thor1234 Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Recently I have been playing my Knights against my friend and his chaos army, he refuses to leave home without Abaddon, I am quite competant as a player, but Abaddon seems to be exceptionally effective aagainst my forces, he arrives with a bodyguard of Tzeench terminators totting various combi-weapons, Grey knights cant bring enough high AP shots to kill them with shooting, and once Abaddon get stuck in he slaughters whole units, in my last game he went through 10 paladins in one round of combat!, in previous games this is mimicked to one degree or another, with abaddon killing everything, recently ive used tactics around holding a piece of terrain anf forcing Abaddon and his boys to fight at I1, this has almost worked several times, but my mates ability to role 4+ saves when it counts astounds me, so how have my fellow brothers dealt with this monster? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Clausel Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 I usually play with my semi draigo wing against chaos. Most of the time my mate uses abba and that retinue. I usually aviod them til later on, and then focus fire everything on it! Terminators go down to massed fire. And I always keep my draigo and his paladins near. This should drop them down considerably. Then charge with draigo and his squad. Make sure that draigo is the only guy fighting him. He can take the punishment with his 3+ save and EW. The paladins finish of the retinue mostly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968388 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tankred Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 OK, to be honest, I don´t know much about his capabilities on the field. But it sounds that you could need a combination of paladins, grandmater and scriptor. And then: fun in closecombat. The grandmaster: psychotrokes, rads and those defensive grenades. The scriptor: that "dangerous and heavy terrain" thingie, perhaps quicksilver The paladins: obvious ;) Perhaps equipped with a warding stave to deflect instakills. Well, that would be my first try against Ezekyle Abbadon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 he arrives with a bodyguard of Tzeench terminators totting various combi-weaponsHow large is the bodyguard unit and how does he deploy?If he deepstrikes you have a full turn of shooting. If he is in a 'Raider, stop the raider early and let Abaddon footslog. Here is a tip that your opponent will hate, Chaos Terminators aren't fearless and if they flee, then Abaddon has to flee with them. The following isn't feasible with Grey Knights but Horde armies can force-feed him low-cost/sacrificial units and wait until he rolls a few 1's. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drachnon Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Hmm I never actually played against Abaddon iirc he had S10 and hit and initiative high with a 'power weapon'. I guess paladins aren't that great a choice against him as their extra wounds won't help (instant death) nor will their increased ws. Have you tried to out terminator him? I'm not sure on the cost of Abaddon and his squad but it sounds like you could field a full squad terminators with a grandmaster equipped with grenades as a counter unit. Give them the hammer of righteousness strategy and a banner, 1 or 2 hammers and the rest swords and halberds. If you give the GM all grenades including brain mines and add a MC to his sword he would be 225 points dropping his T by one (combined with hammerhand you'll be able to wound his terminators on 2+ and reroll all 1's to wound), there's a decent chance of increasing chances to hit (results 2 and 3 of the psystroke grenade). The brain mine is to discourage him from getting Abaddon in contact with your GM (chances of succes with brainmine are only 1/6 but if you get it off in first round of combat you're pretty much guaranteed to win) while the blind is to make his charge useless (you'll have 3 attacks per model from banner while he is stuck on 2 for his regular terminators). You'll only need to survive Abaddon's attacks with the 4+ inv saves from your terminators but other then that I think we should be able to deal with him. EDIT: Wait another thought, vindicare assassin with shield breaker against his inv (it is from wargear right?) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglez Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Fight fire with fire, bring Draigo to tank abaddon and let your pallies rip through his escort :jaw: Plasma cannons would help, though if you are using pure gk that might be a problem. Using vehicles to 'control' who the squad charges and slow their movement down can be useful too. Seeing what kind of list you bring would be helpful, if he uses icons to deepstrike in taking those out, or destroying the vehicles carrying them far away could be useful too :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968398 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormshadow Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Well now, this sounds interesting :) I am all about the Deathstars. Even back in the days when we were called “Daemon hunters” I prided myself on having the biggest and nastiest Deathstar around. Not knowing what your opponents list looks like I speak in general terms when I say that the best way to deal with them is to shot them right of the table, which GK can do rather effectively. But that’s no fun!! :) There are few things in this game that I enjoy more than to beat the crap out of an opponents Deathstar. “you call that a Deathstar? This is a death star!” Let’s take a look at what you can do. Draigo. Librarian: Quicksilver, Warp Rift, Sanctuary, stave Teach marine: Rad, Psyco and blind grenades, stave. 10x Paladins: MC-Psycannon and falchions, MC-Psycannon and Banner, MC-Psycannon and Hammer, MC-Psycannon and Sword, Apothecary and hammer, Hammer, Sword, Falchions, Stave, halberd. Give the paladins the ability to reroll ones to wound. Stick the Librarian and Teach Marine in a Land Raider with whatever other unit. If Abaddon is Deep striking, warp quake his heinie. If he is in a Land Raider... well if the paladins can’t kill a Land Raider with 4 Mc-Psycannons it just wasn’t meant to bee. When Abaddon and his unit is 14” away or so, move the paladins 6” closer, disembark the Teach Marine 2” away from the paladins and the Librarian 2” away from the Teach Marine. They are now one big squad and 4 inches away from abandon. At this point you could fire Warprift, a flamer, a plasma, 10 SB shots and 16 PC shots into the enemy. But remember that the Psycannons are master crafted and they as well as the storm bolters re roll ones to wound, you may kill to many Terminators. If Abadon is in the front, you should be all right, but you never know with Warprifr. The Librarian and Teach marine are in charge range and make an assault, the paladins move in and the Chaos Terminators piles in to them. Try to get Abadon into base with one of the independent characters, and only one of them. It is hard to say what the Psychotropic grenades will do so let’s disregard them in this example and only view them as a bonus. The Paladins, Draigo and the Teach Marine all cast hammer hands, sow now everyone is at strength 7 or 8, The Rad grenades brings the Terminators down to toughness 3. I don’t remember what Abaddons toughness is, but I am guessing 5 so he is still being wounded on 2+, (with ones being rerolled for the paladins ;) ). The Librarian casts Quicksilver, so now we have 35 attacks that wounds on 2+ that strike at initiative 10. I don’t think there will be a single Terminator left to strike back, Abaddon will still be doing a lot of damage, but in a best case scenario he will have to make all his attacks against the Librarian or Teach Matine. Afterword’s it is always fun to ask your opponent “have you thought about using a Deathstar?” but only in good humor of course :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968480 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 That should do it for sure. G :tu: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968909 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warp Angel Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Abbadon is one of the most potent characters in the game when he gets into hand to hand combat. He's next to useless until he gets there, however. Rule 1 of Kicking Abbadon's behind: Don't let him get into hand to hand combat. Run away if he gets close. He's generally slow. Kill his transport if he has one. That ensures that he's slow. Ignore him for as long as you can, since he and his unit aren't going to do a whole lot until they get to hand to hand. Rule 2 of Kicking Abbadon's behind: Volume of fire. He and his retinue are vulnerable to large volumes of fire. Apply large volumes of firepower. Remember that assaulting him is not using large volumes of fire. Apply "killhammer" principles and determine if he's the best target before applying volume of fire. Rule 3 of Kicking Abbadon's behind: Tarpit. Advanced tactics would have you lure him to parts of the table where he has a limited number of targets and limited ability to kill. Don't be afraid to sacrifice units to slow him down or draw him in the direction you want him to go. Move a unit that he'll catch anyway up to 1" away, die to the charge, and deny him the move+charge to advance across the table Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2968970 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Just bolter him down. I've never lost to Abaddon, but I've also avoided CC with him. The answer to most tactical problems in 40k is weight of fire. Just pound him and his retinue at range while backpeddling to keep the distance open. Once had an opponent drop Abaddon + Plague Termies in front of my LR Crusader. Hurricanes and Assault Cannon peeled off his bodyguards in one volly, while the rest of my army pelted Ab at range on the next turn. Stay mobile, stay at range, throw lots of dice at him from range til he blows all his saves and dies. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969027 Share on other sites More sharing options...
VAGABOND Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Surely Abaddon is a peice of cake to kill with Grey Knights, we have Halberds, Psycannons and massed shots can bring him and his retinue down. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969048 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crynn Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Recently I have been playing my Knights against my friend and his chaos army, he refuses to leave home without Abaddon, I am quite competant as a player, but Abaddon seems to be exceptionally effective aagainst my forces, he arrives with a bodyguard of Tzeench terminators totting various combi-weapons, Grey knights cant bring enough high AP shots to kill them with shooting, and once Abaddon get stuck in he slaughters whole units, in my last game he went through 10 paladins in one round of combat!, in previous games this is mimicked to one degree or another, with abaddon killing everything, recently ive used tactics around holding a piece of terrain anf forcing Abaddon and his boys to fight at I1, this has almost worked several times, but my mates ability to role 4+ saves when it counts astounds me, so how have my fellow brothers dealt with this monster? If abaddon is killing 10 paladins in a turn he is charging then rolling a 6 for attacks hitting and wounding every single time and you are failing every single invun. Unlikely. If you have draigo then just ram him into abaddon, pallies will murder tzentch termies and any raider they come in. also weight of fire will down his body guard quite quickly. He really shouldnt be that much of a problem. If you really are struggling using a vindicare to remove his invuln first then hit him in CC. he is slow and lash isnt effective on gk's so you should be able to almost shoot him to death. Regards, Crynn Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969145 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormshadow Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Everyone seems to agree to just shoot him down, go for It, your friend may even stop using him for a time if he sees how “easily” he will get sprayed down. I have always hammered him in to the ground however. But then again, I have always liked my GK (previous DH) to show there supremacy in a way as spectacular as possible. Tearing Abaddon to pieces has always been a good way to show the Warp scum hos DA BOSS! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969225 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thor1234 Posted January 17, 2012 Author Share Posted January 17, 2012 these are some good tactics, some I had tried but others look well worth a go..... I shall inform you all once I have played a few games...... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Something Wycked Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Honestly, Vindicare. Remove Abby's invulnerable save and then see how eager he is to get into assault. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969506 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razblood Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Exploding Ork Warbikes used to work pretty well :( But a strong bolter line will do in a pinch, throw enough shots at anything and it will fall. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969621 Share on other sites More sharing options...
barenone Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Just rip off his arms........ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2969647 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 You need to break the unit he's with in close combat and force him to flee, they fail init, the whole unit dies. Read the rules for fearless carefully, a character DOES NOT give his unit fearless so if a fearless character is in a non-fearless unit and it breaks, you can kill the fearless guy with the squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2970294 Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Willy Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 As someone who plays with abadabadingdong, his weakness is weight of fire and a few strike squads is all you need. First step is shoot him up, a purgation squad with psycannons should be enough but never hurts to drop a squad of psybolt enhanced storm bolters on him that should kill, on average bout two or three of the termies since they use the majority toughness of 4, if you have other targets that need attention then get ready for the charge otherwise rinse and repeat with what ever other storm bolters a nearby. Terminators a just marines with better save so even a 4+ invuln is meh against the sheer number of power weapons a GK player has, Halberds a your go to weapon since you'll be attacking when abby does allowing you to slaughter his unit and him while only worrying about his attacks, best if you can take the whole squad with halberds or if not put two halberds on him thats bout 4 to 6 attacks at his initiative to wear him down with, if you were lucky with your shooting you may have cleaned out the termies as they should be easy to kill, then it s about allocating attacks, by himself ten hammerhanded GK are more then enough to force an ass load of saves on him. Abby in cc is scary since he s an Inititive 6 powerfist that gains an extra d6 attacks on top of his base 4 and rerolls to wound for the lulz, but everything chaos has to support him is meh at the best of times, killing them is easy so you can focus on them to force a break or you can whittle them down with lost of psycannon and psybolt fire then charge in and slice through his invuln. If in land raider just shoot it, melta on stormraven more then enough or dreadnoughts. You shouldn't assault till hes on his own or in a squad of 4 or less. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2970341 Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan249 Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 There is another very cheap option. Keep the range, shoot him down, and when he does get near, throw a Brotherhood Champion at him (I throw Crowe into the mix cause he hits on 3+). Abadabadab can't help but kill the chump, and when he does, the champie just takes him down with him. Crowe is more ideal in this case because of the higher chance to hit with that final attack. The more conventional option would be to bring as many storm bolters/psycannons as possible and rip into him. Your opponent spends a lot of points on Abadabadab and friends, so expect to expend a similar amount on your counter-measure. Unless you go with Mr. Jihad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2970556 Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnvilofFenris Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Most unbelievable Abaddon kill ever? I'd go with back in 2nd ed, a friend and I with Orks and CSM allied against Ultramarines. Ultra Predator hits my Ork Dread in the leg, making it stagger in a random direction. Right over Abaddon, who fails every save in the book. Squish. No tactics you can use there, but goes to show, he ain't so tough :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2972499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hinti Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 very intersting Thread......realy, lots of helpfull stuff Wannabe Warmaster Abbi is a Beast!!!! NEVER underestimate his Strenght!! The DiceGods are with him..........I saw him personally surviving a shooting Phase wich includet a Baneblade, a Shadowsword and a Worhound Titan and other minor Stuff (IG)........he survived!! 1 LP left........... (damn DiceGods) But...........!! Honestly, Vindicare. Remove Abby's invulnerable save and then see how eager he is to get into assault. Wait what?? Ok this Special Ammo removes the Modells InvSave, but the Codex says: the Modell loses.....blabla..... from any kind of Wargear.....Terminatorarmour count as Warger as per Rule of the Vindicare Special Ammo?? If Yes.......this Looser ist f/(%§& up.....*jau* I won't hijack this Thread, if someone belive so, then please Move... This leads me to another Question wich is lightly simmilar: Lets do the same for Angrath (I've a personal Beef with this Sucker) Would clearly be the "same" (OK he's a "little" bit thougher)...... so let's see Vindicare: Win (shieldpenetrator, if correct) Draigo:Win (his Sword....) Scriptor: Titans Might, this nasty I10 thing, etc... :Win Crowe/Seneschall: Win (last hit) Anti-Psi Nades: EPIC WIN and so on...... pretty awesome Ok he's am MC and is an EW.......*hmmm* Am I wrong? Ore willing to belive it would bet that "easy" (besides the Dice...they hate me)?? COrrect me if I'm wrong, if not..........Chaos is screwed............*hawhaw* Hinti Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2975100 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Ok this Special Ammo removes the Modells InvSave, but the Codex says: the Modell loses.....blabla..... from any kind of Wargear.....Terminatorarmour count as Warger as per Rule of the Vindicare Special Ammo? Yep. Take a look at Abaddon's army list entry; the very first thing listed under "Wargear" is his Terminator Armor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2975120 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hinti Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 *hawhaw* overread that completley........thats AWESOME!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2975129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Something Wycked Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Ok this Special Ammo removes the Modells InvSave, but the Codex says: the Modell loses.....blabla..... from any kind of Wargear.....Terminatorarmour count as Warger as per Rule of the Vindicare Special Ammo? Yep. Take a look at Abaddon's army list entry; the very first thing listed under "Wargear" is his Terminator Armor. Yar. The Shield Breaker round will destroy any invulnerable saves gained from wargear, and then the model can take any saves remaining against the shot. This means that if the model gains an invulnerable save from a special rule or, really, any means other than wargear, they will keep their invulnerable save. So, order of operations: 1. Pick target (Abby & unit) 2. Roll to hit 3. Roll to wound (4+) 4. Allocate wound to Abby (Deadeye, or Dead shot, I forget the name of the rule) 5. Abby loses ALL invulnerable saves granted by Wargear. (If he had Terminator Armor + Storm Shield, he would lose both.) 6. Abby may take any remaining saves against the shot (and the shot is AP1, so no armor save allowed.) Abby is screwed against the Vindicare, as long as your dice don't hate you and roll 1-3 on the to-wound roll :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/245375-how-do-you-kill-abaddon-the-despoiler/#findComment-2975134 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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