Validar Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Hey folks, I'm not at all sure this is the right place, so appologies beforehand if it isn't. I just watched quick 'n' dirty a couple of times, amazed how easy he was able to get a good result. Now, I'm a noob painter and I'm still working to find just that style and level I want for my army. I have realised that I'll never be painting at a competition level, but I still want a decent looking army on the table. This guy's technique with using wash as basecolour enabled him to get a really good result with relative ease. Problem is that I'm painting Blood Ravens. After searching back and forth on youtube and google I havn't been able to find a guy that told me how to do a (dark) red space marine quick and dirty - that is to get everything you need for tabletop quality in a rush. Last part is important. If I don't see results I get tired and stop alltogether. Basically the question is: How do you basecoat in a quick and easy way? How do you do it and what kind of results do you get? What are the shortcuts if you want a space marine army painted, but quick and tabletop quality? Talk to the noob, folks, give the basics. Do you use coloured primer? Why/why not? Is washing basecoat viable? For which colours and for what result? Without further ado: Debate ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCC Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 The simplest solution is surely a red under/basecoat. Plenty of manufacturers do red sprays if you don't have access to an airbrush. Ravendove has a fantastic Sons of Orar army that are based with Army Painter red spray. Once the spray is dry a quick wash and some highlights should give you a quality tabletop result. The exact combination of washes and highlights depends on the red you want, I think Ravendove's army is a little too orange for BR myself, but some experimentation should help you find the right combo. Instead of a brown wash maybe try a green one? It'll darken and enrich the red and give instant shading. You can then highlight up from there to get a nice BR red. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2932919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warbringer Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I've had good results with Dragon Red Primer for my blood angels which is good and then use washes to add depth? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2933003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdOfEntity Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Validar, you're making me sweat here. I hate the concept of speed painting, but... If you're going to do it prime with grey and THEN basecoat in your red. I almost always advise having a primer that doesn't serve as your basecoat. I'd advocate for using a grey primer here, but if you want something really dark use black primer. Once the red is on you can do a set of brown/black washes to tone it down and get some shadows. Then all of your accent work can be picked out with black and a number 1 brush, and you can build up from that. I don't know what your accent colours will be, but the red will be easy enough. The only challenge in this is going to be your detail work like aquila's. When you're putting that aquila's basecoat on you have a good chance of slapping a touch of paint on your lovely red and marring it. Most of the time I suggest working on your absolute darkest colours first, and then work up to lighter colours. In this case, you won't be. If you have a steady hand you'll be okay, but you're going to knick one here and there anyways. It just happens. That's a few minutes of cleanup that will impact your painting speed. 1) Prime White or Grey 2) Basecoat Red (a spray is fine) 3) Drybrush highlights 4) Wash with darker browns. EDIT: The way you're going to get faster at painting is just to paint a lot of figures. The way to get better is to take your time and use the basic and complicated techniques over and over. If you can stick with it you'll get much quicker, and you can get a great quality too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2933096 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super-Piglett Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Curious why you recommend not using primer as your basecoat? I got a can of Red coming from Army Painter, hoping it isn't a waste :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2933538 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemal Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Grey, black and white "Primers" (not model paints) are much better at adhering to surfaces (look at the FW website, they recommend using a proper auto-spray rather than modle paints... which yes, Chaos Black and SKull white are...) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2933716 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdOfEntity Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Curious why you recommend not using primer as your basecoat? I got a can of Red coming from Army Painter, hoping it isn't a waste :blink: Two reasons really. 1) Primer is tough stuff. Auto primer in particular has served me well. Priming with it, then painting normally, and finally sealing with Dullcoat makes a resistant model. Which is ideal for Tabletop games. If it were going in a display case I'd say using regular paint for a basecoat is fine, and you probably won't need any kind of varnish or sealant. 2) Technique. When you have a primed coat of white you will be extremely careful to ensure the entire surface of the model gets painted. Having white prime showing through my paint jobs made me a lot more precise and careful when basecoating. Spray Basecoats in particular I have to be careful with, as there's always a surface on the model that didn't get as smooth a coating as others. Even with Spray basecoats I had to go back and do some serious touch-ups. Don't worry, your can isn't going to be a waste. Just don't assume it will get a proper level of paint in every corner. It's still a heck of a time saver. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2933747 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super-Piglett Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Still not sure I follow. But I will take your word for it. I ordered a can of white at the same time as the red, was planning on using it for some other models, but I will try priming in white, spraying red and working from there when it gets here. I have high hopes that a few better brushes and some of the new techniques I have been reading on will improve my painting, thanks for the tips! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2934199 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warbringer Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Just use the Army Painter red i've had nothing but good results. It just takes more time and effort than normal priming with white, just ensure you get a good coat, you don't need the white. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2934364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Validar Posted November 30, 2011 Author Share Posted November 30, 2011 Really great that you guys are up for giving some noob input! Thanks a lot to everybody and keep the debate going! IdOfEntity: Don't look at it like I want a quick way to paint my army so I can go to tournaments and embaress the entire community with my horrid speed-painting. Think of it as getting the basics right, doing it nice and easy taking all the shortcuts there are. From there I believe I can really improve my painting. I've done a bit of heresy painting on some Warmachine minis where I start with a wash for the majority of the model, followed by drybrushing white, from there going with 3 colours: Mechrite red (highlighted by blood red), liche purple (highlighted by the OLD warlock purple, which is actually purple) and shining gold (over a coat of calthan brown and washed with sephia). It works well and is simple, the highlights aren't all that full, but getting more proper as I paint more. I would be able to get access to an airbrush, if that'd help anything along. It would be limited, though, so only basecoats seems viable at this point. I had a horrible experience with army painter red. It completely removed all details from my model, dunno what I did wrong, since those Sons of Orar look absolutely stunning. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2934407 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobPhoboS Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Just to quickly chip in... I highly advocate getting yourself an airbrush/compressor kit. I bought one a couple of weeks ago from a great company on ebay for £70 - it's perfect for this kind of thing (which I'm doing at the moment). Saves you heaps of time, and you can still paint nice details in the traditional freehand brush way later ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2934453 Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterdyne Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 Just to quickly chip in... I highly advocate getting yourself an airbrush/compressor kit. I bought one a couple of weeks ago from a great company on ebay for £70 - it's perfect for this kind of thing (which I'm doing at the moment). Saves you heaps of time, and you can still paint nice details in the traditional freehand brush way later :P And Vallejo do coloured polyurethane surface primers. I've just used the black and grey so far, but they're excellent and clean up really easily. NEVER using chaos black again. :-) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2935802 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronKobra Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 And Vallejo do coloured polyurethane surface primers. I've just used the black and grey so far, but they're excellent and clean up really easily. NEVER using chaos black again. :-) agreed! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2935830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ming Posted December 4, 2011 Share Posted December 4, 2011 A few years back (now) we did a painting charity event...my goal was to paint pre-primed 10-model 40K squads (or equivalents) 3+ colors in an hour or less. I painted about 60 models and a rhino in an afternoon, everything from eldar to orks and marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2936663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Validar Posted December 4, 2011 Author Share Posted December 4, 2011 Ming: What was the quality and how did you do it? Do you have any pictures of the result? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2937098 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Validar Posted December 5, 2011 Author Share Posted December 5, 2011 trying to hijack the thread in a new direction while we wait for Ming :) How would you paint vehicles in a similar style to the marine in quick 'n dirty (link in OP)? Could you actually just wash an entire vehicle the same way as the marine and get a decent result? Or is there another way? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2937679 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemal Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 you can wash, just have to constantly work the wash so it doesn't pool... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2937779 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gailbraithe Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 For plastic models, I recommend using one of Krylon's Fusion spray paints. The Fusion line of paints bonds with plastic and provides a decent painting surface for highlighting. These Khorne Berzerkers were basecoated with Fusion Burgundy and washed with Badab Black. http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/1710/khorneberzerkers.jpg Looks nice, takes no time at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2938064 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobPhoboS Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 And Vallejo do coloured polyurethane surface primers. I've just used the black and grey so far, but they're excellent and clean up really easily. NEVER using chaos black again. :-) What I've done is CB primer, then used a white (will get Model Air specifically next) to bring a main surface to paint on, with the black just in the deepest parts. As you're spraying it, the colour goes from mid grey to white, so that's just worth noting as well. I'm never painting directly onto black again ! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/242595-fast-painting/#findComment-2938435 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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