Hyaenidae Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 So, I'm working on some "tall-scale' marines, adding plasicard to the thighs and calves to give my marines some height. The problem is, the card and the actual mini aren't really fusing like I thought it would. Matter of fact, some of them are falling apart, even days after application. I'm using Galeforce Nine plasticard, and citadel plastic glue, if that helps any. Am I supposed to prepare the plasticard somehow? Where am I going wrong? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grotsmasha Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I have this problem sometimes, a soapy wash like everything helps a little. Cheers, Jono EDIT: Also some plasticards I've used have had a super-sneaky plastic film on them that wasn't easily detected. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021584 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jupiter Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Plasticard always works best with superglue in my experience. Yeah, superglue isn't ideal, but it does the trick Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 @Grotsmasha: Soap and water was the first thing I tried, epic fail. Never thought about the sneaky film, I'll go check... @Jupiter: Done that too, and I was disgusted with the results, as I had to do some heavy shaving and greenstuff work to get the legs and arms to even a sub-par standard, which is something I'm no longer willing to accept as I progress with trying to improve my modelling skills. Thanks though, man. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021607 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonCopy Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Some plastic glues are not really very good, especially the stuff from GW. Try a better brand. I use ProWeld from Ambroid. I works. Sometimes too well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021625 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 Interesting. Thanks for the heads up, I'll check that out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subtle Discord Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 That's really weird. Plastic glue is a solvent, and works by actually melting the plastic parts so they can fuse, and then the solvent evaporates and the pieces essentially become one piece. There is usually some plastic actually suspended in the solvent, to aid in the bond, but the solvent does most of the work. If liquid glue is touching both pieces, the bond should be solid. While I agree that GW plastic glue isn't the best (mostly due to its price point, imo) I've used it in the past with no problems. I can't remember if I used it with plasticard, but it shouldn't matter that much. That said, I avoid thick plastic glue (like GW, Testors in the orange tube, etc) like the plague. Once I started doing more work with plasticard, I discovered thin glue, and never went back. My brand of choice is Tamaiya Extra Thin (I love the applicator brush built-in to the cap), but others like the mentioned ProWeld will give similar results. The problem you might be having is with the density of the plastic. Scratch building plasticard tends to be more dense than the styrene plastic in miniatures and models. I've found that it's easy to add a bit too much glue, and the model/miniature plastic will soften too much, while the plasticard is melting 'just right'. Perhaps you're adding enough glue to melt the miniature plastic, but it's not quite enough to get the plasticard to 'kick'. Try adding the glue to the plasticard first to get the melting action started, then attaching the card to the miniature. Tweezers might be necessary in that case. If density is an issue, a thinner glue will help a lot with the bond. Since it has more solvent, it can melt the plasticard easier, and get the fusion to happen better. Thinner glue will also be better in general. You can use capillary action to 'pull' tiny amounts of glue into small gaps, so you use just enough to get the job done, with no mess. It also dries much faster, so you're not waiting nearly as long. One word of caution, as was mentioned by CarbonCopy; Not all thin glues are the same, and some will melt the plastic very aggressively. If you're building something completely from scratch building styrene, the high density of the plastic avoids this problem. But, when you try to add plasticard to a miniature it can turn the softer plastic to slag very quickly. This is why I prefer Tamaiya Extra Thin. It's a great blend of thin-and-watery, but not too much 'heat'. If you use something with more 'heat', you need to take care to use it very sparingly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021812 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 Very thorough, my fellow fine frozen Canadian friend! Some really great tips there, guess I'm off to the hobby shop this weekend to get some thin plasic glue. Thanks man! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3021943 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted March 25, 2012 Author Share Posted March 25, 2012 Hate to double post, but... Discord, I took your advice, and problem solved. I switched from the citadel glue to zap-a-gap thin, and I haven't had a problem since. Thanks for that, oh master of the plasicard. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3023756 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seleucus Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I also keep the 'medium' and 'thick' Zap-a-Gap glues around, as these give you more time to manouvre your pieces together - especially metals or large monsters etc, before sticking permanently. They also tend to fill small gaps at the time of glueing, reducing the need to go back with GS. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3024110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subtle Discord Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 No problem at all, 1000heathens. I'm not quite a 'master' yet, I think. More like a 'journeyman'. Still so much to figure out. :) But when I think I can offer insight on a subject, I have no problem blather on about it. Now, you said you're using zap-a-gap, and if it's giving the results you want, then by all means, keep using it. But, unless they have other products, as far as I know that's a 'super glue', not really a solvent-based plastic glue. It's a good thing on one one level, since it's going to work on metal and resin as well. Just be aware, with plastic-on-plastic bonds, it will be a little less than perfect than proper plastic glue. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3024113 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flak Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Also, be sure you're using the correct type of plasticard if you want to use a typical plastic welder/cement. Many companies make several different plastics, I have ABS sheets and Polystyrene sheets from Plastruct for instance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3027009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chromedog Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Is it styrene or ABS sheet? Whilst ABS is in the styrene family and can look like styrene (white ABS sheet and white styrene sheet look the same), ABS is resistant to the rather weak solvent in plastic glues and requires a more aggressive solvent (1% toluene just doesn't cut it.). Something like the cement used by plumbers for PVC or ABS pipe (ABS really needs the aggression of MEK in the solvent to get it to soften). Just thought I'd mention it because I got a pack of their "styrene" sheet and it turned out to be ABS sheet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/249471-plasticard-and-plastic-glue/#findComment-3027196 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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