Kol Saresk Posted April 25, 2012 Author Share Posted April 25, 2012 Yeah I never saw Chaos as being random. I saw it more like being in a total, true state of Anarchy, You know, controlled Chaos. The only Order is "might makes right" and pure Darwinism in its natural habitat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Well, it wasn't as bad as it sounds... The random parts of the chaos wargear was quite balanced imho, and was pretty reliable anyway. The dread rarely frenzied because he needed to first fail a test on Ld10 and then roll a "1" to fire all his weapons into the closest model! So even though you got a ff, the max damage was one model gone... ...I loved my three-man two-reaper termie squads...they were so awesome! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Yeah I never saw Chaos as being random. I saw it more like being in a total, true state of Anarchy, You know, controlled Chaos. The only Order is "might makes right" and pure Darwinism in its natural habitat. Agreed. There is often some kind of pattern or method to the madness, its just not for mortals to know. I think what the developers are trying to do with randomizing things is give Chaos the feel of big risks, big rewards as Chaos is all about that line of thinking (typical outcomes are death, spawndom or daemonhood). My two cents on why that doesn't work on the tabletop is that competitive players want to minimize elements not under their control, to make the most reliable list possible. Thats why redundancy is so common with unit choice or loadouts. Adding risk runs counter to this goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristoff Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Yeah I never saw Chaos as being random. I saw it more like being in a total, true state of Anarchy, You know, controlled Chaos. The only Order is "might makes right" and pure Darwinism in its natural habitat. I see a little bit of randomness in chaos, but a controlled randomness, if that makes any sense. It's focused towards a goal far more than the Orks who just seem to desire randomness for the sake of randomness and to have a good scrap. When I read this statement, it made me think about the Daemon Weapon, which is probably the biggest example of this (Possessed being the current most unfortunate). What if instead of rolling a "1" you smack yourself, it works closer to "Gets Hot!" or Khârn's damage? So you swing (or fire in the case of Tzeentch) and for every roll of "1" you smack yourself/squad and it gets distributed as if those hits were done by the enemy. You get the randomness, and it's still capricious, but you're not totally frozen by it, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warsmith Aznable Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Yeah I never saw Chaos as being random. I saw it more like being in a total, true state of Anarchy, You know, controlled Chaos. The only Order is "might makes right" and pure Darwinism in its natural habitat. Agreed. There is often some kind of pattern or method to the madness, its just not for mortals to know. I think what the developers are trying to do with randomizing things is give Chaos the feel of big risks, big rewards as Chaos is all about that line of thinking (typical outcomes are death, spawndom or daemonhood). My two cents on why that doesn't work on the tabletop is that competitive players want to minimize elements not under their control, to make the most reliable list possible. Thats why redundancy is so common with unit choice or loadouts. Adding risk runs counter to this goal. I wouldn't have a problem with it if our Dreadnoughts offered a Big Reward balancing out that Big Risk. But we get bog standard Dreads, nothing special. No Venerables or Iron Clads or Furioso or psychic or HQ type variants like the loyalists do. No special weapons or special rules that balance out the fact that sometimes they will go crazy and eat our other troops. We have to go to Forge World for things like marks or unique weaponry or competitive rules or sensible flavor, while the codex gives us LOLRANDUMB CUZ THEY IZ EVILZ! EDIT: I don't know why I was thinking about Dreads specifically, but really this sort of thing applies nearly across the board with our current codex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 True, especially about the dreads. I think its a situation of there being more loyalist armies out there that get more updates and more attention so we expect to see things change more rapidly with them so I'm REALLY hoping that once Chaos gets a new codex, we start to get some "dread-love". At the bare minimum, the 10,000 year old veteran warriors of Chaos should get access to a venerable-style dread, I mean we have lived longer than some loyalist chapters have existed. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I'd love to see some IW siege dreads, khornate zerker dreads and so many others. We could have some seriously cool dreadnought upgrades if they thought about it. But no they'd prefer to give us the "bad guys are dumb so we'll just make them insane and attack their own people. Yeah that'll totally work!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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