Enzephalon Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I was flipping through the codex today, having a look at the units I do not play because I haven't bought the models yet. The speeders caught my eye. Please back me up on this. Am I right that I may replace the heavy bolter with a Multimelta and upgrade the Speeder with an additional MM? My list building tool allows it too. Two units of one of these speeders would be a great choice for my Fast attack slot in addition to my squad of two MM attack bikes. I really do love MUltimeltas by the way. ^^ Enrich me with your endless wisdom! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 It can be done. Not always a great idea since if you move more than 6 inches you can only shoot 1. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989260 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodTzar Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Initially, I was in love with the idea having 3 HF/MM speeders in my SR build in bigger games, however there is one important thing that speeder cannot do, tie stuff into combat. On top of that there has been some math-run-down done which one can surrvive longer, in here or at the other forum, where #'s speak in favor of bikes. I am not using speeders, nor bikes I do HF/MM dread in pod, as it offers the benefits from both worlds :P ~BT Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989264 Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I think the biggest down sides are. 1.) As mentioned you can only move 6" and fire both, this hurts with the 24" range on the multi-melta. 2.) Points (what is the cost of this 70 points?), while not expensive, speeders die, and if you are often not firing one of the multi-meltas, why bother with paying for it. 3.) Range, again at 24" range you are likely to get glanced by things like bolters, at which point you don't shoot at all., and now with GKs 24" range = speeder death. 4.) 2 Attackbikes cost 30 points and are generally more survivable, and easier to hide. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989289 Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeslikethunder Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I think the biggest down sides are. 4.) 2 Attackbikes cost 30 points and are generally more survivable, and easier to hide. 2 attack bikes cost 80pts (40 pts each) 100pts with MM's. In my meta I have found twin MM Speeders very effective the two shots gives much greater chance of success and Ap1 works at full range and you can move and shoot both I gave up on the flamer as while 24" can be issue it more likely than the flamer. It also means you can get one MM destroyed and you still have another. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989322 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Typically when you take two of the same weapon it counts at twin linked-maybe this one slipped through a crack. G Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fortunate Son Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 It also means you can get one MM destroyed and you still have another. Redundant systems are a wonderful thing. And if you run them in squadrons, they become even more effective. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 In my meta I have found twin MM Speeders very effective the two shots gives much greater chance of success and Ap1 works at full range and you can move and shoot bothI gave up on the flamer as while 24" can be issue it more likely than the flamer. It also means you can get one MM destroyed and you still have another. Yes you can move and shoot both, but only 6", which if you want to fire at full range is fine. Typically when you take two of the same weapon it counts at twin linked-maybe this one slipped through a crack. I think this is an older rule, and only still exists in the Tau and Eldar books. Otherwise what happens for Dreads when you take 2 TL Autocannons? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989612 Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeslikethunder Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 [Typically when you take two of the same weapon it counts at twin linked-maybe this one slipped through a crack. I think this is an older rule, and only still exists in the Tau and Eldar books. Otherwise what happens for Dreads when you take 2 TL Autocannons? reroll the reroll ;) only joking The main thing to consider when selecting your weapons is what are you missing from the rest of your list and what threats do you struggle against. Even your terrain can make a big difference I had a rash of Rocks that just had to be stopped and my LGC's has a lot the newer 3 level terrain which made it lot easier to hide single speeders but not squads of them. So single speeders with twin MM suited me. But if my LGC had a had the older shorter terrain attack bikes might have been better. but also if you have got stuff like Dante and his melta mates then your need for twin MM is reduced and typhoons might be better options. So dont forget to think about the whole package of your list/meta and how they interact together. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989623 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enzephalon Posted February 10, 2012 Author Share Posted February 10, 2012 Thank you guys for your insights. It's highly appreciated! To make something clear here: I'm not going for 100% effectiveness. I'm a well rounded hobbyist. I enjoy modelling, building the models to use them in the game and I paint them because it adds a lot to the atmosphere. I'm far from being what you would call a competitive/tournament orientated gamer. It's the story telling aspect of the game that suits me. My goal is to field cool looking models and make the most out of them. I already built two Attack bikes which I really like, so I do not bother to make some more. So this shouldn't be a comparison of Attack bikes vs. speeders. This has been done before. I'm just trying to fill the fast attack slots, because I never really have the need to field my Baal Predators against the armies I play the most. Maybe you have a more defined picture now to base your comments on. ; ) Now back to topic. Some guys mentioned the limited movement if I want to field two MM. Remember that I never leave home without my bikes. They could focus on the targets the speeders can't reach (If there are any... depending on deployment) And concerning the speeders.... if the targets are out of range I could allways turbo boost into range (they are less threatened because of the cover save). If the target is already within 30 inch I have no problems to begin with (no melta bonus of course if it's further than 18"). If I recall correctly the speeders could also deep strike. They are a suicidal unit anyways. I don't mind if they get shot to bits after they killed so high priority target. Why am I focusing my thoughts on the speeders? Because I'm working on a 1750 points list including my recently finished LR crusader + Assault termies. You get it... I have only few points to spend on the really reliable stuff, including the anti tank. And I do not want to be totally dependend on my two beloved Auto/Las - predators. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/246937-speeders-with-double-multi-melta/#findComment-2989994 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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