Captain Antonius Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 Greetings Brothers So, I've been looking at the artwork of "The Primarchs" on the viewing stand at the end of the Battle for Ullanor and I've been wondering several things. 1) The Emperor, beloved by all, was nearly killed by the huge ork leader as he led his forces in the cleansing of Ullanor. How big of an Ork does it take to nearly kill the Emperor?! 2) How many of the Primarchs participated in the battle? Was it the ones pictured on the viewing stand? 3) If all the Primarchs who were on the viewing stand brought their legions to cleanse Ullanor of the Ork threat, just how big was the Ork horde? I mean, from what I've read, an Astartes Legion boasts about 10,000 or more Marines. That's alot of choppy, shooty to bring to bear. 4) If it took all of the Primarchs and thier Legions, plus the Naval Fleets, plus at least one Titan Legion and the Emperor Himself to finally wipe out the orks, just how many was there? 5) Relating back to 40k instead of 30k, could Gazghull bring together a Waaaagh! bigger than the one at Ullanor? What would it take to stop something like that in 40k terms? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCommanderSamirus Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 Not all the Primarchs (or their legions) represented on the cover took part. But it was big. -Samirus Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894342 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkangilos Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 Ullanor was a campaign against the largest Ork Empire in the known universe, and against the Largest Warboss ever. Personally, I don't think he almost killed the Emperor, it was all just part of his plan (like, he was testing his sons or something). Either way, it was huge, and no other Ork Empire or Ork Boss have even come close to it. With the exception of Gazghul, who is getting close. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I think the you'll find that nowadays the generally accepted size for a Legion would be 80-120k. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikt208 Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I believe Ullanor involved the Emperor (+Custodes army), Luna Wolves, and Ultramarines. Alongside this there would have been Imperial army and Titans. The other Primarchs just turned up for the celebration, promotion of Horus, and announcement that the Emperor was returning to Terra. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894425 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus 101 Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I don't think Gazghull would be able to muster a Warrrgh! that big. I mean two+ whole legions (including the largest legion) plus Imperial Army, Titans, Custodes and the Emperor. You'd be looking at 1 million or more (probably more like 7+ billion spread put over the planet) orks led by the biggest and baddest Ork warboss EVER!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894429 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I find it confusing in the extreme to think the Ultramarines were there. When Ullanor was turned into the spectacle it became, the Ultramarines were too far to attend. It doesn't quite make sense to think they got so far away in such a short amount of time. Anyway, Orks grow dependent on aggression and also how concentrated the density of their populations. In modern day 40k the Orks of Octavius and Charadon (using 3rd edition sources) are on average bigger than the common Ork, being the size of Skarboyz (an old unit type between Nob and Boy) and there is speculation the greatest Orks of those Empires must be truly monstrous. So logically, since Ullanor was the greatest Ork Empire ever, including now, the Orks there must have been bigger and more aggressive so needed some serious attention to be removed from the universe. Feasibly, an Ork Warlord bigger than a Dreadnought could have existed there and then it looks possible he could have been mighty enough to choke the Emperor. Think King Kong in the most recent film. Don't forget Orks are inherently psychic, so it's also feasible (but speculation) an Ork getting to a certain size becomes a gesult focal point for Ork pyschic energy. This makes sense when you consider Ghazghull Thraka claimed to have latent pyschic powers activated after his accident with the bolt round, plus we know all Warlords act as focal points in Ork society and drive the Waaaagh! Which is a psychic control device in itself. So it's believable the Orks were a massive threat at the time and entire Legions were needed for their removal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikt208 Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I may be wrong about the Ultramarines, its not a concrete source. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissah Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 The Emperor got strangled long before the Ullanor campaign when he was saved by Horus. Also read this information it might help. http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Ullanor_Crusade#.To7V_c0eW1k Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894551 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Rawl Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 A novel detailling what happened at Ullanor would be really cool to read, doubt it will happen anytime soon though due to the heresy being underway finally Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 Well, it's not like there is a strict time-line order for the book releases... But having said that, the Ullanor campain itself seems a bit out of scope for the HH series. Some occasional flash backs is all we should hope for. On the other hand a Great Crusade series columnating with the Ullanor campaign would be really cool! ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894574 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 The Emperor got strangled long before the Ullanor campaign when he was saved by Horus. Also read this information it might help. http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Ullanor_Crusade#.To7V_c0eW1k Well there could still be monstrous Orks elsewhere, going by the principles I raised in my previous post. King Kong Ork grabbs the Emperor and squeezes him, almost killing him. I think authors would have to be careful how they portray it though. Horus using an Imperial Thunderbolt to shoot through the Ork's arm after it carried the Emperor to the top of a Hive Spire would infringe on copy right... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894613 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elric the Silvercoat Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 Well also you have to remember that when an Ork believes in something it comes true. Like the red paint thing and the ways their weapons work. So if enough Orks believe that the Warboss is the biggest and baddest and strengthest Ork ever it will come truth. There is a story about an Imperial Guardsmans that ran out of ammo and just started saying "BANG" when he pointed his gun at Orks and because the Orks believed he was shooting at them they would die. And when others saw others die they believed it even more. So its just shows why Orks can be the more dangerous race in the Universe. All they need to do is believe they are smarter than everyone and we are so gone. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894648 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Mournival Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 In Horus Rising it implies that the only LEGION to participate in the battle were the Luna Wolves. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894679 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Antonius Posted October 7, 2011 Author Share Posted October 7, 2011 Brothers, Thanks for the quick replies. The lexicanum article was most helpful, but only talks about the Luna Wolves and various other Legions and Imperial Army units who were probably attached to their respective Legions/task forces. So, the article implies that several Legions took part in the Ullanor Campaign to cleanse the system of Orks. If that's the case, the question arrises about the Ullanor system itself. How many planets? Does the system still exist in 40k? Once we know the answers to these questions then we can reasonably determine how many Legions may have participated at Ullanor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2894913 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkyrion Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 Well also you have to remember that when an Ork believes in something it comes true. Like the red paint thing and the ways their weapons work. So if enough Orks believe that the Warboss is the biggest and baddest and strengthest Ork ever it will come truth. There is a story about an Imperial Guardsmans that ran out of ammo and just started saying "BANG" when he pointed his gun at Orks and because the Orks believed he was shooting at them they would die. And when others saw others die they believed it even more. So its just shows why Orks can be the more dangerous race in the Universe. All they need to do is believe they are smarter than everyone and we are so gone. Wait...woah...er...what? True that? Where's that from? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2895302 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don the Oiler Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 I always thought this model from a DoW mod that sadly never saw completion came pretty close to what i pictured Urrluk would look like http://www.ominouscow.com/moru/Mashogg_008.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2895331 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 Yes, the Emperor was nearly killed by an ork, but that was not the same ork warboss as the one on Ullanor. IIRC the Ullanor campaign took place throughout the entire system and not just on one planet so there was plenty of room for everyone. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2895345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elric the Silvercoat Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 Well also you have to remember that when an Ork believes in something it comes true. Like the red paint thing and the ways their weapons work. So if enough Orks believe that the Warboss is the biggest and baddest and strengthest Ork ever it will come truth. There is a story about an Imperial Guardsmans that ran out of ammo and just started saying "BANG" when he pointed his gun at Orks and because the Orks believed he was shooting at them they would die. And when others saw others die they believed it even more. So its just shows why Orks can be the more dangerous race in the Universe. All they need to do is believe they are smarter than everyone and we are so gone. Wait...woah...er...what? True that? Where's that from? I think all of it is in the Ork codex including the story. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2895393 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Immolator Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Cant remember the source but i read somewhere that ork was as large as a warhound titan.I know this sounds ridiculous but then.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2897125 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Rawl Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 In Horus Rising it implies that the only LEGION to participate in the battle were the Luna Wolves. They led the Spear Tip alone to take down the Warboss of the Ullanor sector, the other legions did fight in it with the army supports and what not. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2897526 Share on other sites More sharing options...
spu00sed Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Which campaign was it when the Emperor (belovedn of all) had to teleport into the midsts of the battle with 1000 Custodes, to top the rout of 2 or 3 legions He personnally slew the warlord and threw his corpse from a Gargant, whilst his guard slew tens of thousands of Orks for the loss of only three custodes. Who then had their names engraved in the Emperor's armour for their sacrifice. Now that was an epic battle. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2898770 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 Cant remember the source but i read somewhere that ork was as large as a warhound titan.I know this sounds ridiculous but then.... Orks aren't like humans; while we have two major growth bursts (3 for males), they grow at the same rate their entire lives, and never, ever stop. It is theoretically possible that an ork as big as even an Imperator could eventually come to be, however, I'm pretty somebody would launch a vortex missile at its face before it got very far simply because it would be such a ridiculouslly huge threat (literally). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2899070 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 I would pay a ridiculous amount of money to get Karl Kopinski to draw a picture of a 18 foot tall Super Ork throttling the crap out of the Emperor, with Horus leaping to his defense behind the Ork Warlord with sword raised. Hells yes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2899084 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astinon Dras Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 There is a story about an Imperial Guardsmans that ran out of ammo and just started saying "BANG" when he pointed his gun at Orks and because the Orks believed he was shooting at them they would die. And when others saw others die they believed it even more. So its just shows why Orks can be the more dangerous race in the Universe. All they need to do is believe they are smarter than everyone and we are so gone. This part really badly needs a source. As for the legion sizes. We know that the Ultramarines were the biggest at ~250k. The Word Bearers, at the beginning of TFH were at about ~100k and the second biggest. Now it is also said in one of the latest Dan Abnett video interviews that at the time of the Battle of Calth, the WB were at about ~150-160k. So given that Corax's legion numbered ~80k at the beginning of the Dropsite Massacre and the WB ~100k is the second highest number, most legions are bound to be in these two ranges. Space Wolves and Thousand Sons being excepted of course. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/239892-the-battle-for-ullanor/#findComment-2899102 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.