i have just finished re-reading Battle the Abyss

[Saa]

UUURRRGH.........Please let this thread die......seeing its subtitle appear on my screen again makes bile rise in my throat. It's a bad book, written badly, with bad, one dimensional pewpew cliche stereotypical characters and horrible plot flow. Yes this is my opinion but I'm not alone here.........

 

 

 

 

 

*vomits copiously over his copy of this crime against reading*

 

Saa

 

.....or something like that

[Ubermensch Commander]

UUURRRGH.........Please let this thread die......seeing its subtitle appear on my screen again makes bile rise in my throat. It's a bad book, written badly, with bad, one dimensional pewpew cliche stereotypical characters and horrible plot flow. Yes this is my opinion but I'm not alone here.........

 

 

 

 

 

*vomits copiously over his copy of this crime against reading*

 

Saa

 

.....or something like that

 

Hey, I have to endure simpering and unwarranted praise of that piece of filth Legion, you get to suffer through this! Cope. ;)

[Iron Father Ferrum]

UUURRRGH.........Please let this thread die......seeing its subtitle appear on my screen again makes bile rise in my throat. It's a bad book, written badly, with bad, one dimensional pewpew cliche stereotypical characters and horrible plot flow. Yes this is my opinion but I'm not alone here.........

 

 

 

 

 

*vomits copiously over his copy of this crime against reading*

 

Saa

 

.....or something like that

 

Hey, I have to endure simpering and unwarranted praise of that piece of filth Legion, you get to suffer through this! Cope. ^_^

 

Compare this trash to Legion again and I'll <insert usual empty Internet nerd-rage threat>

[Ubermensch Commander]

UUURRRGH.........Please let this thread die......seeing its subtitle appear on my screen again makes bile rise in my throat. It's a bad book, written badly, with bad, one dimensional pewpew cliche stereotypical characters and horrible plot flow. Yes this is my opinion but I'm not alone here.........

 

 

 

 

 

*vomits copiously over his copy of this crime against reading*

 

Saa

 

.....or something like that

 

Hey, I have to endure simpering and unwarranted praise of that piece of filth Legion, you get to suffer through this! Cope. :)

 

Compare this trash to Legion again and I'll <insert usual empty Internet nerd-rage threat>

 

Oh yeah? Well (incoherent Internet nerd-rage babble)! So there! :P

...and we just got way off topic didnt we?

 

On topic: Been mentioned before, but not that bad. Whereas Legion took existing fluff and twisted it into something new and, in my opinion, horrific, presenting us with a eye brow raising tale full of breaks in character, logical gaps, and a "twist" about a Primarch that literally had no point whatsoever, Battle for the Abyss went in the opposite direction.

It boiled existing fluff down to its core.

It had to deal with representatives of 5 different Legions and thus threw them up as the bare bones for each one. Thus, many felt they were almost caricatures of their Legions.

The World Eaters were sufficiently brutal, the Thousand Son ephemeral and "wise", etc and so forth.

 

As for criticisms of the Word Bearers...Mustachio twirling? From a bunch of fanatical dark god worshiping nutjobs? NO! Really? Shocking ;)

Frankly, I did not mind this as not everyone is an Argel Tal and I am sick of so many HH books trying to make the filthy traitors seem sympathetic in their own failings. For guys who would spend 10,000 years locked in an eternal battle on the losing side I would expect more reveling in their evil, or at least more conviction in their own stupidity.

 

I would posit BFtA's greatest strength, and arguably its greatest weakness, is that it was very much an intermediary or set-up novel, similar to Descent of Angels.

Battle for the Abyss sets the stage for a subplot in Nemesis (addressing the question of just how far the rot goes in the Imperium) and the not-here-yet Battle for Calth book. It showed up in another book but which one escapes me at the moment, so lets stick with those two.

[Brother Ambroz]

As for criticisms of the Word Bearers...Mustachio twirling? From a bunch of fanatical dark god worshiping nutjobs? NO! Really? Shocking :)

Frankly, I did not mind this as not everyone is an Argel Tal and I am sick of so many HH books trying to make the filthy traitors seem sympathetic in their own failings. For guys who would spend 10,000 years locked in an eternal battle on the losing side I would expect more reveling in their evil, or at least more conviction in their own stupidity.

 

Yeah but seriously? The Word Bearer in that book was essentially the very definition of mustache twirling. Evil laugh here, condemning the heroes that they would fail over there, etc at every opportunity. Need more be said?

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

As for criticisms of the Word Bearers...Mustachio twirling? From a bunch of fanatical dark god worshiping nutjobs? NO! Really? Shocking :tu:

Frankly, I did not mind this as not everyone is an Argel Tal and I am sick of so many HH books trying to make the filthy traitors seem sympathetic in their own failings. For guys who would spend 10,000 years locked in an eternal battle on the losing side I would expect more reveling in their evil, or at least more conviction in their own stupidity.

 

Yeah but seriously? The Word Bearer in that book was essentially the very definition of mustache twirling. Evil laugh here, condemning the heroes that they would fail over there, etc at every opportunity. Need more be said?

 

i'm just happy the guy wasnt stroking a cat...

 

"no mr. ultramarine, i expect you to die"

 

WLK

[Saa]

As for criticisms of the Word Bearers...Mustachio twirling? From a bunch of fanatical dark god worshiping nutjobs? NO! Really? Shocking ;)

Frankly, I did not mind this as not everyone is an Argel Tal and I am sick of so many HH books trying to make the filthy traitors seem sympathetic in their own failings. For guys who would spend 10,000 years locked in an eternal battle on the losing side I would expect more reveling in their evil, or at least more conviction in their own stupidity.

 

Yeah but seriously? The Word Bearer in that book was essentially the very definition of mustache twirling. Evil laugh here, condemning the heroes that they would fail over there, etc at every opportunity. Need more be said?

 

It was the taunting of Skraal over a PA system that was the final nail in the 'mwahahahaha' stakes for me. Awful Bond villain stuff right there. ...........mwahahahahahaha :huh:

 

i'm just happy the guy wasnt stroking a cat...

 

"no mr. ultramarine, i expect you to die"

 

WLK

 

You Sir gave me my belly laugh of the day B)

 

Saa

 

.....or something like that

[Son of Rawl]

Sssoooo this Heresy novel is not worth picking up then?

[Ubermensch Commander]

As for criticisms of the Word Bearers...Mustachio twirling? From a bunch of fanatical dark god worshiping nutjobs? NO! Really? Shocking :tu:

Frankly, I did not mind this as not everyone is an Argel Tal and I am sick of so many HH books trying to make the filthy traitors seem sympathetic in their own failings. For guys who would spend 10,000 years locked in an eternal battle on the losing side I would expect more reveling in their evil, or at least more conviction in their own stupidity.

 

Yeah but seriously? The Word Bearer in that book was essentially the very definition of mustache twirling. Evil laugh here, condemning the heroes that they would fail over there, etc at every opportunity. Need more be said?

 

Did not bother me. These are the guys who were the only Legion to not get the memo about the Emperor's secular crusade, had faith to the point of "When he says No, he really means YES I am a god!", and then whole heartedly turned to the worship of foul entities. Heck, PREACHING and RHETORIC are kind of their schtick. That's the Word Bearers. It's what they do.

I fully expect fanatical super soldiers that are new converts (have you ever MET a new convert of any faith? They will not SHUT UP *eyetwtich*) to mock their wayward brethren while rocking it aboard their NEW SUPER WEAPON.

Think Emperor Palpatine on board the Deathstar. Dismiss your guards, be there and risk your person with not only the enemy rebel fleet nearby but also the powerful enemy and treacherous powerful servant nearby. Probably not the best move but hey, if you think you totally got this and have the enemy at your mercy, you might as well enjoy it!

[Coryphaus 101]

Sssoooo this Heresy novel is not worth picking up then?

Unfortunately, it's kind of vital to the storyline so yeah, it's sort of a must-read but not exactly a must-enjoy-read.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Sssoooo this Heresy novel is not worth picking up then?

Unfortunately, it's kind of vital to the storyline so yeah, it's sort of a must-read but not exactly a must-enjoy-read.

 

how is this in any way vital to the story line?

 

characters we never heard of before are introduced and killed off.

a ship that is just introduced that plays no role in the larger conflict is destroyed.

characters we already know of arent involved in any important role.

 

this "book" is a largely self contained event, adds nothing new worth knowing to the story, and the only reason i havent burned it yet is i am a dork collecting the HH series.

 

you can EASILY skip this book and probably be better off for it. i am ashamed i had to buy this book twice (loaned out the book and never got it back). unless the HH authors stretch to include this in future books, then you need nothing from this.

 

WLK

[Coryphaus 101]

Know No Fear sort of continues on from it. It sets up the Battle of Calth story line.

[Coryphaus 101]

Double post

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Know No Fear sort of continues on from it. It sets up the Battle of Calth story line.

 

so a book released years later is supposed to validate the craptacular spectacle that was BftA?

 

sounds more like the HH team is attempting an author saving throw.

 

WLK

[Lord_Caerolion]

I don't think the book is vital in any way to setting up the Battle of Calth. As Kieran has said, the entire thing is tied up in itself. Everybody involved died, the ship blew up, and that's pretty much it. Yes, they mention that the Word Bearers will be invading Calth, but they do that in First Heretic as well, which is a far better book. Secondly, you're making the assumption that everything needs a book to set it up. Did Mechanicum fail as a novel because it had no prequel book setting up the battle of Mars?

[Saa]

Did Mechanicum fail as a novel because it had no prequel book setting up the battle of Mars?

 

No, Mechanicum failed for other reasons, primarily 'adventure kids....going on an adventure!!! In a deep dark underground dungeon!!! With monsters!!!' I fully expected a cutsie braying baby unicorn and a balding dwarf in robes to pop up periodically. Plus I'm not a huge fan of Titan-porn :)

 

Another comparison could be 'Scooby Doo and the meddling space kids foil the Evil Martians'. Though I'm unsure who would be Scooby himself.......but the meddling kids are all represented.

 

It's only real saving grace was the politicking amongst the Adeptus Mechanicus factions and the really great opening chapter......so I guess it still has more going for it then BftA.

 

Saa

 

.......or something like that

[A D-B]

Know No Fear sort of continues on from it. It sets up the Battle of Calth story line.

 

so a book released years later is supposed to validate the craptacular spectacle that was BftA?

 

sounds more like the HH team is attempting an author saving throw.

 

WLK

 

Mwuh? Calth and the events therein have been in the lore for years now. I get what you're saying, but think about how you're presenting it. Maybe - just maybe - it's not about other human beings making unprofessional mistakes, and you're making a perfectly normal situation sound bad for no reason.

 

Calth is... Calth. What does the publication of that novel have to do with "author saving throws"?

 

Seriously, dude.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Know No Fear sort of continues on from it. It sets up the Battle of Calth story line.

 

so a book released years later is supposed to validate the craptacular spectacle that was BftA?

 

sounds more like the HH team is attempting an author saving throw.

 

WLK

 

Mwuh? Calth and the events therein have been in the lore for years now. I get what you're saying, but think about how you're presenting it. Maybe - just maybe - it's not about other human beings making unprofessional mistakes, and you're making a perfectly normal situation sound bad for no reason.

 

Calth is... Calth. What does the publication of that novel have to do with "author saving throws"?

 

Seriously, dude.

 

alright, let me state it clearer: Its being mentioned in "Know No Fear" is an attempt to lend importance to a book that is (until K.N.F. is released apparently) self contained in the HH, having no real impact on the events at Calth.

 

Calth on its own needs no lead in, as it is a major part of the HH and has been known in HH lore for many years. To mention BftA in K.N.F. is an attempt at a author's saving throw for a sub-par novel in a otherwise great series.

 

better?

 

WLK

[A D-B]

Know No Fear sort of continues on from it. It sets up the Battle of Calth story line.

 

so a book released years later is supposed to validate the craptacular spectacle that was BftA?

 

sounds more like the HH team is attempting an author saving throw.

 

WLK

 

Mwuh? Calth and the events therein have been in the lore for years now. I get what you're saying, but think about how you're presenting it. Maybe - just maybe - it's not about other human beings making unprofessional mistakes, and you're making a perfectly normal situation sound bad for no reason.

 

Calth is... Calth. What does the publication of that novel have to do with "author saving throws"?

 

Seriously, dude.

 

alright, let me state it clearer: Its being mentioned in "Know No Fear" is an attempt to lend importance to a book that is (until K.N.F. is released apparently) self contained in the HH, having no real impact on the events at Calth.

 

Calth on its own needs no lead in, as it is a major part of the HH and has been known in HH lore for many years. To mention BftA in K.N.F. is an attempt at a author's saving throw for a sub-par novel in a otherwise great series.

 

better?

 

WLK

 

Oh. Oh.

 

Yeah, okay, I was being ultra-dense and super-slow.

 

I wouldn't worry about it, though. Someone mentioning it on a forum isn't the same as it getting a vital mention in KNF, etc.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

LOL, no worries. I am rarely at my best when i post here (often due to i post when i get home from work, and have severe brain to fingers communication failure)

 

WLK

[Legatus]

Well, BftA did not really have any bearing on the following Battle at Calth. What I thought the BftA set up was that (as a result of the destruction of the Furious Abyss) the warp currents in that region of space went completely mad and un-navigateable, which was one of the reasons why the Ultramarines and Dark Angels could not get anywhere for most of the Heresy. But then I have not read it myself, and have only been told that something like that happens.

[Lord Munkrunky]

i have just finished re-re-reading it after being so comprehensively told off by Mr Dembski Bowden and it is rubbish after all

 

sorry to have wasted your energies.

 

 

Now where did i put Descent of angels?......

[Saa]

i have just finished re-re-reading it after being so comprehensively told off by Mr Dembski Bowden and it is rubbish after all

 

sorry to have wasted your energies.

 

 

Now where did i put Descent of angels?......

 

No energies were wasted if your eyes have been opened to the evils of poor literature :o

 

Saa

 

.......or something like that