New Chapter

[DarkLiege]

having a look at the link that Aquilanus posted, i was thinking of having the companies clans instead like the Iron hands Chapter and their successors along with the whole council thing as well.

 

One clan can be the Takeda clan, another could be the Hojo clan and such or turn all the companies into clans like the Okami clan, Kuma Clan and the likes.

 

What does anyone thing about this.

 

P.S. the Council is most likely mad up of the captains of each clan. No Homeworlds, only Fleet based/Crusade Chapter.

[DarkLiege]

having a look at the link that Aquilanus posted, i was thinking of having the companies clans instead like the Iron hands Chapter and their successors along with the whole council thing as well.

 

One clan can be the Takeda clan, another could be the Hojo clan and such or turn all the companies into clans like the Okami clan, Kuma Clan and the likes.

 

What does anyone thing about this.

 

P.S. the Council is most likely mad up of the captains of each clan. No Homeworlds, only Fleet based/Crusade Chapter.

[DarkLiege]

having a look at the link that Aquilanus posted, i was thinking of having the companies clans instead like the Iron hands Chapter and their successors along with the whole council thing as well.

 

One clan can be the Takeda clan, another could be the Hojo clan and such or turn all the companies into clans like the Okami clan, Kuma Clan and the likes.

 

What does anyone thing about this.

 

P.S. the Council is most likely mad up of the captains of each clan. No Homeworlds, only Fleet based/Crusade Chapter.

[Destecado]

@ Aguilanus: I had forgetten about Black Magic:M66, but you're right, it's pretty much in the same vein as Orion. Actually, the look of the Marionettes could be used to give a distinctive appearance to the chapter's servitors.

 

@ DarkLiege: There are several torrents that offer an online version of the manga. As I have the actual trades, I haven't needed to try these out. If however, you wish to give the online version a go, just do a search in google uner "orion masamune shirow download". The search will also bring up links to amazon, if you wish to purchase the collected issues in trade paperback form.

 

Going with an Iron Hands successor chapter could be interesting. Given the Asian motifs and the geneseed we are discussing, I'm not sure if a fleet based army would be best. The power of the Feudal Lords of Japan was very much linked to their ancestral land holdings. We should maybe consider the chapter having a single homeworld or possibly a single system. It could be that the star system or the planet is marginally habitable. The populous inhabits "islands" of civilization with a vast wirlderness. Possibly, it is not just actually physical creatures or the planet itself that poses a threat to the continued existence of humanity. The forces of chaos could also be present.

 

The presence of Chaos, could allow us to incorporate all manner of creatures from Japanese folklore (such as Oni). It may also provide a compelling reason for the chapter being established in this region of space. In regards to inspiration for the Chapter and the star system they call home, we may want to consider looking at L5R, Legend of the Five Rings. It is an RPG based off of a CCG centering around the fictional Emerald Empire of Rokugan.

[Aqui]

@ Aguilanus: I had forgetten about Black Magic:M66, but you're right, it's pretty much in the same vein as Orion. Actually, the look of the Marionettes could be used to give a distinctive appearance to the chapter's servitors.

 

@ DarkLiege: There are several torrents that offer an online version of the manga. As I have the actual trades, I haven't needed to try these out. If however, you wish to give the online version a go, just do a search in google uner "orion masamune shirow download". The search will also bring up links to amazon, if you wish to purchase the collected issues in trade paperback form.

 

I had a look last night, and found that Dark Horse Comics have the publishing rights in the US (UK?) for Orion :)

 

I may finally be able to get a copy at the end of the month! :P

[Shinzaren]

So, what has been updated and what is the new plan? Japanese theme now? I want to do something productive, but I don't even know where to start :) Just tell me what I can do to aid you.

[DarkLiege]

I'm thinking about going japanese themed clans but with animals like the wolf, raven and such. I am also think that they do not have a chapter master since the first one was KIA. The chapter has been split by this ever since with a rivalry between the chapters. They are ruled be Heads, similar to Shogun. I also still want them to be fleet based/Crusading chapter getting recruits from the different battlefields they come around.

 

Still deciding on the geneseed of either WS, RG or IH.

 

The Kumo sect and snake sect will still be included in the IA as sub bars.

[Destecado]

I'm thinking about going japanese themed clans but with animals like the wolf, raven and such. I am also think that they do not have a chapter master since the first one was KIA. The chapter has been split by this ever since with a rivalry between the chapters. They are ruled be Heads, similar to Shogun. I also still want them to be fleet based/Crusading chapter getting recruits from the different battlefields they come around.

 

It seems like we have a couple of ideas that are at odds. Clans and lineage are important, yet the chapter takes in recruits from anywhere they fight? I'm not saying it can't happen, but there has to be a reason. Are the companies barred from recruiting from the planet, either by a prohibition placed upon them by the Imperium or a self imposed prohibition (possibly by the Chapter's chaplains)? It could be that after the death of the original Chapter Master, the clan divisions within the Chapter nearly caused a civil war over who would become the next Chpater Master...kinda mirroring the political struggles between feudal lords of ancient Japan.

 

Those companies that took part in the internal conflict were barred from recruiting from the planet ans sent on penitent crusades. Possibly three companies, which remained neutral remain behind to garrison the homeworld and take care of "local" threats. I'm not sure if there is a similar concept in Japanese culture or history, but there could possibly some prohibition against the companies returning to the home system, like the Roman prohibition of generals crossing the Rubicon at the head of their army. Instead of single chapter master, perhaps the captains of the three "home guard" companies govern as a triumverate.

[DarkLiege]

I'm thinking about going japanese themed clans but with animals like the wolf, raven and such. I am also think that they do not have a chapter master since the first one was KIA. The chapter has been split by this ever since with a rivalry between the chapters. They are ruled be Heads, similar to Shogun. I also still want them to be fleet based/Crusading chapter getting recruits from the different battlefields they come around.

 

It seems like we have a couple of ideas that are at odds. Clans and lineage are important, yet the chapter takes in recruits from anywhere they fight? I'm not saying it can't happen, but there has to be a reason. Are the companies barred from recruiting from the planet, either by a prohibition placed upon them by the Imperium or a self imposed prohibition (possibly by the Chapter's chaplains)? It could be that after the death of the original Chapter Master, the clan divisions within the Chapter nearly caused a civil war over who would become the next Chpater Master...kinda mirroring the political struggles between feudal lords of ancient Japan.

 

Those companies that took part in the internal conflict were barred from recruiting from the planet ans sent on penitent crusades. Possibly three companies, which remained neutral remain behind to garrison the homeworld and take care of "local" threats. I'm not sure if there is a similar concept in Japanese culture or history, but there could possibly some prohibition against the companies returning to the home system, like the Roman prohibition of generals crossing the Rubicon at the head of their army. Instead of single chapter master, perhaps the captains of the three "home guard" companies govern as a triumverate.

 

I was going for the idea of "... that after the death of the original Chapter Master, the clan divisions within the Chapter nearly caused a civil war over who would become the next Chpater Master...kinda mirroring the political struggles between feudal lords of ancient Japan." in the chapter but just with all the companies on crusades which can't happen.

[DarkLiege]

Here's another go at the whole organization part of the chapter, tell me what you thing of it.

 

Taka Clan-Hawk symbol-Shogun Hayato—Mostly close combat(on Crusade)

Okami Clan-Wolf symbol- Shogun Kasumi---Lures enemies to trap(on Crusade)

Kuma Clan-Bear symbol- Shogun Izumo---Armor warfare(on Crusade)

Shayu Clan-Shark symbol- Shogun Kaito---Ship to ship warfare

Karasu Clan-Raven symbol- Shogun Haruka---Strikes from the shadows(on Crusade)

Sasori Clan-Scoripon symbol- Shogun Takumi—Precision strike

Kistune Clan-Fox symbol- Shogun Kiyoshi---Fortification building and siege warfare

Tokage Clan-Lizard symbol- Shogun Takuma---Relies on massive firepower(on Crusade)?

 

I'm still working on the last clan and can't think of any other animals so i just went with lizard to the far right is their Doctrine in warfare or what clan specialized in what role. some are the same while others are similar to other chapter like the raven clan(might change it to using fear instead). Not too sure on the doctrine for the kitsune clan though.

 

Hope you like it. :tu:

[Aqui]

According to Japanese legend, Kitsune are known for being tricksters, can taken human form, but are also known for being guardians. Perhaps the Clan could be known for Fortification building, or escorting duties?

[DarkLiege]

lol, i forgot that the kitsune are trickster gods, thanks for reminding me about it Aquilanus. would it work for each 'clan' to have their own doctrine? or is that to 'cliche'? i will fix that out.

[DarkLiege]

Here are some info on all the clans that i just recently came up with.

 

Note: i switch from chapter master to Head, but they are still the same.

 

 

Taka Clan-Hawk symbol-Shogun Hayato—Mostly close combat(on Crusade)

 

The Taka Clan has hone their skills in close combat battles. Most of their marines are assault marines. They wield the chainsword and jump packs with mastery, almost akin to those of the Raven Guards and Blood Angels. Be it from the air or on ground, they are masters of Assault. When their Chapter Master died, the Taka Clan like many other clans thought their captain should be the next chapter master. This has nearly broke out in an all out war. The war did not happen since the interfered of the Kumo sect and the Hebi Sect ruling they be ban from the place, putting the clan into a penitent crusade.

 

Okami Clan-Wolf symbol- Shogun Kasumi---Ambush tactics(on Crusade)

 

The Okami Clan was not less better, they are more the fearsome in every respect. The clan has more scout than any other clans. This is for good reasons too, as their doctrines are based around the ideal of ambushing their prey. Like the Taka Clan, the Okami Clan also wanted its captain to be the next chapter master. Only by the intervention of the Kumo and Hebi sect that the war was stopped with only a handful of deaths. The clan are now in a penitent crusade. It should be noted that the Okami and Karasu Clans are rivals, always seeking to outdo the other.

 

Kuma Clan-Bear symbol- Shogun Izumo---Armor warfare(on Crusade)

 

The Kuma Clan’s style of warfare is that of Armor warfare. Wielding much of the Chapters Armoury with razorbacks and predator tanks and much more. They are known to have an all out attack attitude. Like the Taka, Okami, Karasu, and Tokage Clans, they also wanted their captain to the next head of the chapter. Its not completely known as to what the Kuma Clan did to deserve to go on a penitent crusade. Whatever it is, its known only to the chapter itself.

 

Shayu Clan-Shark symbol- Shogun Kaito---Ship to ship warfare

 

The Shayu clan specializes in what they term ‘Void’ Warfare. Masters of the void, they guard the sector in which the chapter gets their recruits. The Shayu Clan are but one of the three clans who remain neutral in the war. They seek only to protect the weak.like sharks, they roam the ‘sea’ for prey.

 

Karasu Clan-Raven symbol- Shogun Haruka---Strikes from the shadows(on Crusade)

 

The Karasu Clan has and will always be masters of unseen warfare. Some say they are second only to the raven Guards and their successors. Like the Okami Clan, the Karasu clan also have a vast amount of scouts. The Karasu clan has been at odds with the Okami Clan, thinking they are savages and only cared for themselves. In that view, the clan thinks that their captain should be the next head or any other clans should be. Better them than the savageness of the Okami clan. They waged a war in the shadows with the Okami clan. When the Kumo and Hebi sect found this out, they along with the Taka, Kuma and Tokage clans were sent on a penitent crusade. They viewed this for the better as the Okami Clan did not achieved what they wanted.

 

Sasori Clan-Scoripon symbol- Shogun Takumi—Precision strike

 

The Sasori Clan were experts at pin pointing the weakness of any defense. Although, they have scouts, their most valuable asset is their undercovered agents(?). It was not known as to why the sasori clan decided to remain neutral instead of claiming the tile of head in the Chapter. Whatever it is, they have been vital to the chapter though its many missions helping both the Shayu, and Kitsune Clans as well as the crusading Clans.

 

Kistune Clan-Fox symbol- Shogun Kiyoshi---Siege Warfare and Fortifying buildings

 

The Kitsune Clan are experts in siege warfare and Fortifying Buildings making them a fortress like no others. Some claim they could rival the Imperial Fist in fortifying a building. Throughout the struggles of the ‘war’, the Kitsune remained neutral. However, this was not the case since they have know to spread lies amongst their brethrens. Why the Kumo and Hebi sects did not sent them on a penitent crusade is unknown. Some say they are need to spread false hope amongst its enemies or to help fortify worlds.

 

Tokage Clan-Lizard symbol- Shogun Takuma---Relies on massive firepower(on Crusade)

 

The Tokage Clan relies on its firepower. They wield much of the chapters whirlwinds and vindicators as well as devastator marines. The Tokage clan is said to be at odds with the Kuma clan yet is not known why. Like the other clans, the Tokage clan view themselves to be next head of the chapter. Like the Kuma Clan, reasons are not known as to why they are force to take part in the crusade. The Kumo and Hebi sects thinks that the Tokage clan are a danger to the chapter. This can only be prove as years and centuries goes and come.

 

What do you guys think of this?

 

BTW: Chapter's name will now and forever be known as the Black Suns after i come up with a reason why they were named this.

 

Here's a pic of them:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/smsbeta...&blt=F70000

[DarkLiege]

no comments on this whole idea and the info for the clans.

[Destecado]

Note: I switch from chapter master to Head, but they are still the same.

 

I’m not sure what this means. Is the title of the position Head? Also, would the head of each company be considered a Shogun or would Daimyo be more accurate?

 

_________________________________________________________________________________________

 

I think it is also important to note, that typically a company of space marines is only 100 strong. There are of course atypical examples; the Black Templars being the most obvious. The Space Wolves might possibly be another example, although, I’m not sure if they limit the number marines in a single company, but just have more than the standard 10 companies.

 

So the question becomes whether or not the various clans / companies adhere to the Codex Astartes or maintain some other form of structure. It is possible that the chapter might adhere to the CA, but still field a larger than normal fighting force, by relying more heavily on the Chapter’s serfs. The Space Marines could represent the Samurai class, who is supported by a large cadre of retainers and vassals. Such a force supporting a Space Marine company would be similar to taking imperial allies. Space Marines use to be able to do this in previous editions. Now I think it’s something only the grey Knights can do. Still it would provide a way to deepen the background of the Chapter and if you ever field an Imperial Guard army, you have a built in army concept.

 

The differences between the companies are interesting, but there is no cohesive thread that binds them together. The Chapter seems to be heading in the direction of breaking up into Warbands, if they are not already at such a state. Is each Company on a separate crusade or have any joined together to combine their efforts? Is each Commander out for himself? Don’t any consider the affect their actions have on the Chapter as a whole? Some must recognize that they are not strong enough to hold the position of Chapter Master, but are willing to throw their support behind another company commander in exchange for current logistical support or future considerations if that Company commander were to become the new Chapter Master.

 

 

BTW: Chapter's name will now and forever be known as the Black Suns after i come up with a reason why they were named this.

 

A suitable reason is not always necessary, but one possibility, since you have opted for a fleet based Chapter, could be in reference to the ships of the Chapter blotting out the sun (creating an artificial eclipse) when the entire Chapter is mustered to attack a world. To paraphrase, “Our ships will blot out the sun.” The sun turning black (as sackcloth) is also quoted in the Book of Revelation as one of the signs that marks the ending of the world.

[DarkLiege]

The differences between the companies are interesting, but there is no cohesive thread that binds them together. The Chapter seems to be heading in the direction of breaking up into Warbands, if they are not already at such a state. Is each Company on a separate crusade or have any joined together to combine their efforts? Is each Commander out for himself? Don’t any consider the affect their actions have on the Chapter as a whole? Some must recognize that they are not strong enough to hold the position of Chapter Master, but are willing to throw their support behind another company commander in exchange for current logistical support or future considerations if that Company commander were to become the new Chapter Master.

 

To answer your questions: Some companies will be banning together while others are on their own crusade. i would not say that each commander is out for their self and that some have reflected upon their 'lesson' as centuries came and gone. they want to redeem themselves to be accepted home.

 

Yes, there are some that knows that they can't be chapter masters so they threw their support in. the Kuma clan thought that having a chapter master is the only way to reunite the chapter again.

 

As you have read, the Hebi and Kumo sect are neutral, more like judges of the chapter.

 

Thanks, I try to make each clan have their own personality. As for if they are codex chapter, i still deciding on that. i could see it being interesting to have space have vassals and retainers.

 

P.S.: the whole thing of the head and chapter master thing is that I some of the info i switch between the two so ass not to confuse people reading it.

[DarkLiege]

http://i39.tinypic.com/2rnjxwy.jpg

 

Here is the Color scheme of the Black Suns Space Marine.

 

What do you guys think?

[Destecado]

The shining metal looks more like armor of european knights might wear rather than that of Samurai. You may want to consider looking at various styles of samurai armor for inspiration. The helmet or Kabuto is also an important piece of equipement.

 

Kabuto were often adorned with crests (datemono). There were four types of crests...

 

Maedate (front crest)

Wakidate (side crests)

Kashiradate (top crest)

Ushirodate (rear crest)

 

These crests could be family, clan emblems objects representing animals, mythical entities, prayers or personal symbols. The incorportation of stylized horns were common feature found on Kabuto. It could be that these crests could be used to represent the various clans / companies of the chapter. With the formation of the Space Marine chapter, there would a good amount of standardization of the overall armor. Onate helmets might be a hold over from older styles of armor. The patterns on the helmets could potentially be expanded to the shoulder pads as well.

[DarkLiege]

i was thinking that the left knee of the Space marines could be a Character of the Clan like for the Okami Clan, we could have a japanese character for wolf. The Empty shoulder pad is for the Chapters whole Symbol, a Black Sun with green lights reaching out from it.