Word Bearers Omnibus

[nightlordsrock3564]

OMG I just read this and I LOVED IT!!!!!

 

Did the author of these write any HH novels?

[Kol Saresk]

Sadly no but he does have some WFB novels.

[khurdur]

totally agree....

The series is totally kick-ass

[Darkchild130]

This series is pure bolter porn, but good all the same.

Didn't read them when they first came out (due to hatred of Word Bearers) but after the first Heretic and Aurelian I thought I'd give them a chance.

 

Glad I did.

 

Darkchild

[Kol Saresk]

See, these novels are what led me to First Heretic and Aurelian. And combined with Know No Fear, they have conflicted with my loyalty to the Night Lords. :/

[Saa]

See, these novels are what led me to First Heretic and Aurelian. And combined with Know No Fear, they have conflicted with my loyalty to the Night Lords. :/

 

Good.....good....*rubs hands together*

 

Just as planned

 

They're 'ok' books in my opinion. The ending of book three was woefully disappointing however. For me it compounded the "I'll get you next time Gadget....NEXT TIME" attitude that our poor Word Bearers are so often given.

 

Saa

 

......or something like that

[The Dark Pantheon]

I just finished the omnibus last night and was actually considering starting a thread for discussion this afternoon! To be honest I didn't find the series exraordinary, mostly because I didn't feel that the psychology and pasts of the characters were explored deeply enough, and maybe I would have liked to see more details on the workings of the Legion itself. It also didn't come across to me that the characters were protrayed as what I like to see them as; tragic individuals who have traveled down a faustian path to discover the ultimate truth of the universe. Their ultimate goal - from the Great Crusade to the Dark Millenium - was not to ensure the success of the Imperium as a political power, nor to eventually destroy it out of bitterness, but to enlighten humanity to the truth of the cosmos, and accordingly save the human race.

 

Now how might the dogmatism of religion be humanity's saviour? I believe that one of Lorgar's biggest motives (though not conformed in either A D-B or Anthony Reynolds' work) was his belief that faith in an existing power or figure would, eventually, be the only notion that would unite the human race as a whole in the face of decline and fragmentation as a single civilisation. The Imperial Truth, as I understand it, did not provide the human race what it has always instinctively needed throughout real world history - faith in a power greater than oneself; the notion that one is not alone, exposed to life's struggles without a parent figure or a mentor to guide one through it, or so to speak. Without faith, human civilisation would, ironically, descend into chaos. Karl Marx regarded religion as the 'opiate of the people', which I do agree with. However, in Lorgar's opinion, such a large civilisation would need this opiate to remain united in the long term. The Emperor, in this respect, is the perfect focus for mankind's faith. This theory would be proven later, after the Heresy.

 

Don't get me wrong, Lorgar did truely believe that the Emperor was truely a god, but my interpretation is that the reason for his actions in the Great Crusade were also largely due to the above theory. After his one purpose in life and his god overtly stated that he didn't exist, humiliating him and his Legion in front of his brother (who he probably percieved to be sychophatic) in the process, his only choice was to search for what he knew was the truth of the cosmos - that there had to be a greater power somewhere out there, to save humanity, even if its discovery involved being manipulated by his foster father and his first chaplain, who he immediately realised were never loyal to his noble cause all along. He discovered that Chaos was the primordial truth of the universe, not necessarily a benign one, but it was the only truth. This true icon of humanity's faith, which would ostensibly prevent it from plunging into chaos, was, ironically, Chaos itself. It was no longer a matter of choice on his part, however. To keep humanity ignorant would be to lie as the Emperor had, and Lorgar did not wish to mislead his civilisation again.

 

That is my interpretation of Lorgar and the XVII Legion anyway, please excuse the rant. :lol: Back to my original point, I didn't feel that the Word Bearers were interpreted in the omnibus as well as they could have been.

 

I do still have some remarks in mind about the plot of the series, but I'm afraid I'll have to post them later when I don't need to study.

[Kol Saresk]

Look at it as a before-and-after. During the Heresy, they, like you said, only turned to Chaos because they believed that it would unite humanity and help not only survive the Grimdark future, but become the only major power left. 41st Millenium, the Word Bearers are fully entrenched into the ways of Chaos. They are the epitome of the Chaos worshipper. They provide sacrfices to the Dark Gods, they are willing to kill their own brothers to attain power and they are only concerned with themselve. Now their belief is that in order to unite humanity it must be conquered by the Astartes who serve Chaos because only they can make it strong.

 

And since they are only worried about the now, that is why we do not see much of the then. There weren't supposed to be any tragic heroes. These are just people who have fallen so far from grace that its light no longer reaches them and they don't even realize the boat they are in. Nor do they care.

[firestorm40k]

Thank you, The Dark Pantheon, for your well written, and well considered post about this series :)

 

I am only about two-thirds in to the first book of the anthology, and I can concur with Darkchild130 that it is pretty much Bolter porn; I really feel the Word Bearers lack the definition of character and motivation that AD-B brought to the Night Lords. It just seems to say, thus far, that ‘We are the Word Bearers, and we kill people and make sacrifices because we are Evil, and when we’re not killing Imperials we’re wanting to do each other in so we can advance our own power!’

 

In the introduction to this Omnibus, the Author states how he finds villains more interesting than heroes the majority of the time. I can appreciate what he is saying – however, thus far (it may improve as the series progresses, I don’t know yet), he hasn’t made the Word Bearers very interesting villains. I think with villains there has to be a certain sense of tragedy about them – there are few people that are born ‘pure evil’, but circumstances can turn people. There also has to be a sense in which you can understand their motivations, though you might not agree with them or want them to succeed. Take X-men’s Magneto, for example – he is right that Mutants are the next step in human evolution, and because of their powers, can rightly be viewed as a superior species. However, his aggressive actions contribute to the fear and hatred of mutants, thus increasing the inevitability of the war he says is coming between humans and mutants. You can also argue that, had he had Charles Xavier’s upbringing, he might have had more moderate views about human evolution and mutants.

 

So, with these Word Bearers stories, you don’t really get a sense of these things. If you’re going to write a series focussing upon the ‘villain’, you’ve got to give the reader a reason to want to read their side of the story – and as said, this doesn’t come across very well at all in this series.

 

For me, Chaos Space Marines are more interesting for their ‘fallen-hero’ back stories, and what motivates them to carry on fighting, rather than just being all “Kill! Maim! Burn!” all the time. For example, I’d like to see a story told from the point of view of Plague Marines. I think Plague Marines are just as tragic, in terms of their fall, as the Rubrics of the Thousand Sons. But I am sure they do not see themselves that way. In the two novels I’ve seen them portrayed, ‘Cadian Blood’ and ‘Blood Gorgons’ (both fine reads, by the way), they’re very much, ‘grrr, we’re evil and we like to kill you!’ I think, as servants of Nurgle – who lets not forget, as the Plague Father, is very affectionate towards his servants and minions – they would take great delight in bestowing what they would see as the gifts and blessings of their god on mortals, in the form of pestilence and disease. I think Plague Marines would be jovial and even joyous, despite what we’d see as deformities or a curse even.

 

Ultimately, it’s these things which make Chaos Space Marines interesting – and whilst the amount of carnage in these Word Bearer’s novels makes for an entertaining read, it doesn’t quite deliver a captivating portrayal of 40k’s greatest villains (meaning Chaos Marines, not necessarily Word Bearers specifically).

[Lexington]

That is my interpretation of Lorgar and the XVII Legion anyway, please excuse the rant. :)

...

 

That...was...awesome. Perfectly put.

[Kol Saresk]

But like you said, the tragic-hero is expected. In fact, it is seen pretty much everywhere. Not neccessarily in 40k but in other literary works as well. But the tragic-hero usually is a hero who regrets something. Or, like in this case, people who wanted power(Kor Phareon, Erebus, Marduk) find a way to obtain that power along with immortality. Kor Phareon was even able to take on a Primarch while exhausted and could have won if he had not gotten stupid.(Yes I know it is a retcon, just pointing out not start a discussion on it.) so there really is no tragic-hero where the Word Bearers except where Lorgar is concerned. He was the only one who was manipulated into changing his beliefs. Argel Tal doesn't really seem to care. As long as he can serve his Primarch, he probably never will. I could see him becoming a daemon prince and parking his butt right outside of Lorgar's room on Sicarius. But that's the point, out of all the Legions, the Word Bearers did not have to be corrupted. Not even Lorgar truly needed to be corrupted. He simply followed the path that his planet's religion had laid out long ago. There was no tragic fall. Simply a super-sized, super-smart, psychic child who was taken advantage of.

[firestorm40k]

Not even Lorgar truly needed to be corrupted. He simply followed the path that his planet's religion had laid out long ago. There was no tragic fall. Simply a super-sized, super-smart, psychic child who was taken advantage of.

Ahh, but that is the tragedy of the character. And that is part – not necessarily the greatest part – of what makes it interesting.

 

When it comes to a ‘tragic’ fallen character, the ‘tragedy’ bit doesn’t need to be dwelt upon really – just the fact that it’s there makes them more three-dimensional as a character.

 

Whether they were tricked, manipulated, or fell knowingly, it all adds depth.

[Kol Saresk]

And technically every Word Bearer fits into all three categories. Their religion is a result of the direct intervention of the Ruinious powers. They tricked the inhabitants of Colchis as worshipping them as benevolent dieties. Then the Word Bearers and Lorgar fell into the embrace of Chaos knowing exactly what it was and knowing what would come from it. What we know of Marduk's past is that he participated in the Battle of Calth. He killed Kol Badar's blood-brother on one of Calth's moons. He then later on became a Disciple under Jarulek. Roughly ten thousand years later, he kills Jarulek by fulfilling a prophecy that was actually about him.(Marduk) We also find out that there were Loyalist elements amongst the Word Bearers and he was a part of the Brotherhood that removed them. That is more past backgrounf than what Honsou has. Honsou is an Iron Warrior who has both the gene-seed of an Iron Warrior and an Imperial Fist who died in the Iron Cage. Then we see him luck into commanding a Great Company as a Warsmith. Then we see him kill said Great Company trying to burn Ultramar to the ground and then some. Same lack of background. But Honsou is everyone's favorite Iron Warrior. I guess what I'm saying is, if lack of character depth makes the Word Bearer series bolter porn than what about the Iron Warriors series? It suffers from the same relative lack of character exploration.

[Wade Garrett]

Out of the Honsou novels I've only read Storm of Iron, but that book is just as much a Guard novel as it is an Iron Warriors book, and even among the Iron Warriors he shares the limelight with Khorne beserkers, scheming sorcerers, and burned out veterans who are just going through the motions (i.e. have interesting character flaws and conflicts). I never really got that sense of backbiting and clashing among the Word Bearers until the third book. Sure, the war leader kept snarling about how he longed to wear Marduk's rib cage as a hat, but for the most part that's all he did, and among Chaos Space Marines that's practically being best buddies.

[Saa]

Out of the Honsou novels I've only read Storm of Iron, but that book is just as much a Guard novel as it is an Iron Warriors book, and even among the Iron Warriors he shares the limelight with Khorne beserkers, scheming sorcerers, and burned out veterans who are just going through the motions (i.e. have interesting character flaws and conflicts). I never really got that sense of backbiting and clashing among the Word Bearers until the third book. Sure, the war leader kept snarling about how he longed to wear Marduk's rib cage as a hat, but for the most part that's all he did, and among Chaos Space Marines that's practically being best buddies.

 

I'll accept the caveat of your parenthesised comment but...... Did you actually just refer to Forrix as a 'burned out veteran'!!!

 

Release the hounds!!!! J'accuse!!!!!!

 

:D

 

Saa

 

......or something like that

[Kol Saresk]

Aren't the Word Bearers supposed to be a cohesive Legion though? To kill a Dark Apostle without good reason(i.e. he was tainted by a genestealer) is punishable by death in the XVII. And when a Dark Apostle falls in battle, you can almost expect most of the senior staff to be killed depending on the nature of the Dark Apostle who picks up the reigns. Marduk kept Kol Badar alive because of his strategic capability. Kol Badar left Marduk alone because he was the Dark Apostle of the 34th Host. He was VIP now where before Jarulek had planned on letting Kol Badar kill Marduk as soon as they stole the Necron artifact. Jarulek's death prevented that and also allowed Marduk to become protected by his new position in the Host. The Word Bearers don't give a whole lot of backstabbing room. The only reason it happened in the third novel was because of the enmity between Kor Phareon and Erebus bubbled to the surface in a small scale civil war. If the entire Legion knew about the final circumstances of the battle, Marduk would probably be executed for his part in the death of thousands of Word Bearers, despite the fact that it was done with Erebus' approval. Just for the massive amounts of men, supplies, slaves and Apostles were lost in the endavor.

[Wade Garrett]

I'll accept the caveat of your parenthesised comment but...... Did you actually just refer to Forrix as a 'burned out veteran'!!!

 

Release the hounds!!!! J'accuse!!!!

 

I'm not exactly sure what about that characterization of Forrix got your dander up, but I calls em like I sees em.

:)

 

True, all the Iron Warriors in the book have been fighting the forces of the False Emperor for centuries, but Forrix is repeatedly shown to have done it for so long that he's just going through the motions without really caring about the whys or wherefores. Sort of a

"Death to False Emperor and all that stuff. Sure. Oh, yeah, ummm...Iron without! If you guys need some logistics done I'll be in my tent drinking cheap beer and listening to Hank Williams Sr."

 

P.S.

It was certainly not my intention to suggest that his character is represenative of any past, present, or future vetarans hear in the real world. At least, not ones who haven't been part of daemon worshipping hosts of siege masters who are several centuries over do for their next stint of R & R.

[The Prophet]

Actually there is a Horus Heresy short story, Scions of the Storm, by the same author in Tales of Heresy. It's awesome!

[Saa]

Actually there is a Horus Heresy short story, Scions of the Storm, by the same author in Tales of Heresy. It's awesome!

 

I have to say I felt that story was a mixed bag. The story itself was pretty good until Lorgar showed up at the end and appeared as a bit of a fruit loop. That disappointed me a bit....no....a lot.

 

Well structured, organised WB conducting their thing, prosecuting their 'compliance' wars and then Lorgar shows up slathering and going RAWWR a bit. Urrrgh no. Didn't do it for me. That's not Lorgar.

 

Saa

 

......or something like that