MylesTheTroll Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 If wrecked/exploded do all passengers die too? If so what pages say this? Can't seem to find it which leads me to believe that the passengers disembark fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 They do disembark fine. The only time they die is if the transport moved out and becomes destroyed during that players own movement phase- for example, by ramming another vehicle for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-a-nothepsis Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 pg67 in my rulebook, I'll doublecheck edit: Can't find it, but I know Grey Mage is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 BRB FAQ: Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in a Movementphase in which it has moved flat out, what happens to any embarked models, as passengers may not disembark from a vehicle that has moved flat out in that Movement phase? (p70) A: They are removed as casualties But you don't use that, since that only happens when the vehicle crashes in a player turn that it moved the distance. Otherwise, you just follow the rules given on page 67. A unit could be completely destroyed by the vehicle exploding, but it's highly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 point of order- if it is destroyed in the turn in which it moved flat out also includes the shooting phase, so scattering blast markers could also do it for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-a-nothepsis Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 But it says Movement Phase twice and not turn, there was a huge discussion on this @ dakka. Don't look it up, my brain hurt after it was over (and its still going on due to necromancy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator-Chaplain Ezra Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 At any rate, both the FAQ and the rulebook states clearly that when it says "turn" it means player turn, not game turn. If they mean game turn, they will write just that. And if a player is desperate enough to throw blasts that close to his own troops, he's boned anyway. Can you tell that I've been down this street before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-a-nothepsis Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Can you tell that I've been down this street before? Perhaps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacefrisian Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 point of order- if it is destroyed in the turn in which it moved flat out also includes the shooting phase, so scattering blast markers could also do it for example. Dont add things to it that isnt their, it says movement phase, most blasts are shot in shooting phase, thats 1 phase later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleDV8 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 At any rate, both the FAQ and the rulebook states clearly that when it says "turn" it means player turn, not game turn. If they mean game turn, they will write just that. And if a player is desperate enough to throw blasts that close to his own troops, he's boned anyway. Can you tell that I've been down this street before? Yes, we all have, but that was the old FAQ. There is a new one. BRB FAQ Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in a Movementphase in which it has moved flat out, what happens to any embarked models, as passengers may not disembark from a vehicle that has moved flat out in that Movement phase? (p70) A: They are removed as casualties. The word turn has not been used. The embarked unit is only removed 'in a Movement Phase'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Yes, and this particular FAQ also only addresses the fact that if a vehicle is destroyed in the movement phase where is has moved flat out, then teh occupants are destroyed. This does not later the wording of the BRB which says that for that turn (and as established elsewhere by this they mean player turn), they cannot get out. There is also another possible point in a single players turn wehre they may cause the destruction of their own vehicle (the shooting phase) and the most common possiblity here would involve a scattering blast marker. If the scattering blast marker deos destory the vehicle (and we're still in the same player turn here), then the occupants still cannot get out and are thus still destroyed. QED innit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Or to simplify- you cant move during your opponents move phase so you sure as heck cant move flat out during their movement phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleDV8 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Yes, and this particular FAQ also only addresses the fact that if a vehicle is destroyed in the movement phase where is has moved flat out, then teh occupants are destroyed. This does not later the wording of the BRB which says that for that turn (and as established elsewhere by this they mean player turn), they cannot get out. There is also another possible point in a single players turn wehre they may cause the destruction of their own vehicle (the shooting phase) and the most common possiblity here would involve a scattering blast marker. If the scattering blast marker deos destory the vehicle (and we're still in the same player turn here), then the occupants still cannot get out and are thus still destroyed. QED innit! Except the BRB never mentions how long the embarked unit may not disembark. BRB pg.70 Passengers may not embark onto or disembark from a fast vehicle if it has moved (or is going to move) flat out in that movement phase. It never tells us movement phase (although implied), player turn, game turn or even the rest of the game. The last FAQ made it the turn(player), this FAQ makes it the movement phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 "in that movement phase." Seems quite specific to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 "in that movement phase." Seems quite specific to me. We've been down this route before, but.... the that refers to moving flat out (as SeattleDV8 points out). It doesn't refer to embarking or disembarking. The sentence has a "Then-if" structure. If your reword it as a more familiar "If-then" structure the meaning becomes more clear: "If it has moved (or is going to move) flat out in that movement phase, passengers may not embark or disembark". It doesn't make grammatical sense to apply the modifier "in that movement phase" to a different phrase than the one it's in. Though I think it's pretty clear from the FAQ's that GW intends for this rule only to apply to blowing up due to terrain, not when the enemy blows up a vehicle. Personally I'm on the fence, and will play it however my opponent wants to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleDV8 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 The Faq has four conditions 1. the transport has been destroyed 2. In a movement phase 3. in which it has moved flat out 4.it has embarked passengers If it meets all of the conditions, the embarked unit is removed as casualties. If it doesn't then they may disembark as normal or is ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 the that refers to moving flat out (as SeattleDV8 points out). It doesn't refer to embarking or disembarking. The sentence has a "Then-if" structure. If your reword it as a more familiar "If-then" structure the meaning becomes more clear: "If it has moved (or is going to move) flat out in that movement phase, passengers may not embark or disembark". It doesn't make grammatical sense to apply the modifier "in that movement phase" to a different phrase than the one it's in. How do you know it refers to that though, does it specifically state it? Don't point to grammatical sense as a reason for something being true, this is GW we're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 No... "That" refers to the movement phase. How do we know this? Because it comes directly before the words "movement phase". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 No... "That" refers to the movement phase. How do we know this? Because it comes directly before the words "movement phase". You are correct of course, I worded my reply badly (I'll blame exhaustion). What I should have said is that "...in that movement phase" refers to the vehicle's movement, not the passengers embarking/disembarking. @Captain Juarez - I use grammatical sense because it's all we have to go on. The rulebook is written in the English language, and I'm assuming grammatical sense applies to some degree. Otherwise if we toss grammatical sense out the window, what else goes as well? If we assume GW doesn't mean what they write, I'll assume then that "They are removed as casualties" actually means "They are completely unharmed and get a 2+ invulnerable save for the rest of the game". :huh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 @Captain Juarez - I use grammatical sense because it's all we have to go on. The rulebook is written in the English language, and I'm assuming grammatical sense applies to some degree. Otherwise if we toss grammatical sense out the window, what else goes as well? If we assume GW doesn't mean what they write, I'll assume then that "They are removed as casualties" actually means "They are completely unharmed and get a 2+ invulnerable save for the rest of the game". :huh: Which is fair enough, and I totally understand that reasoning, but infering too much is what I argue against - loose wording is the rule rather than exception for rules it seems! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Which is fair enough, and I totally understand that reasoning, but infering too much is what I argue against - loose wording is the rule rather than exception for rules it seems! And I agree with you completely on that point. B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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