Marshal Rohr Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Just finished Void Stalker. It got me thinking of how GW could present the background in the next edition and Chaos Codex. For a while now GW has been writing the background as if the 13th Black Crusade never ended. The 5th Edition rule book doesn't offer any conclusive details on the outcome, and the majority of fluff points to it still going on. Which leads me to the conclusion that all of the background written for the conclusion of the campaign was simply to give players closure, and doesn't actually represent where the 'story' of 40K actually stands. The implications of this are that in the next Chaos Codex, we will see the Legions divided and diverse as ever (each warband its own entity, etc) but united behind a purpose. It isnt about being pirate lords and raiding for supplies anymore. The Legions have finally gathered enough strength to wage war on the Imperium again. To me, this is preferable. All of that fluff about Quarren retaking the space around Cadia, etc doesn't really matter in this context. Abaddon won, Cadia fell, and the galaxy is finally embroiled in total war. Tyranids pour in on the Eastern Fringes, Orks rampage unchecked, and all across Obscurus fleets of traitors burn world after world. Also, Void Stalker was an awesome conclusion to the trilogy. Well written, cohesive, and dramatic. Few moments actually got me choked up, but in a manly way. The Night Lords really exemplify the 'murderers in law' mentality, and I think its fitting that the VIII Legion will play a larger part in the downfall of the Imperium. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Just finished Void Stalker. Damn! I need to figure out what program can read that type of file. Glad to hear it was good. As for the end of time thing, this is probably where GW will keep the game for awhile. That's fine by me though, the "good" guys about to be overrun and the "bad" guys about to take over..... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033671 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 iTunes is good, if you have it. Just drag the file from Downloads to Desktop and convert to iTunes. If you never had an iBook before, it will automatically pop up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033723 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lay Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 I wouldn't be surprised if GW retconned the old global campaign fluff. I think they already did it in Fantasy with the Warhammer Forge books. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033771 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artein Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Warhammer Forge is an alternate timeline as far as I know. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033865 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akylas Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Downloaded as a mobi file you should be able to use Amazon's free Kindle app for your pc to read it. Damn! I need to figure out what program can read that type of file. Glad to hear it was good. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033891 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogi Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I just finished Void Stalker myself. Was expecting a lot, And by the end was very impressed. I really can't describe how much I enjoyed it. I used the firefox epub add on to read it. I have no idea how to actually save it to my computer though.. Which is lol. (figured it out nevermind) The implications of this are that in the next Chaos Codex, we will see the Legions divided and diverse as ever (each warband its own entity, etc) but united behind a purpose. It isnt about being pirate lords and raiding for supplies anymore. The Legions have finally gathered enough strength to wage war on the Imperium again. I think you will always have chump lords raiding for supplies. But yeah I agree with that, "Death to the False Emperor" is likely back with a vengence. Pretty cool. Spoiler Void Stalker Considering that Jahn zar banshee was talking about the Rhana Dara or whatever its called being so close It really lines up with 40k the world ends at midnight. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3033963 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted April 7, 2012 Author Share Posted April 7, 2012 I was pissed when Uzas was almost vindicated. Made me hate Cyrion Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vazzy Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I was pissed when Uzas was almost vindicated. Made me hate Cyrion Oh agreed brother, most definitely agreed Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034015 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogi Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I was pissed when Uzas was almost vindicated. Made me hate Cyrion Yeah that got a rise out of me also. But at the same time they are really as bad each other. I think probably the greatest thing this book did was reaffirm the disgusting weak nature of the Night Lords. Before Soul Hunter I never liked the NL. But during I began to see The Night Lords through Talos' deluded eyes. And well they seemed kind of alright. After VS the delusion evaporates and I return to not liking them. All is as it should be. I think the Ultras and sucessors made out like bandits in the coolness factor (I'm in your fortress efficently killing your men) except Tolemion or whatever. Spending all his time yammering should be against the codex. Personal highlights for me were the lascannon freem, and how he put in Cyrion's, "so how are you?" this time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034073 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted April 7, 2012 Author Share Posted April 7, 2012 I think A D-B likes to poke fun at the bombastic portrayal of Imperials sometimes :D Its humorous until I realize for a fight to the death these guys are sure talking alot and constantly quipping. Really the book puts the final nail in the coffin for how chaos factions operate and act in 40K. No cohesion. No discipline. No focus. Just surviving. Only Abaddon or a super powerful lord can pull them together long enough to get anything done, but even then they still have lost everything valuable about being a true threat. I know a fair few people who miss the feeling of belonging and community with their army, but then again thats the natural fallout of the hyper-game focused 3.5 dex. The part where he says that their greatest enemy will always be each other felt like an epiphany. Chaos marines are too divided to destroy the Imperium, but they can sure cause a lot of problems. I just wish they'd bring a little discipline and cohesion back to the faction and Legions. The two are not mutually exclusive. Abnett made the Blood Pact incredibly cool by making them 'professional' (used in the loosest of terms). As for the VIII Legion, well... Im with Yogi. I fell into the whole 'Talos has it right' camp almost straight away and now after finishing Void Stalker I actually feel a little like Talos would have to realize he was delusional and had built up this fantasy that was never true. I think A D-B did a really good job of putting us in Talos' shoes for the trilogy and getting us to think like he does, then shattered the preconceptions we formed and showing us the way it really is. Kind of painful (if literature can be painful) but ultimately a damn fine conclusion. It sucks that there isnt any hope for Chaos to pull itself together (irony?) but I took away a new perspective and mindset about the background and Im very pleased with it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034084 Share on other sites More sharing options...
A D-B Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I can totally get away with replying to spoiler text without using spoilers, here. I think probably the greatest thing this book did was reaffirm the disgusting weak nature of the Night Lords. I'm glad that came through, but to qualify just a bit... Ultimately, despite individual character perspective, I had to be true to the published lore. It's the easiest thing in the world to make a faction "cool", by having them confident, wailing on their enemies in badass ways, and never fearing a compromise to their principles. That's fanservice, and it works great in tie-in fiction, but it can sometimes feel false. The very easiest way to do fanservice and to make a faction exalted above all others is to have them "right", and everyone else is wrong. Have them secretly wronged by those in power, but hold to a secret truth no matter what. Drizzt. Wolverine. Any Bad Guy Who's Really a Good Guy Deep Down, often in young adult fiction. But the Index Astartes article makes it clear who the Night Lords are. That overall theme, of them rarely attacking without first having overwhelming odds - and often just doing what they do because they can and they want to ("because absolute power corrupts absolutely") had to come through by the end of the narrative. I liked the idea of several souls caught up in that - variously accepting it, denying it, wanting to change it, or lost in the flow of it. It sucks that there isnt any hope for Chaos to pull itself together (irony?) but I took away a new perspective and mindset about the background and Im very pleased with it Oh, think there's hope. I mean, that's what the 13th Black Crusade pretty much was. The death knell of the Imperium (at least, one of many, with all the xenos races...). That's why Abaddon is so notable. He did finally unify Chaos. He's done it before, to varying degrees. This time, he did it pretty much all the way. We just see it - in this series - through the eyes of one of the least trusting (and least trustworthy) Legions, who are motivated primarily by self-interest and the least-interested in straight-up difficult fights. So any rising tide of The Evil Horde will by necessity have them a little hesitant about fighting in the trenches and caring about the ideology of the other guys. EDIT: Added an "R". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogi Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Ending spoilers. @ADB Interestingly for me this switch came with them preying on a relatable innocent faction. The lost colonists. And putting it in the readers face. There was no way to not see it. Since this is the NL traditional prey its only right this happen. Also in the second epilogue is there are translation of that last sentence? Or shall it remain mysterious for ever? "Viris colratha dath sethicara tesh dasovallian. Solruthis veh za jass…" If not I'll just have to make something up.. Like: "This daemonic disturbence brought to you by the Night Lords. Remember to scream.." I'd also like to say what you did with Dec in epilogue 3 was interesting. Impressive really. And so easy to mess up. Interestingly my mind automatically read his words with a boys voice, which lessened his menace and left me doubting whether despite all his advantages he would be up to the task.. But yeah. Its obviously there was a lot of effort put into the book. It shows I felt like I was reading an epic or something. I often wonder if one of your strengths is that you write slow, so what you write is better. Uzas was from the start my favourite character, him becoming almost some sort of mad murdering savant child* was not the expected outcome. But I enjoyed it anyway. *Child in the sense of the argument with Cyrion, just emotion, no sense and such naviety.. Anyways I hope you get a nice chunk of my $14. This was the best book I have read in quite a while. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034228 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 $14?!?!?!?! I thought it was only $9! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034236 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Yogi, the translation of that phrase is "Brothers, stand in midnight clad. We bring the night". It's stated in Soul Hunter, from what I remember. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034241 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Every time someone brings up the End Times I always keep remembering two snippets of text from the 3'rd edition rulebook. From page 96: "As wriggling maggots upon a rotted corpse they glut themselves upon the rank flesh that is the Earth. Such is mankind blind and bound to a dying world, nought but the writhing worm that mires itself in the corruption of its own progenitors. They who feast today do so in ignorance of their mortality. For tomorrow the must die or change, and, if changing, then forever open their eyes to the dark hunger of eternal life." And from page 120: "Now the great wheel of human existence turns almost full circle. From the cradle of the Earth it has turned through vast epochs of time. Once in the light of the sun it turned as civilizations rose and fell and were forgotten. In the light of the starts knowledge blossomed and withered whilst the wheel span on. Now the great wheel of human existence, almost complete, turns again as it approaches a time of dying and the moment of inhuman birth." TDA Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034255 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goreshed Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Gw had hinted that this edition was going to be focused on the other aspect of the galaxy, not just the Imperium. I cannot remember where I saw it (I think it was on B&C when there was more buz going on about 6th edition) but personally I take it as them not necessarily putting Imperium on the back burner but I would hope that Chaos and the other threats (nids, dark eldar, orks) would be more prominent or at least give off the feeling of the Imperium is being squeezed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034260 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogi Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 $14?!?!?!?! I thought it was only $9! Australia is filled with upper aristocracy of the world, therefore we must pay more. /s But yes if I want to wait I can use the bookdepositryuk and get it cheap.. But i was impatient. Hopefully ADB gets a bigger cut, but who am I kidding. EDIT: I forgot to say it was totally worth it in this case. No regrets. @Lord Caerolion. Ah many thanks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/250276-end-of-time/#findComment-3034262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.