captainawsm Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 As a new challenge, I am planning on starting a chaos space marine warband from one of the first founding legions. I've narrowed it down to a few of the Chaos Undivided legions, and would really love some help with a final decision. So, the shortlist is as follows: Iron Warriors Word Bearers Alpha Legion Just post which you believe makes for the most interesting or effective legion, and a reason why. Thanks for your help guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 They are all interesting, and they are all equally 'effective' given that there are no legion rules any more. The questions that you need to ask yourself are, Which Legion appeals to you the most and which Legion do you see yourself painting the most of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainawsm Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 The main problem is just when I think I settle on a particular Legion, my mind wanders on the endless path of the hobby butterfly. What I was going for here was an end to this. However, I think I may limit the choice to Iron Warriors or Word Bearers. Brothers, please speak up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Metallics are easier to paint than reds, so one can get an IW army up and running in no time. Also one of the reasons they were popular in the previous edition. That is one reason to go with IW. I am sure others can find more compelling reasons for both. :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 The main problem is just when I think I settle on a particular Legion, my mind wanders on the endless path of the hobby butterfly. What I was going for here was an end to this. However, I think I may limit the choice to Iron Warriors or Word Bearers. Brothers, please speak up! I know exactly, how you feel. I've gone back and forth several times. If I didn't hate Lorgar so much, I'd be tempted into doing a Word Bearer army. "Your destruction is the will of the gods...and we are their instrument" still sounds awesome, and is so fitting for them. It would be interesting to use Black Templar rules with them (I'm not real big on Daemons in my Chaos Space Marine armies), and similarly the Chaos Space Marine codex of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainawsm Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 Whilst the idea of using the Templar rules for a CSM army is interesting, I already have a Templars force, and this was meant to be something different. The Templars are an all-infantry force (which has done well enough). So, the Word Bearers are different in the use of daemons and worship of chaos, whilst Iron Warriors have the tech-feel to them, opposite to the fiery zealot sense of the Templars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaliGn Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 If you already have a templar force then you'll find all the spare bits you haven't used really handy when making some snazzy word bearers, but it might feel a little samey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menkeroth Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 In tactics IW can be more interesting choice. Instead of zealot sense and hand-to-hand rage - a lot of range heavy weapon and vehicles. And easy to paint, yes. And FW can help to have them look more fluffy :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malika666 Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Hmm, what about trying something totally radical? Make a Word Bearers force, but use the Codex Orks. Hear me out, hear me out! I know it's rather heretical. But what about using Ard Boys and Mega Armoured Nobs as Word Bearer marines and have Grots are troops? The Grots could be used to represent the hordes of cultists the Word Bearers use as cannon fodder... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Iron Within. Iron Without. THe Word Bearers are cool and all that, but the Iron Warriors are the best. The Best. We're talking about the Legion that shattered the Imperial Gates on Terra. The Legion that slaughtered their own homeworld by hand, one bolt round at a time. The Legion that broke the freakin' Imperial Fists within the Iron Cage. Cold, logical psyhcopathic killers. It don't get better than that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristoff Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Bah, go all out, do all THREE! Do Alpha Legion for Chosen (and Fast Attack should you choose to use them). Do Iron Warriors for the Heavy Support slots and Terminators. Do Word Bearers for Basic CSM and Possessed. For HQs, make several of each so you can mix and match to your preference. OR... Make your own main Crusade paint scheme and use the shoulder pads to identify their originating Legion. Just have the HQs have their own concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 The Legion that broke the freakin' Imperial Fists within the Iron Cage. Wasn't that before the fists got a nice little story around it that the fists only did it to "cleanse" themselves by symbolically entering the "pain glove" called the iron cage? They came out better and more ready for the girly-man's codex... ...which is silly of course, damn GW loves their loyalist pets... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 I've always seen much of the fluff outside our codex as Imperial Propaganda. Plain and simple, the Fists got ruined, and Perturabo ascended to Daemon-Prince. Win-win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilicate Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 The Legion that broke the freakin' Imperial Fists within the Iron Cage. Wasn't that before the fists got a nice little story around it that the fists only did it to "cleanse" themselves by symbolically entering the "pain glove" called the iron cage? They came out better and more ready for the girly-man's codex... ...which is silly of course, damn GW loves their loyalist pets... That's only from the Imperial Fists point of view. I'd credit the truer version of the story to the Iron Warriors. Yeah, they might embellish it a bit, but in the end, the Fists were just covering their own butts so they wouldn't seem so whipped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlkTom Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 To be frank, do some research on Forge World and other sites to look for bits like shoulder pads and the like. If you can save yourself some work and effort, awesome. If you want to do the conversion yourself, cool and this doesn't matter. I know alot of folk do Iron Warriors using the Vanilla codex and run a gunline list. You could also just hold off till the new chaos codex comes out too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 That's only from the Imperial Fists point of view. I'd credit the truer version of the story to the Iron Warriors. Yeah, they might embellish it a bit, but in the end, the Fists were just covering their own butts so they wouldn't seem so whipped. Well, it's still official fluff, and it makes the IW look like complete idiots...damn I dislike that part... But it's a fairly common thing, I mean the bit about Alpha Legion destroying the Emperor's Swords with a 300 year infiltration of Ghorstangrad has most likely been retconned... :no: Nowdays, in the more recent codex(C:SM 5th ed) the Emperor's Swords died when it was discovered that their planet was a Necron tomb world instead...something I suspect only will be reinforced when the Necron codex is released... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Tezdal Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 The main problem is just when I think I settle on a particular Legion, my mind wanders on the endless path of the hobby butterfly. What I was going for here was an end to this. However, I think I may limit the choice to Iron Warriors or Word Bearers. Brothers, please speak up! I had the exact same problem for many years, albeit with the cult legions... but I'd just go with whose fluff, and paint schemes ring out to you... playstyle has always mattered less to me in keeping interest in an army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainawsm Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Thanks for all the help guys. In the end, 1000heathens' comments about the IW actions at the siege of Terra sold them for me, and so I'll begin my attempt at truly capturing there theme in my army. If anyone has any ideas on what they believe an IW warband must include, please share, as I'd love to hear your ideas. Later on I might post army lists/ pictures of the army as it grows on this post. (By the way, @1000heathens, love your work with the Marines Malevolent.) @Kristoff and malika666, I love these ideas, but this force is actually part of a project me and a close mate are working on to create a warband of warriors from one of the original legions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainawsm Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Okay, sorry about the double post. But here is my first planned list. I would love C&C. This is 1500 pnts, here goes. Chaos Lord with Daemon Weapon and Combi-Melta 140 pnts 5 Terminator Champions, Autocannon. 2x Chainfists, 2x Powerfists 275 pnts 9 CSM's, Meltagun, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Rhino-Havoc Launcher 260 pnts 10 CSM's, 2x Plasma Guns, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Rhino 280 pnts 10 CSM's, Plasma Gun, Heavy Bolter, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol 230 pnts 2 Obliterators 150 pnts Predator, Twin-Linked Lascannon, Sponson Lascannons 165 pnts The Chaos Lord goes with the 9 marine squad in their rhino. The two rhino mounted squads are mainly for objectives, and providing icons near the enemy for the termies and obliterators to deep strike on. The other marine squad holds the home objective and, if necessary, defend the predator from fast or deep striking enemies. As mentioned before, tactical or thematic help is welcome. Please critque, as harshly or kindly as you may wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darth_giles Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Y'know, given the number of people asking this question in the last month or two, and given how everyone has their own canned answers, maybe we could make a sticky on why to play each legion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spafe Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Okay, sorry about the double post. But here is my first planned list. I would love C&C. This is 1500 pnts, here goes. Chaos Lord with Daemon Weapon and Combi-Melta 140 pnts very nice, i prefer twin claws and combi melta but this works 5 Terminator Champions, Autocannon. 2x Chainfists, 2x Powerfists 275 pnts very hard hitting unit, true champions capable of tearing down a bunkerdrop the powerfists, dont need them with the chains in there, and more p/weps are nice 9 CSM's, Meltagun, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Rhino-Havoc Launcher 260 pntsdrop the plasma pistols 10 CSM's, 2x Plasma Guns, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Rhino 280 pntsdrop the plasma pistols 10 CSM's, Plasma Gun, Heavy Bolter, Chaos Glory, Champion-Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol 230 pntsdrop the plasma pistols Nice solid force of troops to storm the breach, i'd possibly swap the heavy bolter for a autocannon, but thats personal choice 2 Obliterators 150 pnts Predator, Twin-Linked Lascannon, Sponson Lascannons 165 pntsdrop the overcosted turret Sorry, the red is thematic adivce/comments, while the blue is form a tactical point. thematically, I love it, seems amazing, only thing i'd look to add would be a dred or a vindie (or both!). Points wise, if you drop all i've suggested, i think that nets you 125 points (at work no dex to hand). That would get you a vindie or dred easy. looks like a nice well rounded list though. You mention a friend is doing this project with you? as in he's doing another legion or your both doing a iron host? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissah Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Y'know, given the number of people asking this question in the last month or two, and given how everyone has their own canned answers, maybe we could make a sticky on why to play each legion? That is a good idea I can help and write something about the Black Legion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 @captainawsm Please keep army list discussions in the Army List Forum, lest this topic gets moved. ^_^ Y'know, given the number of people asking this question in the last month or two, and given how everyone has their own canned answers, maybe we could make a sticky on why to play each legion? That is a good idea I can help and write something about the Black Legion. By all means, please do so! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 If anyone has any ideas on what they believe an IW warband must include, please share, as I'd love to hear your ideas. Its fairly easy to build a fluffy IW army. Most of the heavy support options will fit, obliterators are known to be more common in IW armies, vindicators were previously only used by IW, defilers are a prime example of IW using Chaos instead of worshipping it and predators and havocs are space marine staples. Outside of the heavy slot, I would focus primarily on troops and elites. Terminators are a no brainer but chosen are also a good choice as IW are known for using forward units. For troops, you can't go wrong with CSMs, possibly supported by berzerkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainawsm Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 @darth_giles: I think this is a great idea. Lexicanum really helped me work on theme once I decided on a legion, but a sticky on why to play would also be extremely helpful for a lot of people. @spafe: Thanks, I probably will drop a lot of the expensive unecessary upgrade in favour of a vindicator. @minigun762: Thanks for the thematic ideas. I tried to encapsulate the theme in this list, but I think what spafe said about swapping out the upgrades for a vindicator will go a long way towards achieving this. And, as Brother Nihm pointed out, there is a dedicated chaos army list area on B&C. If anyone reading this has ideas they'd like to share about the list, please head on over to: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=240115 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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