new/alternative stormraven model

[Gentlemanloser]

Space Wolves get 4HQs! Massive Wolves to Ride on! Pet Wolves! 20 point mini's with FNP and EW that don't give Kill Points! Devs that can split their fire. And MOAR!!!

 

And are getting *all* the FW goodies, that *some* other Marines aren't being given.

 

Really, can we please stop with the terrible "You GK get a load of cool things!" arguement. All the Marine Codexes get thier own unique cool stuff ('Nilla Marines get AV13 Deads! And Thunderfires! And Sternguard! And LotD! And LS Storms!!!!!) that no one else gets.

 

This is just FW stuff, so it's not like the rules are official anyway. Just get what you want. If you and your opponent have agreed to use FW units you have already agreed to use non-standard rules. Make up your own and have fun.

 

FW is official. You no longer expressly require your opponents consent to use any of the 'standard' FW units. That went out when you needed to field 1500 point armies to use Special Characters. Yes, you opponent can refuse to play you. They can refuse to play you if you bring 3 Land Raiders.

 

Unless you're playing Apocalypse, then you should be using the FW rules as written. No making stuff up here. So when FW tell you it's a Heavy Slot unit, it's a Heavy Slot unit. Not Fast, not Elite.

 

And when they tell you your army can't use it, your army can't use it.

 

Unless you start to use house rules.

 

And good on you.

 

But then you're no longer playing 40k, but *your* version of 40k. And you can do what you want.

[The Holy Heretic]

This is just FW stuff, so it's not like the rules are official anyway. Just get what you want. If you and your opponent have agreed to use FW units you have already agreed to use non-standard rules. Make up your own and have fun.

 

Sorry to break it to you man, but FW rules are just as 'official', as those from the rest of GW. They're all printed in books and available for all, made by the same company for the same game.

 

Sure some nutters deny playing FW stuff, but I'm yet to be presented for a sensible argument, as to why not.

 

Some people even have the audacity to call FW stuff 'broken', as if the rest of GWs codexes are in a perfect equilibrium of balance - heck, you're on a GK forum, you know, you're on easy street B)

[commander alexander]

I have never ever, ever, ever, ever heard of or seen FW rules or units being able to be used in "normal" games of 40k. Iv'e only ever heard of it being used with both players consent, and usually in a game of apocalypse, or "specialized" game using house rules and possibly those from Imperial Armor. So no, I do not see how they are "official" rules for standard games of 40k.

 

And yes, everyone gets their own little goodies, so everyone can stop complaining.

[Gentlemanloser]

The original FW books stated "Requires opponents permisson" or the like.

 

The new ones just don't.

 

FW are as much 'official' GW as GW is.

 

And yes, everyone gets their own little goodies

 

Unless you're a marine army where FW makes units for all other marine armies, bar your own, of course...

[The Holy Heretic]

But just why are you whining about it GL?

 

You don't whine about not having thunderwolves in your GKs, you don't whine about the 'lack' of rail guns, and you aren't demanding use of The Sanguinor.. Whats the difference? :lol:

[Gentlemanloser]

Becuase they're all part and parcel of an armies basic/standard list of unique toys.

 

And that's fine.

 

FW goodies are all extras. And FW have deemed it ok to make 'generic' marine extra stuff, and deny it to one of the Marine Dexes (in some cases two...) for no reason at all.

 

An arbitraty Nah Nah! You got the Storm Raven, so you can't have our NEW assault Ram, or the Storm Eagle. Hell, we don't have *any* AV13 Walkers, yet aren't allowed the Contemptor. Really FW?

[The Holy Heretic]

But why should you get them?

 

And why is it worth whining about?

[Gentlemanloser]

Whining? I'll accept nerd-raging. :cry:

 

But why should you get them?

 

Becuase I'm a marine army, and every other Marine army is getting them. Why should I be singled out to be left out?

 

GK are the red-haired stepchilds of 40k? Should I just go cry myself to sleep on my oversized pillow?

[The Holy Heretic]

Please do :cry:

 

The whining is getting tiresome. Akin to a 5 year old kickin' and screaming on a supermarket floor, cuz' hé can't get a bag of crisps.

 

If you don't like the rules, change the rules -_-

[Gentlemanloser]

I do...

 

But I can't change Forgeworlds ideology.

 

I think it's bad, on multiple levels.

 

(And I guess the reference was too obscure. Oh well. :P )

[Grand Master Caloth]

I have to agree with HH. GL, we have been getting shorted by FW, and it sucks. we got shorted when GW took away our access to storm shields. But you play the GKs because something in their fluff sings to you, or because you like to use a solid, powerful army, or because you like how the units work together. If you are only playing them for the FW goodies you wourn over not having access to, go play nilla marines and call them Exorcists. GKs have been using this equipment since their inception, back in the mists of time during the Heresy. The GKs know their enemies. The GKs know their wargear. And the GKs know that they more than exceed the standard against their enemies with THAT wargear. Such is their belief, and such is mine.

[Gentlemanloser]

I don't think *anyone* plays an army for the FW goodies.

 

Unless they're playing a FW army list...

[Jacinda]

FW is official.

Really? They weren't in 'Ard Boyz last year; there is not going to ba an ard boyz this year :). I still can't take my Repressors to any GW tourney. I know FW rules are not used at War Games Con's grand tourney but they do allow a limited selection for the Apocalypse game. FW is still an add on. Supplemental rules. Most tourneys will allow FW models but I am not familiar with any that allow FW rules except for a few specialty games; certainly not the main tourney.

[Gentlemanloser]

Tournament Organisers are thier own breed, that house rule 40K.

 

Every Tournament is little more than a house rule, as they impose specific rulings for thier Tournament, that aren't a part of 'normal' 40k.

 

Edit;

 

From the 'official' GW website, on an upcoming Event;

 

Badab War Part II Campaign Weekend

 

You'll need to bring a fully painted, 2500 point army from any Warhammer 40,000 Codex or the Imperial Armour Books volumes 9 & 10 - the Badab War books

 

But IA9/10 *aren't* official GW products?

[Jacinda]

Tournament Organisers are thier own breed, that house rule 40K.

:)

[The Holy Heretic]

I agree that something is wrong in 40K. But this has nothing to do with all armies not being clones of each other like chess.

 

I lament the poor balance, the random movement, the silly cover rules etc. But I am rather pleased with the variety in armies - although, I wouldn't mind having a couple of the marine chapters gobbled up by a hive fleet :D

[torgaddon666]

LOL, what I need is more variety in my area

 

old times

 

Marines x 2

Eldar x 1

Necrons x 1

C:SM x 3

Ork x 1

 

New times

 

Marines x 6

Chaos x 2

[RedemptionNL]

So how is a Storm Eagle different to a Storm Raven?

 

Expect better. With more Troop Capactity and more Weapons...

Well I wouldn't say better, just different. It has greater troop capacity, but it loses the ability to carry a Dreadnought, and the ability to disembark when moving flat-out.

 

Making a gunship out of it is also very expensive. Where the Raven can swap the heavy bolters to a multi-melta for free, the Eagle has to pay 15 points. Add those las-cannons and you're up at 300 points already, which is pretty expensive for an AV12 vehicle.

 

And why should GKs be denied Castus Assult Rams, or Contemptors?

Well, Grey Knights were founded post-heresy, so they don't have any pre-heresy Contemptors. And as Daemons don't make a habit of flying around in space ships, I guess they don't have a need for Assault Rams either. The few times they would need to board a ship, I assume they'd teleport in as usual.

 

But yeah, Forgeworld works mostly in cycles, giving only a few armies loving at the same time, when they're featured in one of the Imperial Armour books. Necrons didn't have anything but the Pylon for the longest time, but they're going to get a buttload of new stuff in the future. I'm sure they'll get around to making new Grey Knights stuff eventually.

[Gentlemanloser]

so they don't have any pre-heresy Contemptors.

 

I'd disagree with this.

 

The Chapter was founded *during* the heresy (Had to be, as the Emperor was still alive), with all the equipment avaiable at that time stashed away on Titan by Malcador, then *bamphed* into the Warp.

 

And as Daemons don't make a habit of flying around in space ships

 

Chaos Space Marine do. ;)

[RedemptionNL]

so they don't have any pre-heresy Contemptors.

I'd disagree with this.

 

The Chapter was founded *during* the heresy (Had to be, as the Emperor was still alive), with all the equipment avaiable at that time stashed away on Titan by Malcador, then *bamphed* into the Warp.

 

Aye, but I think they already had the newer marks of Dreadnought around that time. See Bjorn the Fellhanded for example, who was entombed around the same time (M31). And of course Grey Knights would have gotten the latest equipment.

 

And as Daemons don't make a habit of flying around in space ships

Chaos Space Marine do. :)

 

True, but Chaos Space Marines are more of a target of opportunity for Grey Knights, rather than the main objective. They're Daemonhunters after all, not Chaoshunters.

[Gentlemanloser]

And FW release a new Pred varient.

 

Guess which is the only Marine army in the game *not* to get it?

 

Go on, I'll give you one free guess. :devil:

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/downloads/prod...Executioner.pdf

[the jeske]

but you dont have preds in the first place , so where is the problem . + 5pts fort would break most FW stuff.

[Gentlemanloser]

Ah, so becuase Ward gives us something powerful, FW are incapable of making *anything* for us?

 

I see. Good ol' Ward eh?

 

Maybe FW should make us a Heavy Conversion Beamer Rhino, or Chimera...

[Vesper]

This is why 40k is screwed : people whine and want to be overkill to the max.

Kinda sad.

[Toasterfree]

or they dont live up to their name sake....

 

 

i play both GK and SW...

i dont want my armies to have the same thing. AMEN FW!!!

I have a GK list cause i want a different flavor for MEQ, if i wanted everything to taste the same i would be playing vanilla.

 

quitcher :yes: in bout it, put your big boy pants on. grow up, or stop gaming. two choices and simple.