Red wolves

[eyeslikethunder]

Canis Helix and Genseed are 2 different things

 

We think the genseed wont work without the Canis Helix, but who knows what has been tried to get it to work, maybe thats where the Wolfbrothers went wrong, using the Canis Helix on non Fenris people making them mutate in to beasts.

Outside of Fenris no one knows how Canis Helix is made.

 

Th BOFT does suggest that it is possible to separate the two(or at least the wolfy stuff from the gene seed) and have chapters elsewhere with the right tech and some intelligence

 

and as valerian states lone wolves does give Lost companies options

[greendestiny]

Valerian : WOW! Thanks for taking time to dig up all of those quotes. Other than a few SW novels I am a little uneducated on them.

 

So from what I am seeing there is no known successor chapters to the SW that succeeded.

If they were a successor chapter of the wolves it is completely without the knowledge of the SW or the rest of the imperium.

Any ties to the SW should be shrouded in mystery and known only to a few.

[greendestiny]

What do you think of these wolves for mounts? I am pretty impressed with the sculpts:

 

http://www.ragingheroes.com/collections/co...-of-cyberwolves

[DrDoom]

Ok, this is what I put together over about the last 20 minutes, so it may not be perfect fluffwise, but here goes.

 

RED WOLVES

 

Every chapter has its secrets. Beliefs and rites, ceremonies and skeletons that must be kept from the Imperium at large. For the Space Wolves, the greateest of these are the Red Wolves.

 

Thousands of years ago the great Primarch Russ, favored of the Emperor disappeared. Before he left on his great journey, he told his sons he would return to lead them at the end of the Age of Man. For most Space Wolves, thats enough. They wait for the return of their Primarch while safeguarding the Allfather's domain. But the loss of Russ weighs heavily on them.

 

For some the burden is too much to bear. Perhaps it is some mutation within the Geneseed or the call of the Canix Helis, maybe its their own impatient nature, but they are not content to sit and wait for the Primarch to come to them. The primarch might have need of certain sons before he returns, and besides, what better way to serve the Emperor than at the side of Russ.

 

If the pull is strong enough for a warrior then a single ship appears in orbit over Fenris. A strike cruiser of ancient provenance, it is the color of blood, with only a great wolves head as heraldry. Many times, no communication is sent from the surface or to the ship. A lone shuttle leaves from one of the many docking bays in the Fang. In this way a Space Wolf, sometimes two or three, join the Red Wolves.

 

They are those who search.

 

The Strike Cruiser returns to the world of Bloodfall, where its arrival is met with feasting. Its is not unheard of for Great Heroes of the Space Wolves to "take the Red" for a few months or years before the call fades and they return to their brothers at the Fang. These occassions are marked by days of feasting, boasting and the renewal of great oaths among the Red Wolf brothers.

 

But after the feasting they return to their great quest, hunting their father. Many legends surround the disappearance of Russ, but most say he traveled into the Eye of Terror to settle a score with his brother Magnus, or that he folloed a Dark Eldar raiding party back to it city of shadows. So the Red Wolves have become great hunters of Eldar and the forces of Chaos. The search for Primarch is long and difficult, but the Red Wolves will never give in.

 

............

 

Use it if you want. No hard feelings either way.

[Russ Brother 92]

Doc Doom (ace name btw.) that's a brilliant piece and if it's okay with you - I would love to use that as a way of putting both some colour into my wolves and keeping imho. one of the greatest bits of SW fluff - the great hunt :D

 

Greendestiny - they've been shown before and whilst for me they're too mechanical to use as mounts (I'd use them with an Iron Priest) but many others thought they were better than the GW ones :P - still great sculpts either way

[DrDoom]

Doc Doom (ace name btw.) that's a brilliant piece and if it's okay with you - I would love to use that as a way of putting both some colour into my wolves and keeping imho. one of the greatest bits of SW fluff - the great hunt :D

 

 

Oh yeah, by all means use it. I'd be honored.

[greendestiny]

Dr. Doom. Nice bit of fluff there! I really enjoyed it, and feel that it expands the current Space Wolves nicely. The only issue I have is that I actually want my chapter to be separate from the original SW chapter. I think your idea would be cool to put into a current list. Do up a single unit in your army that wears the red and has the history of your fluff attached to it. I think that would be awesome, you could use them in place of a unit of Legion of the Dammed or something. Again loved the fluff.

 

Russ Bro 92- I agree they would probably be better for an Iron Priest or something. They might be nice to throw in the mix just to keep it different from other SW armies.

 

My Fluff Thoughts:

 

The more I have worked on the Red Wolves in my mind over the past weeks the more I am seeing them not as Norse Viking style wolves but as the wolves that are associated with vampires. The main thing that got me on this was the world they live on, Bloodfall. The other thing that I was thinking was the only documented battle we know anything about was with the Night Lords whose symbol is the other primary Vampire associated animal the bat. The relationship to the Emperor is like that of the Wolf and the Bat to a Vampire lord. The Emperor is for all purposes an undead being that is sustained in life by the death of others. While the bat has turned against it's master the wolf remains faithful.... (kind of along the lines of a dog being mans best friend). With that in mind I have been creating my chapter fluff on the concept of werewolves. I originally wanted to mix in elements of the old west but after reading as much as I could find on the wolf/vampire relationship I am more interested in following that thread. My thoughts are that it would be sort of a mix of Space wolves and Blood Angels. Elements of both being apparent in their symbolism and fighting style.

 

To mix in with the strong Greco/Roman theme that is seen in SM armies I think I will introduce the people of the world of Bloodfall as the ancestors of of a King that had a run in with The Emperor during his crusade and concuring of the planet. I would use the old myth of Lycaon King of Arcadia.

 

Here is a Wiki link if you want to read it for yourself. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycaon_(Arcadia)

[greendestiny]

Okay yet another idea that I see is directly from the Space Wolves 5th ed codex page 20, first paragraph, left column.

 

"The Lost Company of Svengar the Red"

Sailing through a wyrmhole in search of his lost Primarch Svengar the Red finds himself and his men transported far beyond the rim of the galaxy, past even the Ghost Stars. The void is empty as a heretic's soul. Svengar's men begin to talk of whispered voices in the night, promising them safe haven. Unsure of his coordinates, Svengar presses on. Days pass into months, On the cusp of turning back, a dark planet is glimpsed in the distance. The Space Wolves head towards the distant orb, expecting trouble. Instead they find a civilization of tall, fair people who live in opulent luxury of their own making, far frmo the war and confusion of the galactic core. Relieved to have found a base of operations Svengar and his men begin to relax and enjoy themselves, feasting and recounting tales of their deeds to the fair people of the far0flung world. It is only when Svengar makes a casual pass at one of their women that the Space Wolves realize their hosts are not people at all. Though they fight bravely, Svengar and his men are never seen again.

 

You could easily take that and make it into lost group that found thier way back to the galaxy and crashlanded on Bloodfall. Later creating thier own subchapter. Shamed by their failure they never return to Fernis and even hide their heritage........stating they are a codex chapter and it is only coincidnece that they share the same totem as the SW chapter...

[greendestiny]

Well 6th edition worked out nicely since my fluff idea was to have a space wolves army as a successor army to blood angels. Now I can litterally have a SW/BA allies army!! So exciting.

 

To make them not quite so wolfy and a little more artistic I am mixing bitz to make a marines. Here are a few pics that I have so far:

 

When possible I am using the Ragnar shoulder armor since it is the only one that looks like the Red Wolves symbol. I also wanted to go with primarily the more central Asian looking scimitar chainsword from chaos sm line to better represent my middle eastern flavor army.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/IMAG0021.jpg

 

I went with the SG upper body for the muscle style top and the legs are the most basic of the SW line with only a wolf head on the left knee.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/IMAG0022.jpg

 

I also wanted something ancient looking so I threw in the chaos plasma gun. and used a standard capitan head from the tactical sm sprue.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/IMAG0023.jpg

 

Even though my army doesn't have the option for Apothicary SMs I wanted to model one to go with my TDA unit. This one counts as having a Combi Plasma gun and a chain fist. http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/imag0005.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/IMAG0004.jpg

 

Here is my TH/SS WG in TDA. Again some wolf elements but much less than a standard SW army.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/IMAG0012.jpg

 

Here is a Combi Plasma /PF TDA http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x277/greendestiny_bucket/imag0007.jpg

[Wulfebane]

I really like these combi-plas conversions. Also, the twc box has a couple chainswords in a scimitar style, I believe.

[greendestiny]

Thanks Wolfebane

[greendestiny]

I know it has been about a year since I wrote on this topic but I had some thoughts that made me dust off the old Red Wolves again.  What if their GS was from the Night Lords?  This may explain why they have been present in battles against them.  It also fits nicely in with my thoughts of this is their deep dark secret.  Unknown to the rest of the Imperium they have Chaos Marine GS.  They were in the process of being created prior to the fall of Konrad to Chaos.  And it is well known fluff wise that even now the Night Lord GS is still very pure.  The Red Wolves try harder than ever to show thier loyalty going to great extremes to prove to themselves they will not fall to Chaos......

 

What do you think?

[Vash113]

I know it has been about a year since I wrote on this topic but I had some thoughts that made me dust off the old Red Wolves again.  What if their GS was from the Night Lords?  This may explain why they have been present in battles against them.  It also fits nicely in with my thoughts of this is their deep dark secret.  Unknown to the rest of the Imperium they have Chaos Marine GS.  They were in the process of being created prior to the fall of Konrad to Chaos.  And it is well known fluff wise that even now the Night Lord GS is still very pure.  The Red Wolves try harder than ever to show thier loyalty going to great extremes to prove to themselves they will not fall to Chaos......

 

What do you think?

 

Well it's your army so you can do anything you want. But if you want this background to fit into the rest of the fluff then I don't really think it works. There were no Chapters being made before Konrad fell to chaos. All marines made with Night Lords gene-seed would have been recruited from Nostramo and implanted there for shipping out to the rest of the Legion fleet and Konrad destroyed Nostramo towards the end of the Horus Heresy. Konrad destroyed Nostramo because without his presence the world had fallen back into anarchy and all the recruits to his Legion were psychopathic serial killers. So even if there were some Night Lords who didn't make it to the Legion fleet and escaped the destruction of Nostramo they would not likely be loyalists.

 

Now during the Cursed Founding there are repeated rumors of traitor gene-seed being used, so you could say the Chapter was made with NL gene-seed during the Cursed Founding, but I don't know why you would want to do that, what in particular is the import of the Night Lords gene-seed?

[greendestiny]

Nothing super important about the Nightlords.  I am focusing on the relationship between vampires and wolves at first I thought about using Blood Angels and may still but then in the little bit of official fluff there is about the Red Wolves there is a battle between them and the Night Lords.  The night lords use the symbol of the bat the other animal that is tied to Vampires.  Other than that it just gives them a problem background to work with.  Like I said nothing too solid just trying to think of how to make them more interesting for the fluffy side in me.

[Vash113]

Nothing super important about the Nightlords.  I am focusing on the relationship between vampires and wolves at first I thought about using Blood Angels and may still but then in the little bit of official fluff there is about the Red Wolves there is a battle between them and the Night Lords.  The night lords use the symbol of the bat the other animal that is tied to Vampires.  Other than that it just gives them a problem background to work with.  Like I said nothing too solid just trying to think of how to make them more interesting for the fluffy side in me.

 

Well the challenge of creating a background for a Chapter is the balance between creating something unique and going too far overboard.

 

For instance have you considered White Scars as the founding gene-seed? It's unusual but the Scars bear certain stylistic and codex divergent similarities with the Space Wolves. Relatively few Chapters are made with White Scars gene-seed so while entirely possible in the fluff it means such chapters would be relatively rare. The name and symbol similarities with the Space Wolves could also help inform the background, for instance perhaps the combination of White Scars gene-seed and perceptions of association with the Space Wolves has led the chapter to be relatively ostrasized by Imperial institutions and most of the other Chapters they fight alongside and perhaps this has led to the Chapter holding a grudge against the Space Wolves, viewing them as uncouth barbarians little better than renegades who, as an added insult, make it far harder for the Chapter to make allies or gain much needed support, supplies and technology from the greater Imperium.

 

The White Scars background also opens up some interesting character for the Chapter. For instance Jaghatai Khan was known as a very illusive individual who was extremely difficult to pin down, even for his own Legion, and he was a leader who valued personal initiative in his warriors. So perhaps the Red Wolves Companies and Squads follow their Primarch's footsteps, operating for extended periods autonomously like the Raven Guard, engaged in their own hunts and campaigns far from the oversight and command of a typical Chapter and effectively living off the land. Scrounging materials, supplies, food, munitions and tech, perhaps even personnel wherever they go, returning to the Chapter homeworld only rarely to receive reinforcements and share information.

 

To follow this theme onto the tabletop maybe each squad contains an apprentice for the Reclusium, Apothecarion, Armorium and Librarium. A junior Lexicanium, Apothecariat Initiate, Armory Apprentice and Chaplaincy Initiate assigned to each squad to see to their medical, technical and spiritual needs in the field and provide some protection against the powers of the warp. While this would have no effect in the rules it could give you opportunity to paint or model different members of a squad differently. Maybe one brother bears shoulder pads from a tank crewman or has a darker red helmet or shoulder pad to show his status. Maybe the Chaplain initiate has a rosarius painted on his shoulder pad or knee-pad or maybe he bears a black helmet or shoulder pad. Similarly maybe the apprentice apothecary has vials and needles on his belt and a white apothecary helix on a knee-pad or shoulder-pad while the Lexicanium might have a small psychic hood built into the back of his armor or maybe just some psychic conductive cables linking to the back of his helmet and maybe he has a yellow or blue knee-pad or shoulder pad with the symbol of the Librarium on it to show his status.

 

Long deployments could also give lots of opportunity to model jury-rigged repairs and patches to armor, mixed marks of armor and weapons, incorporate some Forge World early marks of power armor and bolters to show the Chapter using whatever equipment they can lay their hands on.

 

Also the White Scars practice head-taking and ritual scarring, practices the Red Wolves might have retained. So you could model enemy heads as trophies and paint or model scars on bare heads, or (since the White Scars paint "scars" as well) you could paint white jagged scars on helms to show veterans, different squads, or even to note particular achievements by different models. Maybe Brother Kharjo killed a Hive Tyrant with a shot from his bolter so he gets a trio of white scars bisecting the right eye of his helmet.

 

Anyway those are just some ideas and suggestions, I hope they help.

[greendestiny]

I hadn't thought about the White Scars.  They are an interesting chapter.  Other than reading one of the BL books on them I really don't know much about them.  One of the things that I have wondered about with any chapter is how much do you tie them into thier parent or Primarchs original chapter?

[Vash113]

I hadn't thought about the White Scars.  They are an interesting chapter.  Other than reading one of the BL books on them I really don't know much about them.  One of the things that I have wondered about with any chapter is how much do you tie them into thier parent or Primarchs original chapter?

 

Well as a starting place you can consider what aspects of the primogenitor chapter are a result of inherent traits of the gene-seed, which are the result of doctrine, and which are influenced by the cultural beliefs of the Chapter homeworld. With the White Scars the basic traits of the Chapter seem to include a predisposition towards speed which is expressed through the heavy use of land speeders, bikes and transports, while a successor Chapter may share the same attitude, they may favor another approach.

 

The White Scars are a fairly codex adherant chapter with very few divergencies. The limitation or lack of Devastators is due to the preponderance of mobile tactics, so a successor may choose another approach and include Devastators. Similarly the lack of Dreadnoughts is due to the cultural beliefs of Chogoris, while a successor might have similar cultural beliefs, they might not and thus may maintain Dreadnoughts. Brotherhoods are effectively little different from codex companies and the result of doctrine dating back to the Great Crusade, again a successor may or may not reflect this structure.

 

The belief structure of the White Scars reflects the culture of Chogoris, the use of Stormseers for instance, and successors again could or could not share a similar belief structure. Other aspects of the White Scars beliefs are more common amongst a variety of Chapters, such as the practice of taking heads or trophies, a successor could well do something similar. Many Chapters take trophies, the only thing different about the White Scars is the way they do so and the way they display these trophies after they are taken. A successor Chapter may chose to reflect this attitude in their own trophy taking practices. Similarly the practice of ritual dueling, the source of the scars actual facial scars is due to the practice of honor dueling with tulwars. Many other Chapters practice honor duels, so it stands to reason a successor Chapter of the White Scars might favor their progenitor chapter's approach to the practice and use tulwars, as well as refraining from healing the resulting scars and wearing them as marks of pride.

 

The traits inherent to the gene-seed are likely to be possessed by a successor. Doctrines of the progenitor chapter may or may not be shared by the successor, depending on how close they are to their parent chapter and the source of their training. Cultural beliefs of the progenitor are, I would think, considerably less likely to be shared by a successor chapter who will have their own culture or cultures from which they recruit to influence their own belief structure and inform particular quirks in structure, tactics, markings and so forth.

[Jonny Wolf]

Brother Valerian,

  You are so bad ass.  :)

 

Brother Jonny Wolf

[greendestiny]

So maybe more based on Attila the Hun than on Genghis Khan?  Since I want more of an East European/Western Asia feel for the army. 

[Valerian]

Brother Valerian,

You are so bad ass.

Brother Jonny Wolf

Thank you Brother Jonny Wolf; I try to do my part. When I can serve as Lore Master, I do so.

Valerian