Disciples of Horus

[Allfather1]

Warriors of Chaos

Disciples of Horus

R

ecruited into the Sons of Horus only a few months before the Horus Heresy broke out Shadryss Khiron is a true follower of Chaos, having never known anything else. It's was on Isstvan III that Shadryss would prove his worth as a warrior, taking part in the final assault on Loyalists. During which his sergeamt was killed. On Isstvan V sergeant Shadryss managed to ambush a Salamander captain and loot his power armor to replace his own damaged suit. During the seven year march to Terra he earned much glory, attracting the attention of the Chaos gods, receiving many gifts for his loyal service. When they finally arrived on Terra Shadryss proved his worth as a commander, being brevetted captain of the Sons' 17th company. Fiercely loyal to his Primarch, the news of Horus' death broke Shadryss, in his grief he led the remnants of his company into a berserker charge. Ending only when First Captain Abaddon broadcasted that defeat was inevitable.

During the retreat to the Eye of Terror Shadryss rose to prominence within the Legion, raiding ahead on his Strike Cruiser Lupercal's Blade to secure supplies or hinder the Loyalist forces rushing to bring them to justice. For three millennium Shadryss served Abaddon loyally and was counted among his most trusted lieutenants. Even though he led his forces to many victories, he did it without conviction.

During the last days of the 4th Crusade Shadryss was approached by Dark Apostle Charon of the Word Bearers, Charon reignited the fire within Shadryss when he told him that there was a way to bring Horus back. Addressing ever soul aboard Lupercal's Blade he told them that the Gods had spoken to him, telling him about a way to resurrect Horus, for his soul had not been destroyed but shattered and scattered across the Warp.
From that day forth Captain Shadryss Khiron and his company became known as the disciples of Horus, dedicating themselves to ending the Long War. Over the years the warband has grown beyond a single company and Shadryss now commands five companies of Chaos marines.

Organisation

Over the years the disciples have united many other warbands under their banner. While most warbands choose keep their own identity, there are those so utterly dedicated that they have become a company of the disciples. All however acknowledge the authority of the Shadryss and his company of terminator armored Justaerin.

Not offically part of the Disciples these warbands are designated Auxillary Cohorts.

The companies of the Disciples consist of roughly twohundred Chaos marines excluding Neophythes.
Each company is organised into four Cohorts, each consisting of forty Chaos marines commanded by a lieutenants except the first which is double strenght and commanded by the captain. Though designated a company the Justaerin are infact a double strenght cohort led by captain Shadryss

Beliefs

In matters of faith the disciples follow the teachings of Charon, who rules the Reclusiam as Grand Apostle. Each of the warbands will have a Dark Apostle to guide them in matters of faith and indoctrinated their recruits.

The Disciples of Horus believe that Horus' soul is shattered into pieces and that when enough of these pieces have been collected that they will be able to summon him, to lead them to victory. While the companies of the Discples of Horus worship Chaos Undivided, this does not always applies to the Auxillary Cohorts, for example the fifth Auxillary Cohort (Brandon's Butchers) serve the Blood God.


So what do you think?
When I joined the B&C I began work on Sons of Horus but I never finished it.
This I my second attempt.
Below is the first post of the previous thread and while several things have been scraped, it gives a general idea of what I want.
•They believe that Horus and the Emperor are fighting eachother so that neither can reincarnate. This would explain why Horus has not reincarnate, although receiving sacrifices for almost 10000 years. They believe that when one reincarnates that the other will follow but that the first one will be the most powerfull.
•In the holds of their flagship lays the corpse of Horus. •The Sons of Horus are far more organized than other warbands.
•The warband consist of marines from various Legions and chapters.
•Their battlecry is "For Horus Lupercal, He will rise again".
•The majority of the warband worship Chaos Undivided along with Horus.
•They were formally a company of the Sons of Horus.
•The Sons of Horus number around 500 marines. They are further supported by several highly trained cults.
•They mostly target Shrine worlds and already rebelious worlds, in order to decrease the power the Emperor recieves by offerings.
•They search the galaxy for a perfect body for Horus to reincarnate into.
•The Sons of Horus believe that Sanguinius weakened Horus just enough to be killed by the Emperor. This has resulted into a particular strong hate towards the Blood Angels and their kine
•The warband keeps several relics from the old Legion and Horus. (armour of Horus, His standard, mabye several company banners)
•They try to stick as close to the teachings of Horus ad possible.
•They see the Black Legion as traitors and refuse to take part in Abaddon's black crusades. Instead targeting their own targets.

[Ace Debonair]

Hullo, and welcome back to the Liber.

 

Since you're not new here, I hope you'll forgive me if I jump right into the C&C.

 

Recruited into the Sons of Horus only a few months before the Horus Heresy broke out Shadryss Khiron is a true follower of Chaos, having never known anything else. His first taste of battle was in the trenches and wastelands of Isstvan V, where he killed a Salamander captain in single combat, taking his suit of Terminator armor as his prize.

 

In his first combat your raw-recruit chap kills a Captain and steals his Terminator armour.

It's not even like Shadryss there had help from his squad, because it's single combat.

 

This I find very, very unlikely.

 

 

 

I don't really have too much issue with the rest of your stuff as an idea, but what exactly is your warband looking for? How do the pieces of Horus' soul manifest - as people? Objects?

[Allfather1]

Hullo, and welcome back to the Liber.

 

Since you're not new here, I hope you'll forgive me if I jump right into the C&C.

 

Recruited into the Sons of Horus only a few months before the Horus Heresy broke out Shadryss Khiron is a true follower of Chaos, having never known anything else. His first taste of battle was in the trenches and wastelands of Isstvan V, where he killed a Salamander captain in single combat, taking his suit of Terminator armor as his prize.

 

In his first combat your raw-recruit chap kills a Captain and steals his Terminator armour.

It's not even like Shadryss there had help from his squad, because it's single combat.

 

This I find very, very unlikely.

 

Yeah, I was thinking it he would be badly wounded but I see your problem. What if his whole squad attacked the captain and he was the only survivor?

 

I don't really have too much issue with the rest of your stuff as an idea, but what exactly is your warband looking for? How do the pieces of Horus' soul manifest - as people? Objects?

 

I was thinking that these pieces were scattered in the Warp and that they could be summoned on specific locations and times to be containted in vessels.

They would be looking for specific items (blessed weapons, Daemon Weapons, Relics) to summon these shards from the Warp.

They would also be searching for "The Perfect One" ( a body so great that it could contain the essence of a Primarch.)

[CantonWC]

Ready to rain on your parade!

 

Recruited into the Sons of Horus only a few months before the Horus Heresy broke out Shadryss Khiron is a true follower of Chaos, having never known anything else. His first taste of battle was in the trenches and wastelands of Isstvan V, where he killed a Salamander captain in single combat, taking his suit of Terminator armor as his prize. During the seven year march to Terra he earned much glory, rising to the ranks of the Justaerin and even attracted the attention of the Chaos gods, receiving many gifts for his loyal service.

 

Echoing Ace here. Come on. Your FNG slaps around a Captain and steals his armor to rub it in, and in the few short years leading up to the siege of Terra he catapults himself into the Terminator Elite?

 

Tone him down please. Or at least make him believable.

 

During the retreat to the Eye of Terror Shadryss rose to prominence within the Legion, raiding ahead on his Strike Cruiser Lupercal's Blade to secure supplies or hinder the Loyalist forces rushing to bring them to justice. For three millennium Shadryss served Abaddon loyally and was counted among his most trusted lieutenants. Even though he led his forces to many victories, he did it without conviction.

 

But Abaddon turned on Horus after the failed Siege of Terra. You know, not having achieved ultimate victory and all that. And he renamed his guys the Black Legion so that the hated name of Horus would be expunged. So why did this guy choose to stick around for another 3,000 years? Why didn't he just go along with everyone else instead of clinging onto the memory of Horus?

 

The Disciples of Horus believe that Horus' soul is shattered into pieces and that when enough of these pieces have been collected that they will be able to summon him, to lead them to victory

 

Canonically, Horus is gone forever, his spiritual essence completely annihilated. So ultimately, these guys are just fooling themselves. When are they going to wake up to their delusions?

 

CWC

[Allfather1]

Echoing Ace here. Come on. Your FNG slaps around a Captain and steals his armor to rub it in, and in the few short years leading up to the siege of Terra he catapults himself into the Terminator Elite?

 

Tone him down please. Or at least make him believable.

 

I will. I think I will not have him join the Justaerin but do you think it would acceptable he got brevetted to captain during the Siege of Terra?

 

But Abaddon turned on Horus after the failed Siege of Terra. You know, not having achieved ultimate victory and all that. And he renamed his guys the Black Legion so that the hated name of Horus would be expunged. So why did this guy choose to stick around for another 3,000 years? Why didn't he just go along with everyone else instead of clinging onto the memory of Horus?

 

Well, I was thinking Shadryss' spirit was shattered, he didn't have the desire to run of and try overthrowing the Imperium. He also thought Abaddon was the best man suited to replace Horus. When he finds out Horus could be brought back he drops everthing and goes and tries to make it happen.

 

Canonically, Horus is gone forever, his spiritual essence completely annihilated. So ultimately, these guys are just fooling themselves. When are they going to wake up to their delusions?

 

Never, I might have a sidebar about marines just giving up and leaving but the majority will never give up.

Maybe I'll add another sidebar telling of a daemon whose essence was scattered across the Warp and who is pulling the Disciples' strings.

[Allfather1]

editted the first post.

 

R

ecruited into the Sons of Horus only a few months before the Horus Heresy broke out Shadryss Khiron is a true follower of Chaos, having never known anything else. It's was on Isstvan III that Shadryss would prove his worth as a warrior, taking part in the final assault on Loyalists. During which his sergeamt was killed. On Isstvan V sergeant Shadryss managed to ambush a Salamander captain and loot his power armor to replace his own damaged suit. During the seven year march to Terra he earned much glory, attracting the attention of the Chaos gods, receiving many gifts for his loyal service. When they finally arrived on Terra Shadryss proved his worth as a commander, being brevetted captain of the Sons' 17th company.

 

Shadryss no longer defeats a terminator captain and does not rise to the rank of Justaerin. When he kills the Salamander he is already sergeant and ambushes the Salamander.

[CantonWC]

Well, I was thinking Shadryss' spirit was shattered, he didn't have the desire to run of and try overthrowing the Imperium. He also thought Abaddon was the best man suited to replace Horus. When he finds out Horus could be brought back he drops everthing and goes and tries to make it happen.

 

Just a quick response. So why does this guy stick around? Why is he serving Abaddon who is undoubtedly ranting and raving all the time about how Horus was weak, was a failure who choked when the chips were down. And this guy doesn't bother to speak up in defense of Horus even if it would get him killed?

 

I don't know how a guy with a broken spirit, mourning the memory of his lost gene-father can continue to serve in a competent capacity for so long, to the point where Abaddon still considers him useful enough to keep around.

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

In his first combat your raw-recruit chap kills a Captain and steals his Terminator armour.

It's not even like Shadryss there had help from his squad, because it's single combat.

 

This I find very, very unlikely.

 

Why?

 

In Canis Wolfborn's fluff it states that Canis came close to matching Wolf Lord Harald Deathwolf in single combat when they first met. Wolf Lords have a (very slightly) better stat-line than a Salamander's Captain would and Canis has been living with wolves his whole life without benefit of any kind of martial training.

 

I don't see why it's so unbelievable that this dude could take down a Captain.

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

Canonically, Horus is gone forever, his spiritual essence completely annihilated. So ultimately, these guys are just fooling themselves. When are they going to wake up to their delusions?

 

CWC

 

Ultimately, everyone in the Imperium is fooling themselves with this God-Emperor business. I don't see why these guys can't believe in something that, to my knowledge, isn't anywhere near as definitively impossible as you make it sound while the rest of the Imperium believes in something that the person they venerate denies categorically.

[PyronusSouria]

Canonically, Horus is gone forever, his spiritual essence completely annihilated. So ultimately, these guys are just fooling themselves. When are they going to wake up to their delusions?

 

CWC

 

Ultimately, everyone in the Imperium is fooling themselves with this God-Emperor business. I don't see why these guys can't believe in something that, to my knowledge, isn't anywhere near as definitively impossible as you make it sound while the rest of the Imperium believes in something that the person they venerate denies categorically.

Agreed, I actually really like the idea of them trying to collect the soul fragments of Horus and reassemble them. Even if they're unsuccessful in terms of reviving Horus, they would likely gather a lot of powerful and strange artefacts of Chaos.

 

After all, Chaos is all about delusions of power and glory, false promises and all that jazz.

[CantonWC]

In Canis Wolfborn's fluff it states that Canis came close to matching Wolf Lord Harald Deathwolf in single combat when they first met. Wolf Lords have a (very slightly) better stat-line than a Salamander's Captain would and Canis has been living with wolves his whole life without benefit of any kind of martial training.

 

I don't see why it's so unbelievable that this dude could take down a Captain.

 

I think Canis Wolfborn is what you might call a Marty Stu character.

 

Ultimately, everyone in the Imperium is fooling themselves with this God-Emperor business. I don't see why these guys can't believe in something that, to my knowledge, isn't anywhere near as definitively impossible as you make it sound while the rest of the Imperium believes in something that the person they venerate denies categorically.

 

It can be debated whether or not the Emperor really is a god, or if he will become a god the moment the golden toilet fails and he finally kicks the bucket. But this is pretty much how I always understood it to be. Horus hasn't come back because there's nothing left for the Dark Gods to resurrect.

[Dosjetka]

An interesting concept, but I'm backing CantonWC in both of his statements above.

 

Canis is an exception, not a rule. And as CWC said, I'd say there's a hint of Mary Sue to him.

 

As for the Emperor being a god, well the original Astartes Legions didn't believe that he was a god and a good chunk of the Astartes Chapters today probably (and I say probably because there's a lot of Chapters we don't know about) don't believe that he's a god in M41.

 

Ludovic

[Ace Debonair]

I don't see why it's so unbelievable that this dude could take down a Captain.

Because I'm not talking about on the tabletop, dude. :nuke:

 

You've got one guy who's taking part in his first battle, with all the excitement and terror that entails, and another guy who's been through the most horrific enemies the galaxy could throw at him for the last hundred-plus years (going on the basis he's lived long enough to become a Captain in a Legion, and earn himself some terminator armour into the bargain).

 

Given that the two would likely have fairly equal skill, strength, and so forth, experience (and terminator armour) will be pretty decisive difference makers in favour of the Captain.

 

 

I'm not saying the recruit couldn't win. It's not impossible, by any means.

I'm just saying that him doing so stretches my suspension of disbelief perilously close to breaking point.

[Allfather1]

Just a quick response. So why does this guy stick around? Why is he serving Abaddon who is undoubtedly ranting and raving all the time about how Horus was weak, was a failure who choked when the chips were down. And this guy doesn't bother to speak up in defense of Horus even if it would get him killed?

 

I don't know how a guy with a broken spirit, mourning the memory of his lost gene-father can continue to serve in a competent capacity for so long, to the point where Abaddon still considers him useful enough to keep around.

 

I'll need to fix it but Shadryss would stay with Abaddon because Abaddon is the best general/warlord Chaos has to offer and knows that he is the best chance they have to overthrow the Imperium and avenge Horus.

 

Warbands of the Black Legion are mostly doing whatever they want untill Abaddon demands their presence. At least that's my opinion.

So he wouldn't have to put up with it very much. But I think I'll make Shadryss a sergeant untill he leaves the Black Legion, this way he also doesn't become to much of a mary sue.

Maybe I should shorten the time he serves under Abaddon? So he doesn't have to put up with it for 3000 years.

 

While in the cannon Horus is forever gone, this doesn't have to mean that the people in-verse know. The Imperium knows it but Chaos could just regard it as propaganda.

 

Because I'm not talking about on the tabletop, dude.

 

You've got one guy who's taking part in his first battle, with all the excitement and terror that entails, and another guy who's been through the most horrific enemies the galaxy could throw at him for the last hundred-plus years (going on the basis he's lived long enough to become a Captain in a Legion, and earn himself some terminator armour into the bargain).

 

Given that the two would likely have fairly equal skill, strength, and so forth, experience (and terminator armour) will be pretty decisive difference makers in favour of the Captain.

 

 

I'm not saying the recruit couldn't win. It's not impossible, by any means.

I'm just saying that him doing so stretches my suspension of disbelief perilously close to breaking point.

 

I agree with you that I made him overpowered and that's why I made him a sergeant and the time of the Dropsite Massacre. I also plan on him leading his men in a ambush on the captain and his command squad. Who will not have Terminater armor.

[Ace Debonair]

I agree with you that I made him overpowered and that's why I made him a sergeant and the time of the Dropsite Massacre. I also plan on him leading his men in a ambush on the captain and his command squad. Who will not have Terminater armor.

 

Having re-read your opening, that's much better. I approve! :lol:

 

And besides, why even try and win your fights with honour when you can do it the Real Chaos Marine way and take a good stab at that unprotected back? :lol:

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

In Canis Wolfborn's fluff it states that Canis came close to matching Wolf Lord Harald Deathwolf in single combat when they first met. Wolf Lords have a (very slightly) better stat-line than a Salamander's Captain would and Canis has been living with wolves his whole life without benefit of any kind of martial training.

 

I don't see why it's so unbelievable that this dude could take down a Captain.

 

I think Canis Wolfborn is what you might call a Marty Stu character.

 

Ultimately, everyone in the Imperium is fooling themselves with this God-Emperor business. I don't see why these guys can't believe in something that, to my knowledge, isn't anywhere near as definitively impossible as you make it sound while the rest of the Imperium believes in something that the person they venerate denies categorically.

 

It can be debated whether or not the Emperor really is a god, or if he will become a god the moment the golden toilet fails and he finally kicks the bucket. But this is pretty much how I always understood it to be. Horus hasn't come back because there's nothing left for the Dark Gods to resurrect.

 

Which is pretty much my point. That's your interpretation and holds no real weight outside of your head. I'm not saying you're wrong, but if this guy wants to use his/her interpretation to explain his/her chapter's backstory then why can't he/she?

 

-------------------------------------

 

Is a scout taking down a Captain usual? No, it's not. Is it impossible? No, it's not. However, a scout taking down a Captain is exactly the sort of thing that would put said scout on a fast track to leadership, particularly in a CSM warband where might is valued over any real tactical or strategic genius, and is exactly the sort of thing I'd expect to read in the fluff. 40k is based on ludicrously over-the-top stories and I really don't see why a scout taking down a Captain is beyond the pale in a game, the established and 'official' fluff for which has a human (augmented, but still essentially human) living in the warp and carving "Kaldor wuz 'ere" on a Daemon-Primarch's heart.

[Ace Debonair]

Is a scout taking down a Captain usual? No, it's not. Is it impossible? No, it's not. However, a scout taking down a Captain is exactly the sort of thing that would put said scout on a fast track to leadership, particularly in a CSM warband where might is valued over any real tactical or strategic genius, and is exactly the sort of thing I'd expect to read in the fluff. 40k is based on ludicrously over-the-top stories and I really don't see why a scout taking down a Captain is beyond the pale in a game, the established and 'official' fluff for which has a human (augmented, but still essentially human) living in the warp and carving "Kaldor wuz 'ere" on a Daemon-Primarch's heart.

 

Without wishing to derail the thread, I'll try and answer this one too.

It's all about suspension of disbelief, plain and simple.

 

It's much easier to believe that a rookie killed a Captain in his first battle (who is basically the same guy in terms of strength and speed, only he's seen every possible move this rookie could make a hundred times or more) by attacking him with a mob via ambush than it is to believe he successfully killed the veteran warrior with the better gear and crazy fighting experience face-to-face, one-versus-one.

 

And since you brought up the Draigo incident, that entire book consists of Mat Ward jumping on people's suspension of disbelief - there's a great deal of topics already about the matter, particularly in Amicus. Just because it's official doesn't make it a good idea. :)

 

 

To get back on topic, however;

 

Have you had any ideas about what colours the Disciples of Horus wear?

Is it black to reflect the Legion they came from, pale-green to represent their longing for the Horus days, or something else entirely?

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

Again, I don't see why there's such a problem with it. You'll accept an alternate dimension composed of raw emotion that is somehow navigable; you'll accept daemons, you'll accept psykers, you'll accept an alien race that reproduces by releasing spores and who mature and who simply know stuff like how to build combustion engines and the like with no training whatsoever and you'll accept that machines will only work with the correct amount of incense burning nearby but a scout killing a Captain is beyond the pale? I don't see it.

 

I could see why there'd be a problem with it if it was just some random dude idly chopping down the Captain but this guy is a scout who very quickly rose to lead his own chapter. Killing a Captain is almost mundane for that kind of backstory.

 

I'd also point out that in the first Space Wolf novel two Blood Claws (one of whom is on the verge of unconsciousness) take down a Chaos Sorcerer described as having "millennia of experience and all the gifts that the powers of Chaos could lavish".

[Ace Debonair]

Again, I don't see why there's such a problem with it. You'll accept an alternate dimension composed of raw emotion that is somehow navigable; you'll accept daemons, you'll accept psykers, you'll accept an alien race that reproduces by releasing spores and who mature and who simply know stuff like how to build combustion engines and the like with no training whatsoever and you'll accept that machines will only work with the correct amount of incense burning nearby but a scout killing a Captain is beyond the pale? I don't see it.

 

That's how suspension of disbelief works.

It's partly content, partly presentation, partly personal opinion.

 

If your suspension of disbelief wasn't stretched too thin in this case, then cool.

Either way, we really ought to stop hijacking this thread. :devil:

 

I'd also point out that in the first Space Wolf novel two Blood Claws (one of whom is on the verge of unconsciousness) take down a Chaos Sorcerer described as having "millennia of experience and all the gifts that the powers of Chaos could lavish".

I can honestly say that's never been a problem for me, although that's because I've never read it. :whistling:

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

Is what we're doing considered 'hiacking' around here? Genuine question; I've been on here less than a month and the moderation is unlike any forum I've ever been on so I don't really know the ins and outs of what is considered acceptable.

 

To me, the guy put his fluff up for debate and we're debating it. I don't see it as hijacking but maybe I'm wrong.

[Dosjetka]

In a way yes and no. Yes because you are trailing off-topic as you are discussing personal points of view, while what the OP wants is critique on his works. While what you are doing is still within bounds of the topic, I think Ace is trying to stop this going too far as you could both go on and on and on about the same subject and still not have the same opinion as the other.

 

Right now, you both know what the other thinks is believable and what isn't and it's up to the OP to decide if he thinks that a Scout killing a Captain one-on-one is what he wants or not, because at the end of the day, it's his fluff, his warband, so he chooses what goes and what doesn't :whistling:

 

Ludovic

[Allfather1]

Have you had any ideas about what colours the Disciples of Horus wear?

Is it black to reflect the Legion they came from, pale-green to represent their longing for the Horus days, or something else entirely?

 

I was going to have them wear the black and gold of the Black Legion. While the offically they would do it out of mourning (repressented by the black) and use the gold to symbolise a new dawn coming.

 

But more importantly this would make them less noticable by the Imperium. They are just another Black Legion warband in their eyes.

[CantonWC]

Thank you, Ace.

 

Don't mention Matt Ward in front of me. Just don't.

 

Without additional content from TC, I'll wait on additional commentary.

 

CWC

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

You see, the thing is Canton... Mat Ward works for Games Workshop and you don't so when you're trying to discover whether a written piece 'works' in the context of 40k what do you compare it to? A piece of the official fluff or the opinion of an internet poster who thinks he knows better than the people Games Workshop employ?

 

What Allfather has written fits perfectly with the kind of things we find in the official fluff for the game and you apparently have an issue with the kinds of things included in the fluff. That isn't Allfather's problem, that's yours.

 

This is a game of toy soldiers set to the backdrop of O.T.T heroes overcoming impossible odds and triumphing despite great adversity and Allfather's fluff fits that perfectly. Again, it isn't his problem if you want to get sniffy about the fluff or pretend that it's rooted in some grand literary tradition that Ward is currently micturating upon.

[Dosjetka]

You can compare it to a piece of GW fluff, sure, but the opinion of "that guy on the internet" who's telling you your fluff needs to be tweaked a bit to make it more believable is all the feed-back you're most likely to get. And if others come and say that "that guy on the internet" who says that the fluff needs tweaking is right, then I think that should be all the incentive a budding author needs to accept that his idea needs tweaking a bit if he wants his work to be more widely read and critiqued.

 

Right now, we all know what your personal opinions are, so now please stop bickering about this and let Allfather move on as he wishes. He knows what we think about what he wrote and as I stated earlier, it's up to him to decide what he shall now do!

 

Ludovic