Midwest Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I was thinking that both the Furioso and the Baal Predator were 2nd edition releases. However, the Angels of Death codex doesn't have a Baal Predator (nor the options for it under the Predator entry), and while the Dreadnought entry does allow for two power fists, they only come with storm bolters with no option to upgrade/replace one SB with a heavy flamer. Is my memory wonky, and they didn't come out until 3rd, or were they indeed released during 2nd edition? And if they were 2nd edition releases, anyone know the White Dwarf(s) that might have the rules for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igotsmeakabob!! Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 3e was the advent of these, iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 While 2nd Ed allowed both the Furioso Dreadnought and the Baal Predator to be fielded, they weren't "Blood Angels-specific", nor were they officially recognised as distinct patterns. 2nd Ed was the time of "buy a vehicle for xxpts+weapons", and allowed you a great deal of leway to arm your vehicles however you wanted to model them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 and back then a twin linked AC could do 2x9 str 9 shots . and if it killed a unit and another one was within 2" of the killed one it could switch . good times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 While 2nd Ed allowed both the Furioso Dreadnought and the Baal Predator to be fielded, they weren't "Blood Angels-specific", nor were they officially recognised as distinct patterns. 2nd Ed was the time of "buy a vehicle for xxpts+weapons", and allowed you a great deal of leway to arm your vehicles however you wanted to model them. Wait, were there actual rules made for them at some point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 While 2nd Ed allowed both the Furioso Dreadnought and the Baal Predator to be fielded, they weren't "Blood Angels-specific", nor were they officially recognised as distinct patterns. 2nd Ed was the time of "buy a vehicle for xxpts+weapons", and allowed you a great deal of leway to arm your vehicles however you wanted to model them. Wait, were there actual rules made for them at some point? Well, take the 2nd Ed Dreadnought, for example : http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/l634/dswanick/Dreadnoughtdatafax.png For 145pts you could buy a "Furioso" Dreadnought, but it was just a regular dread with two fists and stormbolters. For 175pts you could buy the iconic dreadnought with Assault Cannon, Fist and stormbolter. Or for 225pts you could field a "Mortis" dread with dual TL Lascannons. None of them had unique rules, and none of them were "named" patterns. Interestingly you could also field one with dual Assault Cannons for 205pts. Also, 2nd Ed was the era of "model it and give it some rules". Just about anything you could model was a "legit" unit iun 40k, and the rulebook promoted home-brew models, units, and rules. So if you wanted to model a Predator with twin-linked Assault Cannons in the turret, and 2 sponson-mounted Assault Cannons you went a head and did it and then made up your own custom "datafax" for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 That's actually different than the options from the Angels of Death codex. But, as I said, that book also allows for a dual-power fist option minus the heavy flamer upgrade. But you mentioned that they were avail in second, and at least with the Baal the AoD book does not allow for assault cannons in the turret (it doesn't have lascannons either, just an autocannon - only the sponsons have options). Hence this thread - I thought the original Baal and Furioso (with heavy flamer) models were released in 2nd edition, and since they're not in the AoD book that would have meant their rules would have been in a White Dwarf. But, it seems they weren't actually released until the 3rd edition codex. I'm asking as I played a lot of 2nd and some friends are starting a 2nd edition club, and I'm wanting to do Blood Angels and was hoping to use the current kits for these two as I like them quite a bit. I didn't play BA back then, but I could have sworn (at least with the Furioso kit) that the first models of these two were released at some point during 2nd edition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 That's actually different than the options from the Angels of Death codex. But, as I said, that book also allows for a dual-power fist option minus the heavy flamer upgrade. But you mentioned that they were avail in second, and at least with the Baal the AoD book does not allow for assault cannons in the turret (it doesn't have lascannons either, just an autocannon - only the sponsons have options). Hence this thread - I thought the original Baal and Furioso (with heavy flamer) models were released in 2nd edition, and since they're not in the AoD book that would have meant their rules would have been in a White Dwarf. But, it seems they weren't actually released until the 3rd edition codex. I'm asking as I played a lot of 2nd and some friends are starting a 2nd edition club, and I'm wanting to do Blood Angels and was hoping to use the current kits for these two as I like them quite a bit. I didn't play BA back then, but I could have sworn (at least with the Furioso kit) that the first models of these two were released at some point during 2nd edition. I agree. I'm pretty sure the models were in early White Dwarfs, let me do some searching thorugh my old WDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 That Dreadnought datafax was from either the core game box or the dark millenium box, I'm not sure if it remained 'legal' or if it was replaced by the more limited ones in the codices. Dark Millenium did include 'rules' (mostly just some suggestions and points for weapons) for making you're own datafaxes but they were opponents consent only, 2e was no more "make up whatever you want" than 3rd edition was with the Chapter Approved VDR. For what its worth according the Solegends the 1997 & 1998 catalogues included the metal turreted Predator Destructor and Annihilator but not the Baal. The latter also included the vanilla marine dreadnought but no Furioso. Addendum: According to the 3rd edition BA codex the example Baal's assault cannons were converted from the Ravenwing Land Speeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Yup - Baal pred model came in with 3rd ed - I remember that I was dissapointed that I didnt get to roll 6 sustained fire dice because they did away with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igotsmeakabob!! Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 I started both 40k and BA right when 3e released, I don't recall the Baal or the Furioso being available right then and there.. but then again, I was 11 or 12 at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Posted January 16, 2012 Author Share Posted January 16, 2012 Thanks for the replies all - was hoping to make use of the new models 'as is' but no worries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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