin-linked for shooting) for: 60 points. Any model may swap her Bolter for:Bolt Pistol Two models in every five may exchange a Chainsword or Bolt Pistol for:A hand flamer or Storm Bolter: 3 points A flamer: 5 points A Power Weapon or Meltagun: 10 points [*]The Wardmistress may exchange her Bolter and/or Chainsword for: A Power Weapon: 10 points A Plasma Pistol or Inferno Pistol: 15 points An Eviscerator: 25 points Lightning Purge: This Act of Faith is used in the Shooting phase instead of firing any weapons. Roll a d6 to determine the number of enemy units hit, starting with the closest to a maximum range of 18”. If the dice roll is higher than the number of enemy units in range, the additional shots are wasted. Each enemy unit hit takes 2d6 S2 hits. If the target unit has aligned to Chaos, the hits are at S4. If the target unit is a Daemon, the hits are S6. Aura of Faith: See Codex: Grey Knights. In addition, this ability affects the Armour Saves of models with a Chaos Mark. One Nurielim squad in the army may upgrade their Wardmistress to Ephrael Stern: Ephrael Stern Ephrael 7 5 3 3 2 6 3 10 3+ Ephrael Stern was special even before she encountered the Keeper of Secrets Asteroth. Now the vessel for the collected knowledge of the Order of the Blessed Enquiry she knows everything there is to know about the daemons of slaanesh – including how to combat them. Granted special powers by this knowledge, she was hunted by the Ordo Malleus as a witch until after her second death she escaped to the Eldar's Black Library, where she turned her knowledge to good use. While she fled, she encountered heretics, seccesionists and the worst filth of the Chaos Space Marines, even spending some time in the gladiatorial pits of Commoragh's Wych cults - much to the disgust of the Archons whose Succubi she defeated. Ephrael Stern.......... 105 Points Jump Infantry (Unique) Power Sword 2 Bolt Pistols Krak grenades Frag Grenades Power Armour Jump Pack Shield of Faith Acts of Faith Aura of Faith Seraphim Pistols Melee Dodge Lightning Purge The Passion Webway Slip Options Ephrael's squad may be made an HQ choice, making Nurielim squads Troops: 20 points Ephrael's squad must exchange their Chainsword and Bolter for a Jump Pack and two Bolt Pistols for: 50 points Ephrael may exchange her Power Sword for an Impaler (See Codex: Dark Eldar): free Melee Dodge: Such is Ephrael's combat experience and agility that she can evade even the swiftest strikes. Her invulnerable save is increased to 4+ in close combat. The Passion: See Codex: Sisters of Battle Aura of Faith: See Codex: Grey Knights. In addition, this ability affects the Armour Saves of models with a Chaos Mark. Webway Slip: This Act of Faith may be used at the start of the Movement phase. Remove Ephrael's unit from play and place them in Reserve. They arrive automatically at the start of the player's next turn by Deep Striking, though they never suffer a Mishap, instead moving the minimum distance required to avoid the terrain, unit or board edge. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2910228 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekLee688 Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Crossbows should be heavy 1 for the amount of trouble they are to reload. A power armored soldier could reduce this, if it is a fancy mechanus crossbow + power armor + non initiate sister I could see it being assault 1. What makes a S:3 cross bow with one shot worth having? I like the thought of it shooting power weapon like projectiles. A bolter shoots fist sized rockets, a grim dark epic crossbow would shoot a 3 foot long powered bolt. Heavy crossbow: S:3 AP:6 Range 12" Heavy 1 <-- given to initiates "insert fancy name" better crossbow: S:3 AP:6 Range 12" Assault 1-2 (I'm picturing a double cross bow with gears and stuff) only given to PA vets Ammo upgrade: "powered bolts"- ignore armor saves The units I see this being equipped to are a cheap squad that can actually shoot units to death, what sniper scouts aren't, and a sternguard like veteran close combat unit that shoots powered bolts and carries rending chainswords. They would be deadly, protected by 3+ save, and faith etc. but still be just S:3 and T:3. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2910338 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 >> I'm starting to regret giving Mehabelim crossbows at all. They are a squad who has foresworn advanced equipment that wasn't available to the Sisters before Vandire came to San Leor. The whole point is that they do awesome things with crap gear. Maybe I should just swap them to have longbows. Yes. Yes, that's exactly what I will do. It's a bit Japanese, but so is my name. Longbows are 30" S3 AP6 Rapid Fire, but since Mehabelim get no heavy weapons, they are now relentless so they can still charge. What do you think of everything else? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2910376 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 Coupla thoughts on Stern/Nurielim; Isn't Stern a psyker? (Not sure on this one, I've read some reference to it, but I don't know if it was reliable. Still, the eponymous image of her has lightning flying out of her eyes :P) What is the "Impaler" Stern can take? Lightning Purge is kinda awkward since it's ineffective against normal foes, pretty good against chaos marines and very good against daemons, which could be a balance problem. Maybe just have it be S4 normally, S5 against Daemons? Might want to avoid using a model's chaos mark to identify it for Lightning Purge - the current, awkward mark system in the chaos 'dex leaves models such as undivided chaos lords/sorcerers and chaos spawn without any mark of chaos. It might be worth just having the damage bonus apply to daemons/psykers, like in the grey knight 'dex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2911919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 30, 2011 Author Share Posted October 30, 2011 It's never made clear what Stern is - She's explicitly not a Psyker, because Psykers are born that way and she had no powers until she became the Daemonifuge. On the other hand, she's throws lightning that only works on Chaos, and opens webway portals with her brain. The Impaler is a dark eldar weapon. I'll clarify that. >< I thought I was being really clever with the Mark thing... maybe I should just make it fuzzier and say "chaos models" and leave it up to End-User interpretation? Lightning Purge isn't totally useless - it still wounds T4 models on a 6, and T3 models on a 5. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2912394 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus 101 Posted October 30, 2011 Share Posted October 30, 2011 Lightning Purge is kinda awkward since it's ineffective against normal foes, pretty good against chaos marines and very good against daemons, which could be a balance problem. Maybe just have it be S4 normally, S5 against Daemons? It's not too bad. They can use their bolter against non chaos units and Lightning Purge against Chao followed by a (hopefully devastating) charge. Also, remember that Lightning Purge can effect up to 6 units, which could make it useful against horde armies. I personally like it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2912491 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 Part of my iffiness on Lightning Purge is that the unit lacks some of the checks and balances present in the anti-daemon aspects of the Grey Knights; the Grey Knights can get away with having some specifically anti-daemon abilities since a lot of their forcewide expensive specialist equipment, such as Force Weapons and anti-psychic capabilities, will have no effect on a daemon; against Daemons they benefit from their Daemonbane/psyk-out/preferred enemy, against everything else they benefit from Force Weapons and anti-psychic. It's not perfect, but mostly works out. Nuriliem, on the other hand, don't lose nearly as much of their normal effectiveness when faced against daemons (only power weapon upgrades would be largely robbed of usefulness), but gain a significant increase in offensive capability (particularly when considering Aura of Faith); hence why I suggest making Lightning Purge's change in power less severe between daemons and non-daemons. Personally, I'd lean against open-to-interpretation rules, but that's more've a personal preference - a homegrown using environment would probably be interpretation friendly! Still, I'm partial to the feel of linear rules with only one possible interpretation - just feels cleaner. Balance-wise, having it be more effective against Chaos marines is kind of painful since they have precious few advantages over their statistically identical loyalist brethren. Plus, their more heavily mutated troopers (Noise Marines, Chaos Spawn and such) are mainly sad little puppies right now, best not to kick them :P Does Lightning Purge preclude other shooting? Or can they purge then bolter? If she's not explicitly a Psyker, then I'd agree that unique Acts of Faith is a good way of representing her powers, since it completely fits with the "vaguely normal human doing unexplained semi-magical things". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2912732 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 As written, no, LP doesn't preclude boltering... but that's an oversight, not a decision. I meant it to. Where the Nurielim lose out against non-daemons is that, point for point, they're significantly dearer than Celestians, and don't get heavy weapon options. Also, because of how I've written it, they can't take weapon upgrades if they take jump packs, although that's a bit of an oversight rather than a deliberate decision. The question is, should I fix that, or leave it as a balancing factor? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2912741 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 Definitely tweak it so they can still take options when they have Jump Packs, the unit would be kinda lackluster without special weapons. Having Seraphim Bolt Pistols as their default option could be fun, it'd make them visually distinct and hint at Stern's Seraphim training. The worry would be that if they lose out in comparison to Celestians when used against non-Daemons, then is there any significant incentive to include them in a generalist army list? If it's priced accordingly for its increased effectiveness against Daemons, then it's potentially overpriced in the context of non-daemon forces. Maybe genericize some of their abilities a bit to leave them with a bit more general usage - instead of Aura of Faith, they might force the re-rolling of any Inv. Saves (similar to the Space Marine Null Zone psy power). Just as effective against daemons, but also gives it a use against other armies, targeting Inv. Save dependent heros/units, that sorta thing. They'd be useful for engaging/maybe carving up Zoanthropes, Lysander and the like. Another potential way of handling Lightning Purge would be something similar to the Psilencer - always strikes at S4, but can never wound a Daemon unit on a roll worse than a 4+. It'd still be a desirable ability against non-daemons, but would also be capable of threatening Greater Daemons and Daemon Princes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239811-several-sisters/#findComment-2913483 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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