The Holy Heretic Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Love the Sanguinor model, but I just can't find 275 points to spend on a character and can't really see the point in the Sanguinor - he seems just an overpriced Sanguinary Priest to me? Can anyone point out, why he is worth the points :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Overpriced Sanguinary Priest? Apart from erm...no rules similarity whatsoever, I don't really see where you're coming from with that comparison. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049625 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Holy Heretic Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 A Priest has a bonus bubble, the Sanguinor has a bonus bubble, both helps other squads in assault, I find they're quite similar :lol: - oh, and please answer the question, instead of just spouting snide comments. Thank you :o Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 A Priest has a bonus bubble, the Sanguinor has a bonus bubble, both helps other squads in assault, I find they're quite similar :lol: - oh, and please answer the question, instead of just spouting snide comments. Thank you :o Your comparison was unlucky at best, so I can see why he's reacting in the way he did. Both have a bubble, yes - and yet they are so different rules-wise. Also, their profiles don't match, the Sanguinor can actually handle stuff on his own, has better wargear, a 3++ save and other interesting special rules. No, he is not an 'overpriced Sanguinary Priest'. He is expensive, but he's the wrecking-ball that a SP can't even dream of...just throw him at anything, he will do damage. I agree with Morollan's comment, though, your question does not really make sense in the context of what you have written prior to it...you ask if the Sanguinor's merely an overpriced SP but yet you have taken a look at his profile and special rules...which speaks for itself. Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049643 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 but you take priests mostly for FnP and they hide in units , more offten then not buffing razor units . Sang is a melee only unit , each turn he is not doing melee he is kind of a wasting the potential . And yes mefo is better , as is taking libby/libby or libby/corbs. dont understand the poster boy thing . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Can anyone point out, why he is worth the points ;) He's not. I think Mephy and Sangs points cost should be reversed - even then its iffy. I think he would be worth it if he were an IC. There are a few threads here about how to use him and gain the best advantages out of him. He's by NO means worthless or ineffectual - but definitely not worth the points imho. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I am not a fan of the Sanguinor. Looking at what he does, I would almost always prefer Mephiston or Dante for less cost. Or as Jeske said, 2 Librarians or a Libby and Corbulo. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judaz Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Versus Eldar I'd rather have Sang instead of Mephiston. When Mephiston ain't getting those wings he is running a long, long way. But, as James said, I would rather have Dante. Dante and a Reclusiarch vs Eldar or Dante and a librarian vs almost everyone else. Everyone knows that Corbulo counts as a Sang priest right? Sure, The Sanguinor is a monster, but I wouldn't complain if both Meph and Sang were at 250 pts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 As others have said, he is just too expensive. Unfortunate really, because the model is quite nice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049902 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mezkh Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 I've used him a fair bit, a couple of times he's been punked early, but generally he's a monster. Really good in an army with lots of jump pack ASM. Worth it imo. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3049930 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Angel Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 How do I look at the Sanguinor ? 275 points break that down One upgraded Sergeant becomes a 2 wound model with +1 weapon skill +1 Initiative +1 attack that cannot be singled out in combat. So take the points for a captain out after deducting the cost of the sergeant (25) thats 75 points off. Now you have a 200 point model with a 2+ armour save a 3++ invun and eternal warrior who re-rolls hits and wounds on HQ units. Thats pretty cool but he gets better. Keep him 6 inches near a squad and his aura gives your 10 man assault squad 10 extra attacks, virtually the same as having three extra marines on the charge so there is another 54 points of marines plus the extra S5 WS5 attacks he gives the upgrade sgt and your sangiunary priest. If you leave The Sanguinor near the Death company and Lemartes on the charge its brutal, a free banner on the DC. The Sanguinor has his own furious charge as well. Near a priest he is nigh unstoppable a 2+ 3++ feel no pain furious charge model with WS 8 S6 master crafted attacks Even Abbadon, Ghazhkrul and Draigo find duties somewhere else when The Sanguinor turns up. He re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ units. After he kills the HQ's his value drops a little He is good in high point games just do not let him get tarpitted by dreads and such where you cant use him in synergy. Yes 275 points is high for a model thats a unit of one but the points come back in spades if you use him within your army. His presence often denies the full deployment of other HQ's on the board which can be a big influence. As said he is a big help in jump pack lists and perfect for that style of play Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050026 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nathan Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 id rather take him in my army vs grey knights than mephy, because then hes not like to get instajibbed, though you do have fears of all thegrey knight shooting smoking him right off the board early is still not an easy thig to do due to the 2+ 3++... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050241 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 So take the points for a captain out after deducting the cost of the sergeant (25) thats 75 points off. which is all well and nice , but A no one takes cpts . B the sgt cant leave the unit so the extra wound is unimportant. yes he does get an extra A and I . only that is still a win more thing . on small squads it is unimportant because they wont to be in hth in the first place on squads ment for hth it doesnt matter because if something rolls them , then the 1extra A wont help . Sang is a 275pts fire magnet and that is all . yes he gives a +1A bubble , but he cant join units this means the bubble wont be there for a very long time and he realy does die fast . + outside of DoA list[weakest build BA have] he doesnt work at all. Even Abbadon, Ghazhkrul and Draigo find duties somewhere else when The Sanguinor turns up. He re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ units. each one of those specialy draigo kill sang before he gets to kill them . + unlike those dudes sang does get shot up so arrives in hth with fewer wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Kovash Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 If playing competitively, Mephiston is the better choice. When playing against friends, try Sanquinor out. Some times he does great, other times he's a bust. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050403 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorre Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 So take the points for a captain out after deducting the cost of the sergeant (25) thats 75 points off. which is all well and nice , but A no one takes cpts . B the sgt cant leave the unit so the extra wound is unimportant. yes he does get an extra A and I . only that is still a win more thing . on small squads it is unimportant because they wont to be in hth in the first place on squads ment for hth it doesnt matter because if something rolls them , then the 1extra A wont help . Sang is a 275pts fire magnet and that is all . yes he gives a +1A bubble , but he cant join units this means the bubble wont be there for a very long time and he realy does die fast . + outside of DoA list[weakest build BA have] he doesnt work at all. Even Abbadon, Ghazhkrul and Draigo find duties somewhere else when The Sanguinor turns up. He re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ units. each one of those specialy draigo kill sang before he gets to kill them . + unlike those dudes sang does get shot up so arrives in hth with fewer wounds. I have not run the numbers, but my spider sense tells me that any of those fights vs ghaz, abbadon or draigo. Sanguine should be at least a 50-50 fight, but with the Sanguinors ability to mark a hq for rerolls it should really tip the fight in his favour. Even more so if he gets the charge Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050410 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Angel Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 So take the points for a captain out after deducting the cost of the sergeant (25) thats 75 points off. which is all well and nice , but A no one takes cpts . The Sgt is virtually a Cpt statline and a non IC that cant be singled out in combat. Whats better? a 3 wound Cpt or an 11 wound Sgt that hits like a Cpt, there is a big difference in the 2, advantage here is to the Sgt over the Cpt B the sgt cant leave the unit so the extra wound is unimportant. yes he does get an extra A and I . only that is still a win more thing . on small squads it is unimportant because they wont to be in hth in the first place on squads ment for hth it doesnt matter because if something rolls them , then the 1extra A wont help . The Sgt upgrade is random, DOA lists are seldom less than 10 in a squad unless the Sanguinors blessing goes to a vanguard vet squad and thats probably a good thing, the Sanguinor is a model suited for DOA Sang is a 275pts fire magnet and that is all . yes he gives a +1A bubble , but he cant join units this means the bubble wont be there for a very long time and he realy does die fast . + outside of DoA list[weakest build BA have] he doesnt work at all. I would think its helpfull to be able to move that bubble around I dont see any disadvantage here. One round of shooting and he is in combat I have not had too much trouble keeping him in one piece till combat. Even Abbadon, Ghazhkrul and Draigo find duties somewhere else when The Sanguinor turns up. He re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ units. Each one of those specialy draigo kill sang before he gets to kill them . + unlike those dudes sang does get shot up so arrives in hth with fewer wounds. We will just have to disagree on that position How do I look at the Sanguinor ?As said he is a big help in jump pack lists and perfect for that style of play Remember my original post the Sanguinor is suited to DOA lists and I would reccomend you play him only in DOA. Looking at it again the way you do he is even better value as his jumpack is free and having him nearby his aura is the same as a 30 point banner so knock off another 25 points plus another 30 points for the banner. He is now 145 base points for a WS 8 S6 on the charge 5 attack HQ model :D Who re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ's Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Even Abbadon, Ghazhkrul and Draigo find duties somewhere else when The Sanguinor turns up. He re-rolls hits and wounds on enemy HQ units. each one of those specialy draigo kill sang before he gets to kill them . + unlike those dudes sang does get shot up so arrives in hth with fewer wounds. I don't use the Sanguinor very often due to points restrictions but in the few games I have used him he kicked the crap out of Ghazgkul and Abaddon. Not tried him against Draigo yet but can't really see that it would be a cakewalk for the Grey Knight. Other than Hammerhand, none of his abilities are particularly useful against the Sanguinor and statwise they are not far apart, plus Sanguinor can reroll hits and wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvious Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Love the Sanguinor model, but I just can't find 275 points to spend on a character and can't really see the point in the Sanguinor - he seems just an overpriced Sanguinary Priest to me? Can anyone point out, why he is worth the points :( Believe it or not, but The Sanguinor can go toe to toe with Mephy in a one on one combat, so don't dismiss him too likely. His ability is simple, he is a character killer who also provides a boost to other squads in your army not just through his bubble but also with his sargent upgrade. First off he is weapon skill 8. That is really nasty, he is hitting most things on 3s, even a hell of a lot of Eldar stuff, including some characters. He also has a 3+ invulnearable save which is really, really useful. A lot of the players I have played against don't really consider him a threat so they don't even bother to try and pick him out with shooting beforehand, not very smart if you ask me about it though. Last but not least is his ability to re-roll hits and wounds against an enemy HQ choice. Thats the killer, never underestimate anything that gives you re-rolls. So guys that The Sanguinor has killed. Well he killed off Logan Grimnar and his Wolfguard in termie armour pretty much by himself. There was a priest in combat as well but The Sanguinor pretty much did all the work. He also took out Vulcan in combat and laid two wounds on Sicarius before bitting the bullet as well, so he actually had two characters in that fight but I should point out that in the early stages Dante and a unit of Sanguinry guard were there as well, but for some reason (can't remember it was a doubles game and wasn't my unit) they ran away. I should also point out the Sanguinor did that second part with Vulcan & Sicarius without his re-rolls since the character he had chosen his re-rolls wasn't in that combat. So in essence, The Sanguinor is what you want to take if you're having problems with an enemys character. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050638 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 "So in essence, The Sanguinor is what you want to take if you're having problems with an enemys character. " Don't try to out-rock a rock. There are myriads of ways to counter rock units outside of just trying to up-one them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050666 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvious Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 "So in essence, The Sanguinor is what you want to take if you're having problems with an enemys character. " Don't try to out-rock a rock. There are myriads of ways to counter rock units outside of just trying to up-one them. Just telling it like it is. I'm not saying he can kill off every character but he does do well against the vast majority of them and I think someone else noted where The Sanguinor actually won a character tournie, even beating the Dark Eldar characters to first place. Also I should point out that its an HQ choice he can re-roll against so even against units that count as HQ choices but are not independent characters can be chosen for this ability, things like the Avatar of Khaine, Tyranid HQ slots, etc. Besides out rocking a rock is a valid option, sure its not the only one but its still a valid one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3050743 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Besides out rocking a rock is a valid option, sure its not the only one but its still a valid one. When you have the best rock around, sure. The thing is, against anything other than the designated enemy HQ unit, Sanguinor is still going to do good, but nowhere near 275 pts good. Run him into a wall of hammernators or paladins, and you ain't going to be too happy. That's why generaly, trying to out-rock a rock is a bad idea. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3051010 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Angel Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I run an all DOA list the Sanguinor is best used in one, he does very well out rocking rocks and works well why not use him its not like I have an abundance of long range shooting heck 12 inch melta guns is it. The last 2 times he was used it was Arjac and his gang and the Swarmlord, he nailed both of them Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3051011 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvious Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 When you have the best rock around, sure. The thing is, against anything other than the designated enemy HQ unit, Sanguinor is still going to do good, but nowhere near 275 pts good. Run him into a wall of hammernators or paladins, and you ain't going to be too happy. That's why generaly, trying to out-rock a rock is a bad idea. I did qualify my statement when I said this: "I'm not saying he can kill off every character but he does do well against the vast majority of them........." Anyway this doesn't change the fact that this is what The Sanguinor does. I never said he was an automatic inclusion or anything, I just said he is a character killer and a buffer for other units, which is quite simply a fact. If your opponents rock is quite menancing, then sure whittle it down using other methods before engaging The Sanguinor & other units (who will gain benefit from his aura). Not to mention that The Sanguinor when used decently can easily recover his points cost and more. Sure he may die too easily if not used correctly but for the most part if you're smart he will do a great job. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3051160 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 "Sure he may die too easily if not used correctly but for the most part if you're smart he will do a great job. " The problem is that his job is one that is not really needed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3051173 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvious Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 The problem is that his job is one that is not really needed. Oh well then, I guess Games Workshop should have only included in our codex the bare essentials as dictated by Deschenus Maximus. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/251536-the-sanguinor/#findComment-3051290 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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