Codex Marines VS Grey Knights

[ZhaoYen]

Ive been playing against a Grey knights list that i am having trouble with.

The list is:

 

1 Grandmaster accompanied by 3 Paladins (one of which is an apothecary).

1 Terminator Librarian accompanied by 7 Terminators.

5 Grey Knight Strikes.

1 Dreadnought with TL lascannon and Missile Launcher.

3 Servo Skulls

 

 

Any help you could provide would be very much appreciated.

Thanks! :)

[greatcrusade08]

vindicators... nuff said

 

in all seriousness, his army is low on model count.

id strongly suggest lascannons and plasma as a viable counter to an elite GK army, things like las preds, lazerbacks and vindicators are a decent fit too

[Iron Father Ferrum]

With that many Terminators, you can't go wrong with massed plasma and a Librarian. If you can punch Null Zone through his Libby's psychic hood, that'll help make sure that any plasma rounds cut through his I saves. I crumped two GK armies at a recent tourney and a third at Round One of Ard Boyz with this method. My suggestions for getting massed plasma is cannons in Tac Squads (only 5 points, as opposed to Dev squads) and take a captain of some flavor and equip your four veterans in the command squad with plasma guns (the Apothecary gives you FNP for the inevitable overheat rolls). I'd avoid Vindicators or Dreadnought-mounted plasma cannons because psycannons can rend fairly easily and shut down vehicle shooting.

[Hellios]

As these guys have said...

 

Librarian! His use is twofold!

 

First he can stop some GK psychic powers which may or may not change the course of the game.

Second he can use some pretty nifty powers such as Nullzone.

 

High S (Ideally 8+ for the paladins but but 6+ is pretty much the same for everyone else.), low AP weapons. Lascannons and plasma of all sorts is a good way to go. Lascannons will help take his dread down and also ignore 2+ saves & FNP while causing instant death on the Paladins... For the numerically superior Terminators plasma guns and cannons are a better option... That being said mass spam of plasma is also good for killing Paladins.

 

Rigged dice! I can't count the number of times rigged dice have turned what would be a crushing defeat into a glorious victory!

[Validar]

How many deamonhammers are you facing? From his shooting it'd seem he'd be sorely pressed to fight a Land Raider anywhere but in CC - and with all his stuff on foot, a Raider will allow YOU to decide who goes to CC with who. That'd be pretty nifty.

I dunno how hard the GK terminators are compared to our assault terminators, but nobody is gonna like a lascannon or two (from the land raider) followed by 5 assault terminator with hammers & shields + a Librarian with nullzone running.

 

Catching him in CC with a dreadnought seems to be a good idea too, again depending on the hammers.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

How many deamonhammers are you facing? From his shooting it'd seem he'd be sorely pressed to fight a Land Raider anywhere but in CC - and with all his stuff on foot, a Raider will allow YOU to decide who goes to CC with who. That'd be pretty nifty.

I dunno how hard the GK terminators are compared to our assault terminators, but nobody is gonna like a lascannon or two (from the land raider) followed by 5 assault terminator with hammers & shields + a Librarian with nullzone running.

 

Catching him in CC with a dreadnought seems to be a good idea too, again depending on the hammers.

 

Ehhh, a CC Dreadnought is a bad idea, I think. If the Termies are running with the baseline swords, they'll have 4+ Invul saves. With a Dread's standard two attacks, you'll get MAYBE one kill per assault phase.

[Chengar Qordath]

How many deamonhammers are you facing? From his shooting it'd seem he'd be sorely pressed to fight a Land Raider anywhere but in CC - and with all his stuff on foot, a Raider will allow YOU to decide who goes to CC with who. That'd be pretty nifty.

I dunno how hard the GK terminators are compared to our assault terminators, but nobody is gonna like a lascannon or two (from the land raider) followed by 5 assault terminator with hammers & shields + a Librarian with nullzone running.

 

Catching him in CC with a dreadnought seems to be a good idea too, again depending on the hammers.

 

Ehhh, a CC Dreadnought is a bad idea, I think. If the Termies are running with the baseline swords, they'll have 4+ Invul saves. With a Dread's standard two attacks, you'll get MAYBE one kill per assault phase.

And then the Strength 10 Daemonhammers come in at Initiative 1, and your Dread is in a tight spot.

[Validar]

the idea with the dreadnought is not to kill the terminators, but to stall them ^_^ As I said it DOES depend on the amount of deamonhammers available

[Iron Father Ferrum]

the idea with the dreadnought is not to kill the terminators, but to stall them ;) As I said it DOES depend on the amount of deamonhammers available

 

Ok, but if there are Daemonhammers present, you're not stalling for more than one or two assault phases. That's a couple of shooting phases that you're not pouring Terminator-killing-hot-plasma-death into that squad, too.

[DarkGuard]

the idea with the dreadnought is not to kill the terminators, but to stall them ;) As I said it DOES depend on the amount of deamonhammers available

 

Ok, but if there are Daemonhammers present, you're not stalling for more than one or two assault phases. That's a couple of shooting phases that you're not pouring Terminator-killing-hot-plasma-death into that squad, too.

 

Which could have also been coming from the Dread ;)

[maturin]

I think using the dread to tarpit the termies is actually a good idea (as Validar said, depending on the number of hammers around). Even if you tie up the unit for only two turns, you're occupying over half his force (and half his shooting!) with a tenth of your list? Meanwhile, the other 90% of your list kills the remaining 50% of his. When the dread finally falls the rest of your army only has to deal with a single unit.

 

Even if there's a single hammer in the termie squad it's worth the risk - two attacks, one hits, probably pens, still only 33% chance at that point of the dread falling.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

I think using the dread to tarpit the termies is actually a good idea (as Validar said, depending on the number of hammers around). Even if you tie up the unit for only two turns, you're occupying over half his force (and half his shooting!) with a tenth of your list? Meanwhile, the other 90% of your list kills the remaining 50% of his. When the dread finally falls the rest of your army only has to deal with a single unit.

 

Even if there's a single hammer in the termie squad it's worth the risk - two attacks, one hits, probably pens, still only 33% chance at that point of the dread falling.

 

 

Now add to that all of the rending hits it'll be taking from psybolted-up psycannons before it makes base to base contact. I've lost Land Raiders to those shennanigans. I'm firmly convinced that the only units that could ever WANT to be in melee with GKs are Wyches, Harlequins, and Banshees.

[Warp Angel]

Vindicator. When you don't know what the solution is, Keep adding Vindicators until it is solved. S10 pie plate works wonders on apothacaried paladins.

 

Land Raider Crusader w/Multi Melta. Hard for them to crack except in CC and the massive number of twin linked shots gives the possibility (not likelihood) of 17 wounds per round of shooting.

 

Thunderfire Cannon. It's cheap, and with a small footslogging list, they're going to be hard pressed to deal with it if you deploy it properly without compromising its ability to defeat your main force.

 

Keep your tac squads mounted in Rhinos and mobile for as long as possible. Put yourself in a situation where he has to split his force to be effective against yours.

 

Las/plas razorbacks. Relatively cheap, no 2+ saves.

 

Bikes as troops. Like GK, good mid ranged shooters, can carry plas and melta, relatively cheap and more than able to avoid GKs getting into hand to hand.

 

It's honestly about understanding that you defeat small, slow, elite armies by maneuver and volume/quality of firepower, not by trying to match them at anything.