Drunken Angel Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 What it asks. The Necrons codex is shaping up to be shooty based ... maybe very very shooty based. Initial information suggests an army that can shoot very hard around the 24 inch range, is very mobile with access to cheap open topped tranport. This may take some of the appeal out of razor spam (SW and BA) and mid board GK shooty lists. Dark Eldar will not enjoy nercons much either (can you collect pain tokens off a robot?). A very strong shooting, low initiative army seems to be the codex intent here. This can only be a good thing for Blood Angels as we appear to have one of the few real threats to these Necron lists with Vanguard Vets and heroic intervention, and will still retain an advantage with FNP. Do any of you see advantges/disadvantages directly or indirectly for Blood Angels in this Necron codex release. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 From what I've read at their homepage, GW made them overall very resilient against incoming wounds due to that return roll(not sure how it's called in english) again. Their basic warriors' armour save and that return roll have worsened compared to the old codex(4+/5+ I think). So I don't think those warriors will be a problem for our assault specialists. The low initiative is also a great advantage in our favour, but that's it. Their weapons are more deathly to tanks/walkers and infantry, basically everything. I mean, a 5" S9 AP1 Template is not very nice. Those eldar-like shields increase the front(and maybe side, not sure) armour of their otherwise only lightly armoured vehicles so they are harder to destroy than it might seem at first glance. Their CC specialists are high strength and toughness robots(S5T5) and have access to invulnerable saves through shields(which was 4+ I think). And I didn't even started on their special characters. I think this release can bring us some trouble. The codex does not seem overpowered, but I think it has potential to overthrow the common RB-spam lists(a fact that I love) but also provide heavy anti-infantry shooting at short to middle range with a strong countercharge element(a fact that I don't love that much). I'm looking forward to this. They have been waiting very long for this release, and if our greatly-beloved codex author(;)) made a good codex to play against, it might shift the balance between SM and Xenos gamers for a bigger variety of opponents. Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915080 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 They will crumble in assault as they always have. DoA is good to go. G <_< Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummingBerserker21 Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 Do you think there will be a specific DOA list that will do particularly well against Necrons? For example Blood Hammer (Devastator's and Assault Squads)? I can see Sanguine Sword being even more useful in instagibbing the Necron Lords as well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crimson Cartel Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 They will crumble in assault as they always have. DoA is good to go. G B) Which is usually the case with shooty heavy armies. Great news for me, cause this is how I prefer to play my Angels.. -CC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 I've always found Necrons one of the easier opponents for BA. Now, I'm sure they will be better come Saturday. But a dedicated assault army, especially a fast one should be able to deal with them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915173 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nathan Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 till i get their codex i cant really say but i dont think it will have a big effect on my angels as i play a mixed list anyway. if i can ge y mits on a copy tomorrow ill let you know how we will fair but that depends on if the store delivery comes in early or not. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915226 Share on other sites More sharing options...
VAGABOND Posted November 2, 2011 Share Posted November 2, 2011 Hopefully my Sanguinary Guard have a field day with them, my Tyranids on the otherhand might get screwed by them. Say no more about my Deathwing though. B) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915260 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volcatus Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 *snip* Those eldar-like shields increase the front(and maybe side, not sure) armour of their otherwise only lightly armoured vehicles so they are harder to destroy than it might seem at first glance. *snip* Snorri Yeah, it's Quantum Shielding. The rule is mentioned in the WD article. It gives them Armour +2 to the Front and Sides until they suffer their first penetrating hit. So those shiny new floating jobs are 13/13/11 until you roll a proper penetrating hit (the wording seems to preclude glances). That might be challenging for some armies, but I'm of the camp that thinks DoA and Hammer lists will fare well against them. Time will tell, though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915295 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glendor Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I am thinking about starting them as my second army (ba is my first) as they are quite opposite army structures generally. However I have no doubt that the ba assault lists should have no problem taking them out. Not saying it will be easy just not as diffucult as sw or gks imho. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915302 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I have heard they might bring about the end of mech as we know it. G B) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackKnight1239 Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I wouldn't say the end, per-say. I do think the sheer amount of possible glacing hits and nice high strength weapons will make Razorbacks less appealing overall (and that really depends on how popular the army is, and how good the Necrons are at the other power lists in the meta). I think we''ll see more tougher vehicles like Land Raiders and multiple Stormravens, so just a shift in philosophy. Jump pack Assault Squad will be more popular, I think. Necrons fold in combat, and as long as you can avoid the counter-charge, you got it locked up. They are going to be a good match up, if you know how to stay out of thier static firepower. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915358 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Mat Ward seems to like to shake things up. Soon we will know more about the new codex and what is in store. G :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915398 Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp4rky Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Hi guys, I am very much looking forward to this Necron codex and I've been doing as much research as possible into it. I think Angels will have to rethink their deep striking strategies as a 'Cron warrior squad in a ghost ark will be able to move up to 6" and put out 30 (!) bolter shots at 12" giving them an effective 18" rapid fire range so if you land nearby (within charge range on your turn) you could be in trouble. I don't think Warriors have the resurrection rule (Reanimation Protocols) but the Ghost Ark transports will automatically give you D3 warriors each turn. Also the Necrons have some big high strength or low AP blast templates so deep striking and not spreading out could cost dearly. The 'Cons also have the Death Marks who can arrive by deep strike immediately after one of the enemy's squads arrive by deep strike (i.e. in their turn) which could put a downer on some plans. I think the Angels will have to be careful that they don't wipe a unit out in CC in 1 round as then they'll be vulnerable to return fire from other units :ermm: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915431 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackKnight1239 Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Mat Ward seems to like to shake things up. Soon we will know more about the new codex and what is in store. G :ermm: I have to say, that's the thing I appertiate the most from Ward. Everytime a codex of his drops, it changes the meta. People gotta adapt, and then things settle down. Frankly, remove the non-Ward books from 5th ed, and you got a really good game. Now if the rest of the designers could do the same... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacefrisian Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Mat Ward seems to like to shake things up. Soon we will know more about the new codex and what is in store. G :ermm: I have to say, that's the thing I appertiate the most from Ward. Everytime a codex of his drops, it changes the meta. People gotta adapt, and then things settle down. Frankly, remove the non-Ward books from 5th ed, and you got a really good game. Now if the rest of the designers could do the same... No the other writers shouldnt do the same, would be kind of boring if they did. (And Ward seems to favor codex creep). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915444 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackKnight1239 Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Mat Ward seems to like to shake things up. Soon we will know more about the new codex and what is in store. G :ermm: I have to say, that's the thing I appertiate the most from Ward. Everytime a codex of his drops, it changes the meta. People gotta adapt, and then things settle down. Frankly, remove the non-Ward books from 5th ed, and you got a really good game. Now if the rest of the designers could do the same... No the other writers shouldnt do the same, would be kind of boring if they did. (And Ward seems to favor codex creep). That might hold some water if Ward 'dexes were dominating the tournament scene. Kelly and Cruddace are to play for the undercosted/strongest (Space Wolves and Imperial Guard[then again, I suspect that IG's strength lies a lot in the 2500pt level that is popular for some reason]) and the worst (Tyranids) at the moment. Blood Angels, Dark Elves, Grey Knights and Space Marines are strong, but they hardly dominate. As to the older codexes, I don't think it's as much "codex creep" as much as "changed design priorities". It would make sense that the best armies in an edition are going to be the ones DESIGNED for the edition. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Hi guys, I am very much looking forward to this Necron codex and I've been doing as much research as possible into it. I think Angels will have to rethink their deep striking strategies as a 'Cron warrior squad in a ghost ark will be able to move up to 6" and put out 30 (!) bolter shots at 12" giving them an effective 18" rapid fire range so if you land nearby (within charge range on your turn) you could be in trouble. I don't think Warriors have the resurrection rule (Reanimation Protocols) but the Ghost Ark transports will automatically give you D3 warriors each turn. Also the Necrons have some big high strength or low AP blast templates so deep striking and not spreading out could cost dearly. The 'Cons also have the Death Marks who can arrive by deep strike immediately after one of the enemy's squads arrive by deep strike (i.e. in their turn) which could put a downer on some plans. Not worried by the Ghost Ark's firepower. With a priest bubble those 30 shots might just kill two of my guys if I'm unlucky, before I get to charge and annihilate them. But the blast weapons are worthy of a little more respect, especially when deepstriking. And I'm really not sure what the benefit of the Death Marks ability is. Arriving by DS in your opponents turn? Isn't that just an invitation to be shot at or assaulted? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 And I'm really not sure what the benefit of the Death Marks ability is. Arriving by DS in your opponents turn? Isn't that just an invitation to be shot at or assaulted? Actually, if they can come down after normal deepstrike rules(no limitations, for example if they had to arrive in a specific range around that unit they used to get to the field), they are formidable. Outside of assault range and ready to fire next turn without losing a turn to having moved is a good deal. And they can choose the unit they want to arrive with, so the opponent can just pick VV and deploy them out of their respective assault range. I think they are quite cool if their weapons are good as well. Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915481 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Machiavi Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 They will crumble in assault as they always have. DoA is good to go. G ^_^ Very much so. I think Necrons are going to force other armies to be fielded differently as well, and could change the overall game a bit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmaster lisander Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I m really looking forward to playing this new NEC threat, they seem to be very tough to kill off and are massively shooty. Also with adding in the new units (Necron Lychguard / Triarch Praetorians) that also count as jump infantry. I want to see how they will stack up to the BA assault squads and Death Company. I also foresee the new necron “hero” characters being a huge problem for most armies across the board. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915652 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Angel Posted November 3, 2011 Author Share Posted November 3, 2011 So it looks so far Necrons = Strong codex but not over powered, generalist troops with very good shooting; Perhaps the best shooting army yet (wait and see). Resilient, lots of buffs and powers well distributed. Some powers are going to tax the generalship of BA DOA, but there may still be funadamental advantages to assault lists. Shooting may be strong enough to change the razorspam meta, both Spacewolf and BA. Will Necrons be strong enough to change the meta of Grey Knights who are the 24 inch champions? Not an army to be careless around for anyone anymore. Some exceptional named characters/units/buffs that will stop enemy unit/IC rampages in their back lines. New codex gives them mobility which they lacked badly in the past. Perhaps the best DS counter unit in the game if using deathmarks (but its one unit against a whole army) juries out on this yet. Fast open top transports that torrent fire and will decimate any careless 3+ units out in the open. Enough fast fire power to wreck transports and easily tumble out troops. High AV transports that skim. The way the Necron codex is shaping up BA razspam need to pay attention, more so than our DOA. The Necrons are going to affect Dark Eldar, Eldar, Marine Mech spam and Grey Knights more than anything else. Strong shooting that forces the dominant GK footslogging midfield units into vehicles is good for BA, more vehicles = fewer GK. Necrons will turn rhinos and low AV onto swiss cheese anyway = nowhere to run nowhere to hide. Combat rather than shooting is looking like a good place to be around Necrons. Blood Angel units that close to combat quickly are Necrons biggest threat, they have some defense against this Units that are slow/footslogging/fragile/low AV are going to get hammered by Necrons Will Necrons outgun the IG leaf blowers? I havent heard anything on that. Over all as a BA player I like them, if the Necrons bring balance and impact slow moving heavy shooting lists and fragile high mobility lists; all the better for BA DOA lists. Deep strike reserve specialist armies are going to still enjoy a fundamental advantage, important words in a BA list will be Storm Raven, Land Raider and Jump Pack. This is only my speculative opinion based only on a partial appreciation of an unreleased codex. I would really like others thoughts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915836 Share on other sites More sharing options...
undeadfilth Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 played BA for about 5 years and love them. i did however pick up a small necron force probably a year or two ago and then just recently(about 1-2 months ago, i go to buy more necrons and their gone! but now their finally comming out and I gotta say, from a BA AND Tyranid player point of view, the new necrons seem pretty damned scary. I mean, a good Dark Eldar army can put out a whole crapload of good shooting, but they new necrons look a lot more deadly, varried, and resilient then any other shooting army. I for one am excited to play with them and against them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2915860 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nathan Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 read the dex today and yea we wont have a huge problem with them as long as you dont deepstrike( if you do they will likely have something that can shoot you, or even deepstrike with you....) reactivation protocals(aka wbb) dosent work if you compleately kill a unit. initive 2 mostly accross the bord.... str 7+ powerweapons in there to watch out for though, and a fair bit of toughness 5, though furious charge auta negate that most of the time. spiders can be used to block phsycic attacks on a 4+. there is a few tricks and stuff thay can pull but i dont think they wil give alot of problems with their first wave relaeases, then their flyier comes out in the second wave that str10ap1 line might actually be what blood lance promised but failed to be...anyways sanguard could be great for cutting through most of the troops, and normal assault marines fair game for killling their stuff with the stormsheild equivilent stuff... furious charge gives us a fair advantage over most armys against crons... just make sure you fully kill something before starting the next thing... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2916128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
vahouth Posted November 4, 2011 Share Posted November 4, 2011 Is it true that they are now 4+ armor save? How did they change we'll be back? If they still remain I2 and have worst save, I don't see how they can be a problem. Though they can't be worst than their previous edition, I mean I could beat them even with a randomly generated list. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/241355-new-necrons-codex/#findComment-2916319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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