New Legion or Chapter From The Great Crusade Era

[UltraWorldWolves]

Im mulling on the idea of making a Legion or Chapter where there origins come from the pre heresy era. They would be of a combined gene seed from the legions of the Ultramarines, World Eaters, and Luna Wolves. All of this of course being done in secret with only the Emperor and a select few others knowing. They would combine the ideoligies of Ultramarines, the gladiator style of fighting from the World Eaters(without psycho brain chips), and... unortunatley I don't know that much about Luna Wolves so any info of uniqueness about the Luna Wolves would be much appreciated. Them of course are a pre heresy themed army. Would this be okay with most people or would I get a lot of bad rap?

 

PS I'm knew so I apologise for putting this in the wrong forum if I did.

[Octavulg]

Why would such a thing be done in the first place? What would the Emperor gain from this?

 

Also, the World Eaters are (relatively) tactically unsophisticated and a pretty good example of a one (or possibly two) trick pony. Furthermore, I'm really not clear on how gladiatorial fighting would mesh with the well-rounded doctrines of the Ultramarines.

 

And finally, if you don't know anything about the Luna Wolves, why do you want to include them in this project?

 

Finally, I don't think people would be big fans of this. People inventing the Emperor's personal secret projects rarely goes over well (it feels a lot like the author is trying to make his idea 'special'). Of course, if that doesn't bother you, I wouldn't worry (alternately, if this idea is intended to be somewhat comedic, then that's not an important consideration).

[UltraWorldWolves]

Octavulg-Well to tell you the truth the original idea was a combination of dark angels and space wolves. The idea was that the emperor wanted to repair the rift between the two legions. The idea then evolved to Ultramarines and World Eaters without any real reason why. I'm quite a blasphemous personality and I actually don't know that much. From the best of my knowledge the World Eaters were taught by Angron gladiator combat or something like that with the addition of the crazy chip as I call it.

[Beachymike123]

brother ultraworldwolves, unfortunately your idea sounds flawed from the start. during the crusade era, the legions were at their genetic best pretty much, and each had their own role/speciality. if you want a combine geneseed, you are better making a chapter from the 21st (cursed) founding iirc as this is when the admech were splicing away. the geneseeds from the cusade era are about as pure as one could get, although it was the rapid recruitment that eventually led to the flaws emerging. my suggestion would be not to aim for a legion/chapter that has such an amalgamation of characters (which will lead to many contradictions) but rather refine it and maybe make it a deviation of one of the legions, although it would have to be from the 3rd founding onwards. if, however, you still want a combined geneseed, then i would advise going with 21st founding as this can be easier explained. i may be wrong on the founding though, so if someone knows better please correct me. lexicanum.com may help.

[Jareddm]

What you are doing is commonly referred to as "Killing the Sacred Cow". The vast majority of the community looks down upon anything involving secret projects of the Emperor, mixing of gene seeds, or use of traitor legion gene seed. You're combining them all. The problem with these is they're seen as lazy story-telling methods of making a chapter "special". But also it's the fact that they're simply not plausible. 40k's got enough plot holes as it is. Trying to explain why a chapter (or more likely a legion if they were pre-heresy) existed that not only no one knew about, but didn't take part in the Heresy and were instantly accepted by the Imperium is completely implausible. Sure there may be a single chapter that was from traitor gene seed in the form of the Blood Ravens but it was the only time it's happened and even then most people don't care for it.

 

Now if you want to mess around with mixed gene seeds, there are times and places for them. The 13th founding and the 21st founding were both open to this kind of experimentation and are far more interesting than saying, "The emperor made them awesome just because!"

[UltraWorldWolves]

Ah I see brothers. Knowing that as I am quite young and very... shall we say impulsive and base most of my ideas on a coolness factor (remember I'm 14) I definitely need to read up on my fluff and backstory writing skills. Oh and is there anyway to change my display name?

[Olis]

I definitely need to read up on my fluff and backstory writing skills.

 

I suggest visiting the Lexicanum website, then. You will find alot of info there that'll help fill in some gaps in your knowledge. B)

 

Oh and is there anyway to change my display name?

 

Not really, I'm afraid. You have to have a really good reason to ask for it to be changed. Not liking it anymore isn't one of them. :P

[spacemarinepanda]

Yeah in that case I'll just stick ith my old profile which I conviently remembered which would be spacemarinepanda. Well at least it's better than an attempt at combining gene seeds from legions. The thought!

[spacemarinepanda]

Yeah in that case I'll just stick ith my old profile which I conviently remembered which would be spacemarinepanda. Well at least it's better than an attempt at combining gene seeds from legions. The thought!

Hey umm sorry bout this I was young when I created this profile and had forgotten about it so I'm sorry in advance.

[Paradigm]

There is nothing wrong with being 14. We all were once. The hard part is knowing that the things that seem cool at 14 will quickly change as you get older. Some embarrassing things, you will look back to and no longer care a whip.

 

If you really want a chapter for yourself, it takes a lot of work and a lot of effort to completely flesh them out. Is it worth it? That is entirely up to you. I have started work on two chapters, and put hours into both of them, eventually I realized I really just liked the paint scheme. There is nothing that says you have to do more than come up with a cool paint scheme.

 

Edit: Problem solved.

[Octavulg]

I never speak publicly of my first chapter.

 

And I'm not starting now. ^_^

 

In any case: think about some things you think might be interesting to write about or some elements and ideas from different books/movies/video games/board games/RPGs you think are neat. That's how most of my chapters get started. If you want, throw some of them up here and I'd be happy to offer suggestions.

 

For example, I based the Bronze Prophets off a speech in Diablo about the Halls of the Blind (I can see what you see not/vision milky than eyes rot/when you turn they will be gone/whispering their hidden song/out of sight and out of mind/cast down into the halls of the blind). I got an entire chapter out of that (with the addition of some other stuff, obviously).

[UltraWorldWolves]

Thanks all for the support! Oh and I've been working on this for the past couple of hours so just tell me what y'all think Kay?

Oh and about the name or them couldn't decide between Dusk Panthers or Dusk Tigers so just keep that in mind.

 

Dusk Tigers/Panthers

 

Origins

The Dusk Tiger/Panthers were formulated during the 21st founding in late M36 and are one of the chapters to have suffered severe mutations in the gene seed most notably the predatory eyes and feline like front teeth. As they are a young chapter they are eager to prove themselves but have been set back by many unfortunate events like the inquisitions investigation to determine whether they retain spiritual purity. They have had many victories against the orks and surprisingly their ritual burnings of the dead bodies have had much effect in terms of span of time between ork incursions.

 

Coltchis

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers homeworld is primarily based in the Ultima Segmentum part of the galaxy. They are closely acsociated with the famous Valhallan Ice Warriors and have helped them in their defense of major ork incursions mainly in assassinating priority target ork leaders. Coltchis is a marsh world surrounded by swamps miles wide while the little land that their is is inhabitated by people who believe in the art of hunting animals. Skining the fur off the body of ones first kill and then adorning it with tokens of fallen beasts to landmark an event. This is reflected in the chapter for a chosen boy to become a full space marine he has to hunt and kill a lolf a giant wolf with a lion like mane.

 

Combat Doctrine

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers follow the codex Astartes with one minor divergence. They take with them from their life before their rise to space marine the art of the hunt they learn and improve upon their ability to track and identify xenos creatures.They fight in a style of controlled fury knowing when and where they should release their true power. They are learned in letting their prey not know when they are there. The reason that they believe in this divergence is that they do not have as rigorous hypno therapy mainly so they can remember there teachings of their tribes style of hunt. They believe in the value of memories.

 

Organization

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers are codex adherent except that they are split into war tribes instead of companies, fire chieftains instead of captains, and the earth talkers instead of chaplains. These are mainly just titles but are deeply connected in meaning to their past life and beliefs.

 

Beliefs

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers shun the use of librarians as they feel that they are too susceptible to the warp. They believe in the holding of memories so there indoctrination is not as rigourous in terms of hypno therapy. They believe to betray ones faith and brothers is the worst of all wrong doings.

 

Gene seed

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers are most likely descended from the Raven Guard but unfortunately most of their records are gone. It is rumored that the Dusk Tigers/Panthers were mixed with another gene seed but none can say.

[Lord_Caerolion]

The only real comment I have on the new version is that you should probably change the homeworld, as it's far too similar to Colchis, the homeworld of the Word Bearers. Other than that, it looks pretty good.

[Conn Eremon]

Coltchis

The Dusk Tigers/Panthers homeworld is primarily based in the Ultima Segmentum part of the galaxy. They are closely acsociated with the famous Valhallan Ice Warriors and have helped them in their defense of major ork incursions mainly in assassinating priority target ork leaders. Coltchis is a marsh world surrounded by swamps miles wide while the little land that their is is inhabitated by people who believe in the art of hunting animals. Skining the fur off the body of ones first kill and then adorning it with tokens of fallen beasts to landmark an event. This is reflected in the chapter for a chosen boy to become a full space marine he has to hunt and kill a lolf a giant wolf with a lion like mane.

 

Just wanted to point out that the Word Bearer's former homeworld, where their Primarch Lorgar was raised, is Colchis. To me, that makes Coltchis a no-no, as it's an almost exact duplicate. If you're thinking of using their old homeworld as your homeworld, keep in mind that Colchis is utterly destroyed following the Heresy, . Other than that, I have to say that "lolf" is a very awkward word. Perhaps a better word like "Wolvion" or even "Leonine" would fit better. Leonine means lion-like, and sounds like a combination Leo, a name closely associated with lions, and canine.

[Lord_Caerolion]

I have to say that "lolf" is a very awkward word.

 

And Lufgt isn't? :D

I'd more say Lolf isn't a good word because it's too similar to lol. Nothing good will ever come from having something named that similiarly to lol, the jokes would never stop.

[Conn Eremon]

I have to say that "lolf" is a very awkward word.

 

And Lufgt isn't? :D

I'd more say Lolf isn't a good word because it's too similar to lol. Nothing good will ever come from having something named that similiarly to lol, the jokes would never stop.

 

Are you trying to pronounce the 'g?' I assume it's pronounced "lew-ft' though I suppose it could be "luh-ft."

 

Apologies for being off-topic.

[Andrew J]

I would say Dusk Tigers is better than panthers. It rolls off the tongue easier.

 

You have a very good base to start with now. I would suggest trying to expand on the hunting theme more and maybe look into some cultures that are based around hunting (sorry none come to mind right away).

 

Also be careful with the hypno therapy it is required for a recruit to become a space marine

Hypnotherapy - As the super-enhanced body grows, the recipient must learn how to use his new abilities. Some of the implants, specifically the phase 6 and 10 implants, can only function once correct hypnotherapy has been administered. Hypnotherapy is not always as effective as chemical treatment, but it can have substantial results. If a Marine can be taught how to control his own metabolism, his dependence on drugs is lessened. The process is undertaken in a machine called a Hypnomat. Marines are placed in a state of hypnosis and subjected to visual and aural stimuli in order to awaken their minds to their unconscious metabolic processes.

(lexicanum)

 

Maybe try saying they use only the basic HT required to ensure implant implementation. Althought maybe you could say that they do not use HT and just use Chemical Treatment to ensure recruits implants will work.

Chemical Treatment - Until his initiation, a Marine must submit to constant tests and examinations. The newly implanted organs must be monitored very carefully, imbalances corrected, and any sign of maldevelopment treated. This chemical treatment is reduced after completion of the initiation process, but it never ends. Marines undergo periodic treatment for the rest of their lives in order to maintain a stable metabolism. Marine power armour suits contain monitoring equipment and drug dispensers to aid in this.

 

I am unsure if you need both or just one or the other. After going through that I now wonder if that helped or just caused more confusion haha.

[UltraWorldWolves]

OK so what im hearing is change the homeworld name (to be honest i forgot about the word bearers homeworld), change the name from lolf to wolvion, and expand upon the idea of hunters. I was trying to keep on the idea that there hypnotherapy was basic and not as rigorous but you know this is only a first draft. Second draft will be coming soon. Oh and I do like Dusk Tigers better so stay tuned :ermm:

[Retributis]

The vast majority of the community looks down upon anything involving mixing of gene seeds

 

I've never understood this when used in the context of the 21st 'cursed' founding. It exists entirely to allow people to do this sort of thing and as far as I'm aware there is no fluff stating what could or could not be done in this period. I mean even GW came up with a BA successor that had no black rage or red thirst!

[Olis]

The vast majority of the community looks down upon anything involving mixing of gene seeds

 

I've never understood this when used in the context of the 21st 'cursed' founding. It exists entirely to allow people to do this sort of thing and as far as I'm aware there is no fluff stating what could or could not be done in this period. I mean even GW came up with a BA successor that had no black rage or red thirst!

 

I think it boils done to seeing everyone and their mother attempting to do such a thing, to the point where it's become somewhat of a cliche amongst the Liber forum-goers. Don't get me wrong - when done well it can be a great asset and can deepen the character of an otherwise somewhat generic chapter. But when you've seen dozens try the same thing unsuccessfully, it becomes very easy to simply advise against such a move. Also, after the twenty-third attempt (random number) it's hard to treat the idea like the first time you saw it - it becomes stale, and thus seemingly unoriginal. I dunno, just thought I'd throw that out there. :)

[dswanick]

The vast majority of the community looks down upon anything involving mixing of gene seeds

 

I've never understood this when used in the context of the 21st 'cursed' founding. It exists entirely to allow people to do this sort of thing and as far as I'm aware there is no fluff stating what could or could not be done in this period. I mean even GW came up with a BA successor that had no black rage or red thirst!

Of course, that's also the reason that the two Lost Legions exist - as a plot hook for a gamer to hang his own fluff from. That it has somehow evolved, amongst 40k fans, into an untouchable piece of lore is just sad.

[UltraWorldWolves]

Hey Ive seen this certain template for IAs but I cant find it. The one im talking about is the one that Viray is using for his Auora Knights. Can somone help me?

[UltraWorldWolves]

So I'm out of school so here's draft número dos

 

 

Dusk Tigers

 

Origins

The Dusk Tiger were formulated during the 21st founding in late M36 and are one of the chapters to have suffered severe mutations in the gene seed most notably the predatory eyes and feline like front teeth. As they are a young chapter they are eager to prove themselves but have been set back by many unfortunate events like the inquisitions investigation to determine whether they retain spiritual purity. They have had many victories against the orks and surprisingly their ritual burnings of the dead bodies have had much effect in terms of span of time between ork incursions.

 

Kolarden

The Dusk Tigers homeworld is primarily based in the Ultima Segmentum part of the galaxy. They are closely acsociated with the famous Valhallan Ice Warriors and have helped them in their defense of major ork incursions mainly in assassinating priority target ork leaders. Kolarden is a marsh world surrounded by swamps miles wide while the little land that their is is inhabitated by people who believe in the art of hunting animals. Skining the fur off the body of ones first kill and then adorning it with tokens of fallen beasts to landmark an event. This is reflected in the chapter for a chosen boy to become a full space marine he has to hunt and kill a wolvion a giant wolf with a lion like mane.There culture system reflects upon the ancient Inuits in that they are heavily featured in hunting and that if you cannot hunt for yourself then you are just another mouth to feed.This is why there recruitment is slow as most young children on Kolarden cannot hunt. But this is also why their initiates have the best training there can be in the art of war.

 

Combat Doctrine

The Dusk Tigers follow the codex Astartes with one minor divergence. They take with them from their life before their rise to space marine the art of the hunt they learn and improve upon their ability to track and identify xenos creatures.Whence they find their quarry they  fight in a style of controlled fury knowing when and where they should release their true power. They are learned in letting their prey not know when they are there. The reason that they believe in this divergence is that they have only the most basic hypno therapy mainly so they can remember there teachings of their tribes style of hunt.In that there War Tribes(see below)are very diverse in the style of hunting as there fire chieftain(see below) teaches them there original tribes style of hunt. They believe in the value of memories.

 

Organization

The Dusk Tigers are codex adherent except that they are split into war tribes instead of companies, fire chieftains instead of captains, and the earth talkers instead of chaplains. These are mainly just titles but are deeply connected in meaning to their past life and beliefs.They have no specific War tribe for their scouts so they are assigned to a specific War tribe. Surprisingly the Dusk Tigers seem to disdain the newer equipment like the Mk7 Aquila armour. The armour they tend to use more is theMk2 Crusade, the Mk3 Iron, and the Mk4 Maximus armour types. They tend to favor the Phobos pattern bolter and the Umbra pattern bolter. No one seems to know how they are able to acquire this equipment  in such large volumes.

 

Beliefs

The Dusk Tigers shun the use of librarians as they feel that they are too susceptible to the warp. They believe in the holding of memories so there indoctrination is only in its most basic form in terms of hypno therapy so the organs can properly function. They believe to betray ones faith and brothers is the worst of all wrong doings.  This is why there recruitment is slow as most young children on Kolarden cannot hunt. But this is why their initiates have the best training there can be in the art of war.

 

Gene seed

The Dusk Tigers are most likely descended from the Raven Guard but unfortunately most of their records are gone. It is rumored that the Dusk Tigers were mixed with another gene seed but none can say.

 

Battle cry

Before the battle is begun the Dusk Tigers  choose to enter mass prayer to the emperor that there quarry might be killed and that if they fall that day that he might visit upon them before there passing. In open battle the yell "From Dusk We Strike!".

[UltraWorldWolves]

Oh and here's a couple picks or color scheme. Suggestions comments?

[ScottishSmurf96]

as a possible unique aspect of your army i would suggest that they maintain an extra scout company? That are veterans like wolfscouts of the space wolves. This would fit well if you see your marines as being hunters? ;)

 

Tom