Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I'm sorry, no fluff for these guy(s) yet. At least, no written out fluff :lol: But there are rules! Ao Oni, Bearer of the Word (to be used as a HQ choice in Codex: Space Marines) Points Cost - 200 Stats - see Captain entry in Codex: Space Marines Wargear No Respector of Men Hellfire Rounds Artificer Armour Storm Shield Bolt Pistol No Respector of Men - This bolter, coloured a worn gold, spits bolts that fades through enemy armour to detonate within. The shots fired by No Respector are AP3. Special Rules Fearless Advance Ao Oni Fearless Advance - Ao Oni has never displayed fear or hesitation in it's actions. When seen on the battlefield it is always accompanied by a squad of warriors that follow the creature regardless of any danger or harm. Their advance is terrifying and unstoppable. Ao Oni must be attached to a Tactical or Sternguard squad, chosen before deployment, and deploys with the chosen squad. He may not leave that squad for the duration of the game. This rule gives the Fearless and Relentless rules to Ao Oni, and by extension the squad he deploys with. Ao Oni - Upon the death of the creature or creatures, a whisper of 'Ao Oni' goes through the minds of those who killed it, unnerving otherwise steely men. The Terror - Ao Oni can only be slowed for so long - no foe will stay in combat with the Blue Daemon if it does not wish it. At the end of the Assault phase, if the enemy unit is still engaged it must flee as though it lost the combat (regardless of who does win the combat). However, Ao Oni and the unit he has joined will not pursue, but will consolidate as normal. The unit that removed the last wound from Ao Oni must immediately take a Morale test at -2 Leadership. Thoughts? Comments? Criticism? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 What is it? A space marine? A ghost? A Damned Legionnaire? A Greater daemon? What happens to the slaying squad if they fail the leadership check? Why is it a Space Marine unit if it's a daemon? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910806 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 What is it? A space marine? A ghost? A Damned Legionnaire? A Greater daemon? Why is it a Space Marine unit if it's a daemon? That's part of the fluff... I didn't realize it, but it's comparable to a Chaos Legion of the Damned. Nobody in the Imperium knows what it is, whether it's marine or daemon, whether there are fifty, five hundred, or just the one that does it's own thing. It takes the form of a power armoured warrior, but it's really tough and resilient even for an Astarte. Nobody has even seen its corpse, but they've seen it dissapear when they poured enough firepower on it, and then they get this whisper in their head that they really weren't expecting and is probably daemonic in nature, so it is naturally going to scare the wits out of the unit that is on the receiving end. What happens to the slaying squad if they fail the leadership check? They, um, fall back, just as they would normally if they were shot at and failed a Leadership test? I'll clarify that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910873 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 That's part of the fluff... I didn't realize it, but it's comparable to a Chaos Legion of the Damned. Nobody in the Imperium knows what it is, whether it's marine or daemon, whether there are fifty, five hundred, or just the one that does it's own thing. It takes the form of a power armoured warrior, but it's really tough and resilient even for an Astarte. Nobody has even seen its corpse, but they've seen it dissapear when they poured enough firepower on it, and then they get this whisper in their head that they really weren't expecting and is probably daemonic in nature, so it is naturally going to scare the wits out of the unit that is on the receiving end.? Again, then, I ask: Why is this a unit for Codex: Space Marines? It looks pretty clearly Chaos-aligned. Also, all daemonic creatures have an invulnerable save of some sort, ranging from lesser daemons (5+) to greater daemons (3+), with damned legionnaires being in the middle. They, um, fall back, just as they would normally if they were shot at and failed a Leadership test? I'll clarify that. Ah, this is where the confusion lays. A Leadership check is any check made by rolling 2d6 and comparing the result to the unt's leadership score, such as a Psychic test or Pinning check. What you mean here is a Morale check. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910905 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 That's part of the fluff... I didn't realize it, but it's comparable to a Chaos Legion of the Damned. Nobody in the Imperium knows what it is, whether it's marine or daemon, whether there are fifty, five hundred, or just the one that does it's own thing. It takes the form of a power armoured warrior, but it's really tough and resilient even for an Astarte. Nobody has even seen its corpse, but they've seen it dissapear when they poured enough firepower on it, and then they get this whisper in their head that they really weren't expecting and is probably daemonic in nature, so it is naturally going to scare the wits out of the unit that is on the receiving end.? Again, then, I ask: Why is this a unit for Codex: Space Marines? It looks pretty clearly Chaos-aligned. Also, all daemonic creatures have an invulnerable save of some sort, ranging from lesser daemons (5+) to greater daemons (3+), with damned legionnaires being in the middle. Because I just don't run the Chaos Codex. You can use it with the Chaos Codex, if you want, but it's made as part of a Codex: Space Marines army. Should I make a version based on the Chaos Codex as well? I'll be making more variations of the Blue Daemon (which is also part of the fluff I have in my head, there are multiple power-armoured beings, some with very, very similar abilities, who run around claiming they are Ao Oni). That's why I gave it a Storm Shield :P They, um, fall back, just as they would normally if they were shot at and failed a Leadership test? I'll clarify that. Ah, this is where the confusion lays. A Leadership check is any check made by rolling 2d6 and comparing the result to the unt's leadership score, such as a Psychic test or Pinning check. What you mean here is a Morale check. Oops ^_^ When I game, no distinction is usually made, it's usually just called a Leadership test for all of those things. I'll clarify that, thanks :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910910 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 His/It's wargear seems a touch lackluster in the weapons department. I'd personally be inclined to give a 200 point model something better than just a bolter and bolt pistol. Also, does he count as an IC when attached to his initial squad (which would allow him to get singled out in close combat) or is his squad treated as a retinue? What happens if his squad is killed; can he join a new squad, or is he stuck as a single-model unit? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910928 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus 101 Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 My main problem is he has basic weapons (plus a storm shield) and a few special rules. He needs a close combat weapon of some kind. For fluff, so is he like a shape shifting daemon? That would be cool, a shape shifting daemon that appears among all the races in the universe. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2910951 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 29, 2011 Author Share Posted October 29, 2011 His/It's wargear seems a touch lackluster in the weapons department. I'd personally be inclined to give a 200 point model something better than just a bolter and bolt pistol. My main problem is he has basic weapons (plus a storm shield) and a few special rules. He needs a close combat weapon of some kind. I did give him Hellfire rounds to alleviate that. Hmmmmm. Thought about it for a while. How about... Daemon's Helm - Terror markings and horns adorn the helmet of the creature. In close combat, if the enemy unit suffers any casualties, it loses the combat (unless it has the Fearless special rule) and must take a morale test. Also, does he count as an IC when attached to his initial squad (which would allow him to get singled out in close combat) or is his squad treated as a retinue? What happens if his squad is killed; can he join a new squad, or is he stuck as a single-model unit? He's stuck as a single model unit. I'll clarify that. For fluff, so is he like a shape shifting daemon? That would be cool, a shape shifting daemon that appears among all the races in the universe. I wasn't thinking the special Tzeentchian herald - I can't remember its name for the life of me - more along the lines of "Hey, didn't we kill this guy already? What is he doing here?" X five or six times. Plus, there are some variations of it/them, but all of the real one(s) have the same special 'Ao Oni' whisper upon dying (and by extension, this is what will unite the various versions rules-wise). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2911579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 His/It's wargear seems a touch lackluster in the weapons department. I'd personally be inclined to give a 200 point model something better than just a bolter and bolt pistol. I did give him Hellfire rounds to alleviate that. Hmmmmm. I'd be inclined to suggest something a touch above the standard bolter; at the very least a combi-weapon, if not something a touch fancier. (Kantor, Calgar, and Telion all got fancy special bolter weapons, after all). Thought about it for a while. How about... Daemon's Helm - Terror markings and horns adorn the helmet of the creature. In close combat, if the enemy unit suffers any casualties, it loses the combat (unless it has the Fearless special rule) and must take a morale test. Sounds like it has some potential to cause complications; it's something of a wonky rule. Would this mean that Ao Oni's squad would never have to deal with the negative results of combat resolution? Avoiding No Retreat wounds would be handy. Personally, I'd be more inclined to grant them some sort of rule that lets them get out of cc; Fearless units can be way too easy to tarpit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2911646 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 29, 2011 Author Share Posted October 29, 2011 I'd be inclined to suggest something a touch above the standard bolter; at the very least a combi-weapon, if not something a touch fancier. (Kantor, Calgar, and Telion all got fancy special bolter weapons, after all). Alright, makes sense, I'll see what I can come up with ^_^ Sounds like it has some potential to cause complications; it's something of a wonky rule. Would this mean that Ao Oni's squad would never have to deal with the negative results of combat resolution? Avoiding No Retreat wounds would be handy. Personally, I'd be more inclined to grant them some sort of rule that lets them get out of cc; Fearless units can be way too easy to tarpit. Aside from 'slaughter them all - kills any units in cc with Ao Oni' I think this one works pretty well :P I mean really, it's a captain plus however many guys he has with him in combat, you would need an expensive unit, such as DC or hammernators, or lots of wounds models, to keep these guys occupied with any real success - and I might put something on the fancy new bolter to help against multiple wound models - which ends up helping me because that means that expensive/multi-wound unit is now occupied just as much as Ao Oni is :) At the same time, I'll be playing around with a hit and run - actually ATM I'm thinking hit and relocate - rules in my head, if I get one that isn't broken and makes sense then I'll post it here ^_^ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2911815 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 Alright, fancy bolter - No Respector of Men - This bolter, coloured a worn gold, spits bolts that fades through enemy armour to detonate within. The shots fired by No Respector are AP3. Also, The Terror (replaces the terrifying helm thing) - Ao Oni can only be slowed for so long - no foe will stay in combat with the Blue Daemon for long. At the end of the Assault phase, if the enemy unit is still engaged it must flee as though it lost the combat (regardless of who does win the combat). However, Ao Oni and the unit he has joined will not pursue, but will consolidate as normal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912740 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 I like it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912749 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 I like it. Good :) All together now... reworded too, because there was a poor choice of words in there :tu: Ao Oni, the Blue Daemon - Bearer of the Word (to be used as a HQ choice in Codex: Space Marines) Points Cost - 200 Stats - see Captain entry in Codex: Space Marines Wargear No Respector of Men Hellfire Rounds Artificer Armour Storm Shield Bolt Pistol No Respector of Men - This bolter, coloured a worn gold, spits bolts that fades through enemy armour to detonate within. The shots fired by No Respector are AP3. Special Rules Fearless Advance Ao Oni The Terror Fearless Advance - Ao Oni has never displayed fear or hesitation in it's actions. When seen on the battlefield it is always accompanied by a squad of warriors that follow the creature regardless of any danger or harm. Their advance is terrifying and unstoppable. Ao Oni must be attached to a Tactical or Sternguard squad, chosen before deployment, and deploys with the chosen squad. It may not leave that squad for the duration of the game. This rule gives the Fearless and Relentless rules to the Blue Daemon, and by extension the squad it deploys with. Ao Oni - Upon the death of the creature or creatures, a whisper of 'Ao Oni' goes through the minds of those who killed it, unnerving otherwise steely men. The unit that removed the last wound from Ao Oni must immediately take a Morale test at -2 Leadership. The Terror - Ao Oni can only be slowed for so long - no foe will stay in combat with the Blue Daemon if it does not wish it. At the end of the Assault phase, if the enemy unit is still engaged it must flee as though it lost the combat (regardless of who does win the combat). However, Ao Oni and the unit he has joined will not pursue, but will consolidate as normal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912761 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus 101 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 Cool, just one thing. Hellfire rounds and AP 3? That makes this guy too beast. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912827 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 He only has two short-ranged shots per turn, so it's not THAT out there... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912849 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 Have to agree with Miko; against most opponents, it's functionally the same as a plasma gun that won't get hot, but has worse AP and can't hurt light vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus 101 Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 Well, put the way Chengar said, it doesn't sound too bad. Hmm. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2912876 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 Cool, just one thing. Hellfire rounds and AP 3? That makes this guy too beast. I was actually worried about this as well, but then I realized... He only has two short-ranged shots per turn, so it's not THAT out there... Have to agree with Miko; against most opponents, it's functionally the same as a plasma gun that won't get hot, but has worse AP and can't hurt light vehicles. ... mostly the second point - while it will reliably kill two models a turn it'll still bounce off of vehicles. This can be compensated in a number of ways, but if you do, you're wasting Ao's killing power, because it's not firing at a different target. So, in conclusion, this turned out to be the way I intended - great against infantry (especially MEQ) but requires support against tanks, all while still being fairly mobile even on foot :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241031-ao-oni-the-blue-daemon/#findComment-2913422 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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