Deep strike and Drop pod questions

[greatcrusade08]

"If a target is partially hidden from the firer's view by other models, it receives a 4+ cover save in the same way as if it was behind terrain." - BRB, Pg.21

So any part of a Drop Pod model can partially hide another model, thus providing a Cover save.

 

ive picked up my rulebook from my mums place (where my games room is) and im willing to accept that even though they arent part of the hull they do indeed grant cover.

the rule that states a model cannot bring cover with it, is in regards to giving itself a cover save.

since no other rules apply, then the generic true LOS rules show they do indeed get a cover save.

 

so my own stance is that the doors/petals of a drop pod arent hull, but do grant a cover save

[nurglez]

A drop pod can mishap if it tries to drop within an inch of enemies, and doesn't scatter.

 

I used drop pods quite often with my Logan wing, and we were treating the open doors as difficult terrain, but this just caused more issues, so I glued them shut (also to stop them opening on to other models and damaging them when we bumped the table).

 

Shut drop pods have less issues :)

[Ming]

By the rules - Frankly being on the behind / far side of the pod is cover. Standing in front of the pod on the open doors is not cover. The fins are part of the pod, so yes, they count as providing cover. You can shoot through the pod if you can actually see the target behind. Shooting through the pod causes cover in most cases.

 

Other reminders or thoughts:

1. - Sternguard have special ammo rounds that can trace through the pod and the target gets no cover.

2. - Pod doors should be able to open. The distance a pod arrives in relation to a unit or impassable terrain on the ground is the distance of the doors. This is in order for there to be space for unit to disembark. {heh heh otherwise deploy mobs with pod-sized holes, so the pod arrives and if scatters into the hole the unit cannot disembark....figure that one out}

3. - The doors are not hull, so in subsequent turns can be ignored by enemy movement.

 

Dreams for the future or house rules (try these in your next pod-heavy game or campaign scenario for that word called FUN):

A. Pods tank shock onto the board but cannot be death/gloried - you would not have time. Models have to move out of the way for the distance of the doors.

B. AA units (and only AA, like Hydras, or other true flyers) could out of sequence shoot pods on their way in if the AA unit / interceptor did nothing the previous turn. The pod counts as moving flat out, so has a cover save due to the speed.

C. Pods doors are assault ramps and transported units can assault out of them if they pass a LD check.

D. Pod weaponry can fire on turn of arrival.

E. Pods with no weapons or beacons cannot contest an objective.

F. Roll a difficult terrain dice on pod deployment. On a 1 the pod takes a glancing hit (damage from hitting the ground). If landing in difficult or dangerous terrain, the glancing hit occurs on a 1 or 2.

G. Pod intertial controls will only avoid impassable terrain or vehicles.

[VE5hQg==]

okay... So... You can't deploy within 2" of the... uhm... Yeah those things, you know what I'm talkin' about.

 

[Edited out off-topic material]

[Ah-a-nothepsis]

Last weekend there was a space marine fleeing. He was seven inches away from an ork truck. The ork player dropped the little assault ramp on hinges down, and said the space marine was now within 6" of the enemy for the purposes of trying to regroup in his next turn. Are you only allowed to move any part of the vehicle when disembarking? Is there a rule saying that you have to turn the ramp down when a unit disembarks? Sure an ork trukk is open-topped and models riding it can disembark anywhere on the hull. So is the ramp/door part of the hull on a trukk? If so, is it modelling to advantage if you can manipulate parts of your vehicle at any point during the game? Don't say that this trukk ramp example is not related to a drop pod.. It is.

 

When does it end? Where in the book does it say you have to physically open a hatch on any transport for a unit to be able to hop out without doing Emergency Disembarkation? Drop pod rules say the unit must immediately disembark. If you don't open the hatch on a drop pod, does the unit get destroyed? If the pod has to move the min. distance to avoid being within an inch of enemy/friendly models, is that before YOU as a player phsyically open the doors, or after?

 

Saying that the doors/ramps on a drop pod come into play during Warhammer 40,000 for *any* reason other than to be dramatic and look cool is just silly.

 

I love how whenever a discussion like this goes past two pages, the OP is nowhere to be found. Probably because he went somewhere else to learn about drop pods when the only rule to use since GW doesn't help us with these things is:

 

"Ask your opponent what rules you will be using for the drop pod before the game starts"

 

All of the above questions can arise if you do not get on the same page with your opponent. Don't use any of the questions against me and don't say that they are foolish, because I am not listing them in order to argue. Just illustrating how many problems pop up if you even THINK about considering the doors as part of the vehicle.

[Gentlemanloser]

Shut drop pods have less issues

 

Unless someone's trying to shoot through them. <_<

 

The distance a pod arrives in relation to a unit or impassable terrain on the ground is the distance of the doors. This is in order for there to be space for unit to disembark.

 

You would then allow someone to disembark 2" away from the tip of a door?

[greatcrusade08]

all measurements are made to and from the hull... nuff said

the ork player was pulling a fast one

[Ah-a-nothepsis]

Was he? Maybe.

 

Tell me that the drop-pod doors in question do not immediately jump in your head after that ork player's Fast One. Just sayin! <3 Plus, you and I are on the same page anyways GC.

[awfulawful]

Ramps, hatches, antennas, and such never count as part of the hull, be it drop pods, bagel wagons (that was an auto correct but I'm leaving it there because it's hilarious), rhinos or whatever.

 

How would that ork player have reacted in the next turn if the space marine player was able to draw line of sight to the trukk and shoot at it only by virtue of the fact that the ramp was down? Would he have flipped it back up? Or just declared that since it is not part of the hull that it is not possible to target it?

[greatcrusade08]

if at the beginning of your turn and your measuring distance to the truck for a falling back unit,

if its 7" and the ork player lowers his door and declares its now 6", then he has made forward movement in a phase other than his own movement phase.

no other argument is needed.

[Hellios]

Was he? Maybe.

 

Tell me that the drop-pod doors in question do not immediately jump in your head after that ork player's Fast One. Just sayin! <3 Plus, you and I are on the same page anyways GC.

 

If you want me to show you how this is a fast one... A certain Ork player where I live has scratch built all of his vehicles and they are all fine... They add loads of character. One of his vehicles is based off one of those bridge deploying vehicles and the bridge can actually be deployed! Now he could easily claim that the bridge was a ramp or assault ramp... Easily giving him more than 18 inches of extra assault distance. Not that he does this. Would you want to call bull on that?

 

The biggest issue with this rule is with the defiler as the the area a defiler covers with legs extended is far greater than that of a defiler with its legs curled up. Do legs count as part of the hull for walkers? Normally it isn't an issue as you can use the base but the defiler hasn't got a base unless someone gives it a base.

[VE5hQg==]

I love how whenever a discussion like this goes past two pages, the OP is nowhere to be found

 

Wait? What? I'm still here B)

 

By the rules - Frankly being on the behind / far side of the pod is cover. Standing in front of the pod on the open doors is not cover. The fins are part of the pod, so yes, they count as providing cover. You can shoot through the pod if you can actually see the target behind. Shooting through the pod causes cover in most cases.

 

Other reminders or thoughts:

1. - Sternguard have special ammo rounds that can trace through the pod and the target gets no cover.

 

Yes... Genestealers just have to learn that the hard way. B)

 

... Anyway, so we are going nowhere? We simply don't know if we are allowed to deploy within 2" of the doors? or what?

[Gentlemanloser]

Well, technically we have two choices.

 

Either the doors are part of the hull, or they're not.

 

Whichever way you decide to play it, there are rule implications.

 

And personally, I don't think you are supposed to be allowed to disembark 2" away from a tip of a door, so I don't play them as part of the hull.

[Spacefrisian]

I also open them, but i never count them as part of the vehicle, its to much of a hassle. It also turned out to be unhealthy for any model near it when i keep them closed.

 

I only have the Forgeworld ones so iam already able to deny TLOS trough that pod anyways.

[chaptermasters]

In my gaming group there are two of us that now use pods and it's caused a fair bit of trouble as we have worked out how to handle them.

 

Do we give cover saves to models behind the doors - Yes if at least 50% of the unit can claim cover. The doors are not invisible or made of paper.

Do we count the doors as difficult terrain - No they are there to be walked on.

Do we stop enemy models walk on them - No they are there to be walked on.

Do we let marines deploy within 2" of the edge of the door. No it's clear where the Marines are strapped inside they are not thrown forward with the doors when they blow open.

Can you target the pod by it's door - It hasn't been discussed, but probably as I'm sure there something critical you could blow up in the door. As a SM player I'm not happy with this but given they cost 35pts.... and I find people don't shoot them unless there nothing else they can target.