Are we over looking something?

[Sir Blayse]

In most BA games it seems to come down to one of two types of lists. DoA or RazorSpam, but are pretty good at what they do, but our codex has more to offer.

 

I just wonder why we don't see more of us running our Terminators. In my opinion we have some of the best sets of TDA's in the game, yet no one seems to field them. I'm currently working on a few new lists for my LGS and have noticed that I'm getting a lot more out of my TDA's than usual. Horde armies are down, GK's and Necrons are becoming more prevalent. One force can do serious damage to them and that is assaulting them.

 

The basic idea here is to run 3 ten man assault squads with PF, 2 melta's, and drop pod with locator. Deathwind if you choose to as well.

Next run one to two assault terminators squads, depending on points and such. Go heavier than normal on TH/SS, I'm going with 2 LC"s and 3 Hammers.

Run a Libby with SS and one to 2 Priests in TDA.

List is at close to 1500 points, but can be altered slightly. May or may not need 2 Priests, but I like the FNP, Furious charge aspect.

 

 

On the drop your pods should go close to enemy transports or heavy weapons, the main goal is to get the beacons close enough to make sure you don't need more than one turn to get into assault and still viable to drop something. The squads will probably go down easy, so you must stay close to bring as much fire to the target as possible. Monoliths are really nice targets now, as are those Necron barges.

 

You will force your opponent to have to either take out the squads or the pods, unlikely they can do both. This is the distraction, you will have to hope for good dice for reserves, but I've had good luck with them of late for this... Terminators should hit turn or two after drop, combined with the libby and priest your termies should weather whatever fire comes at them. Once you make your charge, you should fair pretty good against either the GK or the Necrons. I would probably give the Libby Unleash Rage to ensure plenty of hits from all your weapons. I've been tempted to swap one RAS for a Tac Squad, but so far haven't tried it out.

 

It's still in the testing phase and is not great against everything, just an idea to deal with a changing Meta. Regular DoA is just not cutting it against GK's and Necrons. Some might say bring a LRC for the termies, but I prefer to spend those points just buying another squad. Anyone else try this or have any ideas?

 

I've also been testing a DC in Drop Pod, doesn't have the melta option, but gets the FNP benefit. If you do this, run them cheap. If you run Tac's then it would be for the teleport homers, makes it harder for enemy to stop you precise attack.

 

I did try scouts before, the infiltrate to get close was nice. But I was barely able to keep them alive until turn 2. Plus, they don't really help kill anything armored.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

We do have great terminators. You just have to figure out how to build the right list to feature them.

 

G :P

[bushman101]

eh, there are a couple of BA termi lists that people swear by, Blood Rodeo being the most talked about.

 

I'd personally run more termis if I owned a StormRaven. Everytime I run them, my opponent kills them off by dumping a ton of ranged attacks into them. And while that usually allows the rest of my army to run amuck, 200+ points is a bit too much for a decoy.

[AstraWlad]

I usually play a termy-based list. Something like this (for 2000 pts):

 

Reclusiarch

Sanguinary Priest

7 Assault Terminators (3 TH/SS, 3 LC)

all in

LRC (MM, EA)

 

5 Assault marines

in

LR

 

Furioso Dreadnought (Talons, EA)

in

Stormraven (LC, MM)

 

Librarian (JP, Shield, Lance/Rage)

10 Assault marines (JP, 2*melta, PF)

 

5 Scouts (rifles, camo)

 

Dreadnought (LC)

 

I still experiment with it, but it shows some pretty good results.

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

I don't use Terminators because, while I want my army to be strong, I'm not particularly concerned about utter optimization and I'd rather use my elite slots on SG, SP and a Chaplain (since I appear to be one of the few BA players who takes a Captain and a Libby) and with a ten-strong DC in a LRR I probably couldn't fit them in points-wise even if I wanted to.

 

I'm a bit of a fluff-junky so I'd rather take a unit that is quintessentially BA than a stronger unit that any SM army could take.

[Morticon]

In most BA games it seems to come down to one of two types of lists. DoA or RazorSpam, but are pretty good at what they do, but our codex has more to offer.

 

 

Check my sig and the batreps.

(edit: No termy stuff there- but that was posted in a general disagreement of the opening premise! )

[spec.ops]

I'm unable to validate Terminators in any of my lists.

 

Terminators take up one Elite slot - no problem.

 

Now how to best deliver Terminators?

 

Stormraven - Yes.

 

But, now I want to take full advantage of the Stormraven's abilities...

 

Add a Furioso to Stormraven taking away two Elite slots leaving one slot for three Priests - Problem.

 

Time to add an HQ or two - more problems.

 

LR - Sure

 

But then, why not take 16 DC over a few Terminators.

 

Plus, if I want Terminators why not play GK's?

 

That's my point of view on the whole thing.

[AbusePuppy]

Jumpers and Razorback lists are the two most obvious BA armies, but hardly the only ones.

 

@spec.ops

 

Assault Terminators can work just fine in a Stormraven or Land Raider list; yes, the former largely mandates all three of your EL slots be filled in a particular way, but that isn't a terrible thing. As far as comparing them to Death Company, I feel they are complementary rather that competing; the DC open up another Dread to put in your other Stormraven (you don't want to run just one) and are better against some targets and worse against others.

 

"Tactical" Terminators might appear useless at first glance, but they can actually be quite strong. With a Priest nearby for FNP, they can be ridiculously tough against most firepower, getting 4+ cover against Lascannons and Plasma, 2+ armor against pretty much everything else (including the ubiquitous Missile Launcher) and shrugging off all but the most voluminous fire with their extra 4+. Toting a Cyclone Launcher gives them some ability to reach out and touch things and when targeting infantry their hail of Storm Bolter shots can't be ignored, either. In short, they are nigh-impossible to shoot to death and too dangerous in melee for most armies to want to engage them point-blank. Supported by ASM to cover their weak points (like horde infantry) and bring the necessary Meltaguns, they can make a formidable army.

 

Grey Knight Terminators aren't really comparable at all; different ranges, different support abilities, different complementary units.

[Sir Blayse]

All seem to be really good points, just putting out something that I've found to be really good as a different approach.

I love my DC, but against the current meta of my LGS, they just don't do as well. They actually cost more than my terminators, but do have a chaplain attached. They will usually manage to kill one unit, then die to massed firepower. This is usually in the form of weapons that are AP 3, ie. Basilisk, Destroyers, and Missile Launchers. Most of these either negate the FNP and armor, or put out enough FNP rolls to kill the squad. The Termie can shrug off most of that and still get FNP against the more mundane weapons. The Storm Shields serve as an answer for the fact that a lot of armies are now going to be faster than us, even with FC. Not going with the LRC or Stormraven in this build type, trying to keep the body count up a bit higher, plus the AV 12 doesn't really do much when you don't have a lot of armor already.

 

By not taking the LRC you can have 2 squads of Terminators, or one big squad of them. I run several different lists for my BA. Before Necrons came out I placed first in our LGS tourney with full on DoA. Now it does not fair as well. The destroyers are able to rip up RAS with AP 3 weapons and stay out of range of assault easily. RazorSpam is getting ruined by GK and DE.

 

Vanguard are useful, but only manage to get one kill if they manage to HI. Without FNP, they don't get further than that and are uber-expensive for what I'm getting.

 

So not saying others need to run this list, just sharing what I've been testing out. If others are able, then they might try it out against similiar opponents and we can compare how it does.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I've seen some batreps elsewhere that featured a large squad of terminators either starting on the table or deep striking. I'd run them in either a Crusader or Stormraven for the reliability of delivering them where needed. They work very well with a Priest|Corbulo and a Chaplain|Recluisarch|Librarian attached. I played around with a 2k list but never was able to get it just right. I definitely think they can work.

 

G :P

[librisrouge]

I used to run Assault Terminators in a LRR and it never failed me. It was the linchpin for the whole army and the current meta is so Melta heavy that I know I'm going to be able to close with most opponents.

[killersquid]

When I expand my DoA I plan to add a terminator squad to add as another deepstrike distraction. The only elites unit I intend to use otherwise is some Sanguinary Priests. They would be a nice tough distraction to toss right into my opponents face. I know they wont benefit from the DoA rule, but it'd be too fun not to include.

[knife&fork]

When I expand my DoA I plan to add a terminator squad to add as another deepstrike distraction. The only elites unit I intend to use otherwise is some Sanguinary Priests. They would be a nice tough distraction to toss right into my opponents face. I know they wont benefit from the DoA rule, but it'd be too fun not to include.

 

I've run tactical terminators with jumpers in 1k-1750 lists. I've found that they work a lot better when the points allow you to take a full 10 man squad and that the 85 pt TDA priest is always worth it.

[Sir Blayse]

Yeah, I really love my JP Priests. I'm guessing that have one with a 2+ save and FNP would be golden. I honestly think that our Terminators are better than the others and give a new twist to our army. I prefer assault termies since they can have a 3+ invul, but tacticals would not be bad either.

[Drachnon]

Personally I have been playing with the idea of putting assault terminators (4 claws 1 hammer) with a PA priest and PA reclusiarch in an Stormraven but its so expensive so I never been able to fit it into my list.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I think tactical terminators will make a come back.

 

G :unsure:

[Vilicate]

I've been running them quite a bit in my Drop Pod/DoA list. They're great if you've got a homing beacon on your scouts.

 

Reclusiarch w/ JP, IP

Librarian w/ IP, Sanguine Sword and Unleash Rage

Chaplain w/ JP, IP

2 x Sanguinary Priests, PW and 1 JP

6 TH/SS Terminators

10 DC in DP w/ TH, PW and 2 Inferno Pistols

10 Assault Marines, 2 Meltas, PF

9 Assault Marines, PF

8 Assault Marines, PF, 2 x IP; DP

10 Scouts, PW, MB and Homing Beacon

 

-2k

[I am Legion]

This thread is actually very interesting as I'm in the middle of painting 9 more terminators (i need to find one regular one to finish the regular squad). CC BA Terminators cost more for us than the regular marine codex, and are generally hard to fieid in small games. But The nice thing about mixing them in with other high priority units (Baal Preds/Vindicators) is that they will either be left alone till its too late or they will absorb most of the enemy firepower, especially with a sanguinary priest!

I deal with a variety of armies but lately its been necrons, dark eldar, nids and grey nights. All great codexs with great units, but believe it or not, there isnt much melta in those armies. The dark eldar one is a horde, fast transport army, but I tried out some terminators vs them and once those DE transports are down, the DE player will throw everything at the termies to slow them down cause they rip right through everything including talos'.

I personally love Termies due to second edition where they were unstoppable. even now, they are quite formidable in a variety of situations. I'm still having a hard time deciding whether to beacon them or SR them onto the field.

 

@ Vilicate - I actually kinda like that list. I'll try running it for fun, see how it fares VS nids.

[Leonaides]

that they will either be left alone till its too late or they will absorb most of the enemy firepower

Problem being - if they're in a transport (LR/SR) then they are probably already the highest priority target, and if they're not then they can be fairly safely ignored till turn 3 or 4 (either foot-slogging up the board or T2 DS and then unable to do anything till T3 earliest) unless your opponent has nothing else to shoot at...