Thunderwolf load outs, or how I returned to the army I love.

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

So after a needed departure for the past few months, I have returned to the Fang with a renewed vision for my army and a more sober, cigarette free body. The rumors about me turning to the forces of chaos are totally fabricated and I have be examined for any signs of taint and none where found. I've also turned away from my other two armies realizing that my Wolves where suffering due to lack of attention. Priorities, brothers. Priorities.

 

Most of my friends want to play 1500 point games as they tend to last for shorter periods of time, meaning more games per evening. I'm down with this, but as anybody who knows me and my preferred army type, Wolfwing at that low point level blows jokaero junk. It's not very fun to play against DE or BA with 21 models on the table... Well I made the decision that power armor isn't as bad as I thought it was (not true, I have always know that a 3+ is above average) and pulled out the Grey Hunters, dusted them off, and went to work doing any touch ups, remodels, and completing the packs that have sat in a box for over a year.

 

I suppose I have rambled on enough now, and should get to the point of this thread: Thunderwolves.

I am running a Wolf Lord on TWM, with Wolf Claw/Storm Shield, WTN, SoTB, and Runic Armor.

 

I want three or four Thunderwolf cavalry for him to ether join or cause additional panic/pressure for my opponent. I am wanting to use the silly wound allocation shenanigans with this unit, as that seems to be a given when running Thunderwolves. I have NO experience running the giant wolves, but I have read a decent amount on the web in regards to them. Still, I want to know what those of you have found to be successful load outs for a three to four model unit.

Thanks all!!

 

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[Rikochet]

3 TWC can be pretty damn wicked if you can get them into combat before more than 1 dies.

 

Im far from the TWC expert but from the loadout ive tried its the 1 thunder hammer, 1 storm shield, 1 meltabomb combo that I find the most usefull, if youre facing grey knights it might be worth it switching out the meltabomb and adding a few points for another ss. I know you said you know the wound allocation deal, just dont forget to give the ss-guy no other upgrades than the ss.

 

Obviously make sure theyre out of the way from the heaviest firepower, even with the ss, then run them hard toward the unit/tank(s) you want them to deal with. They are actually quite annoying for enemy players, and can make their points worth even if they end up dying early, if for nothing else; for providing a distraction.

 

Even an enemy player that is fairly confident in his ability to take them down will have his heart racing when facing them just in case they reach their target ;)

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

I agree about the opponent panicking for certain!! My buddies are very much frightened by Wolf Lord Finnvid Gunderssenn already, I want to up their stress levels by adding a few Thunder wolves. I was thinking along this line:

#1. CCW/Bolter

#2. CCW/SS

#3. CCW/SS/Melta Bomb

#4 TH/SS

 

High costed for a 1500 point list, but tough as nails too. I can't tell if I am putting too many points into this unit.

 

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[Cowmonaut]

I'm currently doing this for my 1750/1850 lists:

 

Thunderwolf Cavalry 175 points

1 with Power Armor, Bolt Pistol, Close Combat Weapon, Frag and Krak Grenades

1 with Power Armor, Bolt Pistol, Close Combat Weapon, Frag and Krak Grenades, Meltabombs

1 with Power Armor, Bolt Pistol, Wolf Claw, Frag and Krak Grenades

 

Meltabombs are solely for wound allocation shenanigans. I felt 5 points for 1 attack was an okay spenditure. I opted for the Wolf Claw over the Thunderhammer for several reasons:

 

1. Less expensive
   
2. Re-rolls to hit are more valuable
   
3. Initiative 1 is not worth the S10 trade off
   

 

To expand on that last bit: Each 50 point model has only 2 wounds. You will be taking fire from the enemy before you get into combat. Most enemies are MEQ. You'll want to be striking at least at the same time as they do or you run the risk of the model dying before he gets to attack. Thunderwolves aren't exactly a glass hammer, but they have tendencies along those lines...

 

 

Also, to each their own but I'm hooked on the chaper WGBL for being on a Thunderwolf. I load out as follows:

 

Wolf Guard Battle Leader 180 points

1 with Power Armor, Frost Blade, Storm Shield, Thunderwolf Mount, Wolftooth Necklace

 

Hitting on 3+ and wounding on 2+ I find I get 4 power weapon hits on the charge. In games where I can fit the points, Saga of the Warrior Born ends up being incredibly fun because of this. By all means, let your Wolf Lord be equipped as you wish but I'd suggest throwing down Saga of the Warrior Born instead of Saga of the Bear. With T5 you don't suffer from Instant Death all that much.

[Rikochet]

Indeed!

 

Im not so sure about putting more than 2 ss in there, sure they might live a little longer but its not really worth it. Also, I know some people suggest taking a bolter, but if you play it right, its not really a necessary pick, its not gonna help you, well, anything ;)

 

As far as going with for example a Wolf Claw instead of TH works I suppose, I just find a TH more usefull myself, however, a wolf claw might be a wiser choice in some cases, but the benefits from the thunder hammer, not to mention its cool to wield a big hammer while riding a wolf, outweigh the WC, i mean, while your spening points on a weapons upgrade, why not spend it on something that actually makes a big difference from the already rending attacks.. In fights where you will be striking last anyway, a thunder hammer is pure awesome.

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

I have to agree with Rikochet that a guy on a wolf with a huge hammer looks awesome!!

 

I want to use the unit as a lightning rod within my army, so the reasoning behind all of the SS was for that reason. I play DE a lot more then I wish I did, but it s the army my buddy chose to play, so I have to deal with it. AP 2 shots kill everything in my army pretty reliably, so I thought a tough as nails deathstar would/could help me. On the other hand it is a huge point sink.

 

So obviously I need some help with the weapons load outs still. Cowmonaut, do you find the lack of an invuln save compensated by the T5?? Rikochet, do you mean I should be running Bolters, not bolt pistols??

 

Thanks all.

 

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[Rikochet]

Just forget what I wrote about the bolter :P

[Forté]

No idea on these as I don't run them but welcome back.

[nurglez]

My usual TWC load out was a lord (very similar to yours) and 3 TWC, 1 ss, 1 fist, 1 stock. I found that generally the TWC were just ablative wounds and rarely did much damage, but it could have been due to the list I was running (alongside my drop podding logan wing).

 

I've also thought of using lone TWC equipped with SS+TH, as I fought against an army using 2 of these and they really hurt my paladins, killing draigo too ( I went on to win the game, but only just).

 

Also, welcome back :D

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

Nurglez, Forte, it's good to be back!!

 

As I explained above I wanted a stronger list with a little more flexibility at lower points. I want to fit in the TWL with the 3 or 4 TWC along side a unit of TDAWG, 2 GH packs (maybe 3), and 2 LF packs. Then once I move back up to 2K and above I can run the giant wolves along side my WolfWing!! :P

 

I like the idea of 2 TWC with TH/SS as a kind of Retinue for the lord, screening them behind the rhinos until I can charge in for some close combat killing action. Then again it's a lot of points for one model kitted that way and I would have no ablative wounds. I suppose at this point it becomes a personal factor along side a points factor.

 

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[Valerian]

First, I'll ensure that it is clear that I've never played with TWC, so I'm not an experienced user. However, that being said, I'd like to point out that first, I think you need to determine what you want your TM Lord + TWC to do for your army (be specific!) then design them to do that.

 

If you want them to be a dedicated Assault Force, then you'll want to man and equip them to be able to get into contact with the enemy unit with enough combat power left to chew through the enemy unit in about 2 assault phases (yours and theirs) at which point you are free to move on to the next target. Is that what you want the unit to do for you? Do you think your TWC unit can chew through an enemy Grey Hunter pack, or Strike Squad, or "fill in the blank" right now? Is that what you want them to do anyway? If it is, and you don't think they can, then you might want to man them with the additional models, and equip them with the right weapons, to accomplish what you have in mind.

 

Alternately, perhaps you don't want a dedicated Assault Force, but rather intend for them to be a Mobile Reserve, a force that'll hang in the background, maneuvering into position, and committing where most needed to exploit opportunities given to you by the enemy, or, worse case, to shore up a friendly vulnerability (e.g. prevent an enemy break-through). Mobile Reserve forces don't have to be large, nor wield tons of combat power, they just need enough to make a difference where they are applied. If you design them to be a Mobile Reserve, then please ensure that you use them this way; don't forget what their purpose is, and try to use them in a manner for which they weren't intended (e.g. don't treat them like an Assault Force). When plans go awry, you may need to use them for something other than what you designed them for, just don't be surprised if they don't complete their task.

 

I hope this was helpful,

 

Valerian

[Godhead]

I have ran TWL/TWC since the new codex came out. I LOVE them and hate them all the same time. Sadly they are one of my favorite units and I think I've only ran one list that didn't include them. I found that list rather bland and boring. Having said that, I think the TL with a TWC retinue is a points trap. The TWC essentially become ablative wounds to keep your lord alive as he charges heedless across the board. The games where the dice are good, 600 points can wreck my opponents entire 2k point army, other games, they die and I never recover. realistically I think the Thunderlord can be just as effective if you'd just run him with a pack of fen wolves. The trick is to not end up with the wolves and the lord in the same combat. People just kill your wolves and the lord breaks and rolls off the board.

 

I feel that in the past I have spent too many points on the lord and his cav retinue. I then heaped a ton of responsibility on them in order to win games. One of the previous posters hit the nail on the head. You need to pick a role for your cav/lord and build them for that. Weight of numbers is the bane of TWC, either through shooting or cc. Hordes of orcs/guard/mid str shooting/combats where multiple units pile on is what render the TWC ineffective. If the TWC/TL are going to be the spearhead then you need to build them for that and have support, or you need to build them as a counter assault unit that supports your other units.

 

When I think about all the games I've played my TWC have really seemed to do best when used defensively. They are great counter assault units, but when used as a spearhead, I often ended up isolated and piled in upon. I sometimes end assaulting something I'd rather have another unit deal with, but I choose to assault anyways in order to prevent them from eating any more anti infantry fire for a round or two. I also ran into the problem of not being able to consistently support them. Often, my rhino's carrying GH's to support the cav would get stunned or immobilized leaving my opponent a turn or two of combat where he can focus on the cav.

 

My loadouts typically consisted of lord with WC/SS RA/WTN TWM 2x fen wolves saga of the bear. 4 TWC ss/th, ss, bolter, bp/cc. They were pretty durable, but had to shoulder a ton of the work.

I've run that lord with an Iron Priest before with mixed results, I have ran 2x lords with fen wolves with mixed results. I have also ran 3 man TWC units which were meh. I have ran 5 man squads which performed pretty well, but I found myself missing the cc results of the Lord.

 

Rune priest Rhapsody, what you want is basically my 2k list except I think you are trying to do it at 1500 points and still include TDA. My list is typically 1x RP, 1x TWL, 1XTWC squad, 2x ghs in razorbacks, 2x 8 man GHs in rhinos, and 2x longfang packs. I just don't have the points to put TDAWG on the table as much as I'd dearly love to do so. Obviously you can cut back on some of the kit on the TWC and the lord, but I ended up slowly adding this stuff to my units as it seemed what ended up work best for what I was trying to have them do (win me games single handed). I think you might have to re-evaluate what you want your unit(s) of TWC to do and try to trim as much fat as possible to allow them to do that job. I think you will struggle to run a TL and TWC pack in a Loganwing list. You end up cutting some much other support to make them fit.

 

I don't want to run a SW list without my TWC, so I've went back to the drawing board myself. I'm still working on tweaking a new list and re-evaluating their role, hopefully I'll be able to find a way to better support them, or a better way to have them support my list.

[Torin]

Indeed!

 

Im not so sure about putting more than 2 ss in there, sure they might live a little longer but its not really worth it. Also, I know some people suggest taking a bolter, but if you play it right, its not really a necessary pick, its not gonna help you, well, anything :blush:

 

As far as going with for example a Wolf Claw instead of TH works I suppose, I just find a TH more usefull myself, however, a wolf claw might be a wiser choice in some cases, but the benefits from the thunder hammer, not to mention its cool to wield a big hammer while riding a wolf, outweigh the WC, i mean, while your spening points on a weapons upgrade, why not spend it on something that actually makes a big difference from the already rending attacks.. In fights where you will be striking last anyway, a thunder hammer is pure awesome.

 

 

Good day brother,

 

IMO having 2 SS is just nice in a TWC. Plus a TW Lord that makes 3,which is simply awesome. Sorry.. im just a TWC freak.. have a list with 10 of them, bot dont bother going there its a waste of points. 1 + 3 is just nice to play in a 1750 list. Added with some GH in droppod to distract enemy fire help the TWC survive longer. But like Rikochet said having a TH is superbly cool. I you play againts demon.. this is one weapon they fear.. went againt skullbrand twice.. smack him to INI 1 next round.. dead on the second.. awesome. ... just my 2 cents

 

cheers

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

Valerian: Again, your words are well received and quite prolific for my current dilemma. I admit that I often, more than I care to admit, fail to consider what each unit's job will be before the game even starts. Here, I am thinking of mixture of support and assault. A few wolves to benefit from the cover save that a rhino grants as they follow it into assault range. I can either charge them out and around the rhino, or deploy my Grey Hunters and support them once combat has ensued.

 

I am liking the small retinue idea with two additional cavs to help the lord without hindering him. I am leaning towards both with SS/Bolter/Melta Bomb, OR one with the previous kit and the second running a SS/Frost Blade/Melta Bomb. The blades granting a +1 Str seems really good.

 

Godhead: Thank you for the thought's as well!! I am indeed wanting to run WGTDA at higher point levels, but not at 1500, which is what I am wanting to kit this particular pack for. WolfWing at low point levels like 1500 usually end up a massacre for me, especially since my most often opponent is playing DE Dark Lance 'spam'. With that in mind I need a unit that mostly can act like a fire magnet, a distraction, and still be able to fight once close combat is reached.

 

My meta, if you will, has seen very little of this unit on the table top, so I am banking on the fact that most of my opponents will be scared and hopefully focus a little too much fire on them while I get the Hunters into place and start picking things apart. I like the idea of the TWC also being able to handle small elite units, either tying them up for a few turns, or destroying them and going in for more.

 

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[Godhead]

Well they can definitely act as a distraction, and TWC eat it to the splinter cannons more so than dark lances, so you should be all good there.

[Rune_Priest_Rhapsody]

My DE buddy runs a Splinter Cannon on his 'chibi-Ravager', but I more often than not target that and take it down. Then the goddamn bikes, hate those bikes...*grumble*

 

Well since it looks as though GW won't be releasing any official TW models, I placed an order with Mr. Dandy yesterday. Got three beasties on their 'merry' way.

 

I've got a game tomorrow with the DE at 1500. I am running the TWL with two TWC (proxying dreadnoughts) both with storm shields, one TH, and one FB. I'll rant upon my thoughts after the game.

 

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