6th edition just on the horizon

[Chaeron]

No doubt lots.

 

I don't mind - but it'll be the same jump towards Iron Warriors in 4th.

 

Again, I don't mind this - but as a long time player of both... frustrating to see everyone jump on the bandwagon we've had to slog through for years :P

[Araziel]

http://i740.photobucket.com/albums/xx43/Araziel__619/DSC_0001-5.jpg

 

Got my copy an hour ago, and jumped straight to the ally section. It's worded like this;

 

 

If you wish, your army can include one allied attachment for each primary detachment in your army (normally one, but if you're playing a larger game it might be two). As with the primary detachment, all units in the allied detachment be chosen from the same codex, and this must be from a different codex to the one used for the primary detachment.

 

As with the primary detachment, this section is split into a number of dark and light boxes, where dark boxes are compulsory sections, and light boxes are optional. An allied detachment will therefore always have one HQ selection and at least on Troops selection.

 

Bear in mind that some combinations of armies and allies are more effective (and more eagerly entered into) than others - this is covered in detail later in this section (see page 112).

 

Bigger Games

As your collection on miniatures grows, the urge to use them all at once will become hard to resist. Above a total of 1,999 points, the Force Organisation Chart becomes a very limiting factor.

 

This being the case, if you're playing a game of 2,000 points or more, you can take an additional Primary Detachment.

This gives you access to up to six choices each from elites, fast attack and heavy support sections, up to four HQ choices, a massive potential of up to twelve troop choices, an additional Allied Detachment and an additional Fortification. In this case, your Warlord can be form either of the Primary Detachments in your army. As stated earlier, taking an extra Primary Detachment allows you to take an additional Allied Detachment (which must be from the same codex as your other Allied Detachment). All Primary Detachments must be taken from the same codex.

 

 

So, guess what Death Guard can do? Take Epi and benefit!

[NoLifeKing]

Get ready to hear grey knights screaming about the cheese.

 

HAH! The Daemons and Heretics will fall before us! ;D

[Jay Taint]

Well ... that's so cool! :)

But do modifiers brought along by one's allied detachments really affect the main force as well? It doesn't say anything about that in the box you've posted. (No offense.) I wouldn't be surprised if there's a rule somewhere that does limit one faction's cheese to only that faction, although they can well be allies, and well follow the same God.

 

Thanks for bothering to upload the rules, Araziel!

 

Cheers, JT

[Araziel]

Between here and the "6th Ed Imminent" thread, I've posted all of the rules for allies.

 

Basically, it doesn't say that anywhere. I wouldn't have thought it would be possible were it not for the very specific wording in Epi's special rules. Ie, "all models with the Mark of Nurgle", which actually affects enemies as well. So, in this case, I think it actually does apply.

 

 

I guess we'll have to wait for a proper FAQ to see if we can. I know I'm going to be waiting for said FAQ before I decide what allies to include. It'll either be Daemons, or Traitor Guard.

[Plaguecaster]

I don't know if this is true or not (as I heard it from one of the members from my gaming club I go to) but he reckons you can't take a special character as an ally after I told him I would be using Epidermis in my Chaos Space marine army is this true (Please say it is not as I want Epidermis)

[Brother Ambroz]

Take 5 chosen with plasma guns and MoN. You'd get at least 5 kills just with that squad.....Epidemeus builds will be crazy!

[Araziel]

I haven't seen a single special rule with alllies that say you can't take special characters in allied detachments.

 

I have a feeling your gaming buddies may simply be terrified into denial :D

[Circus Nurgling]

Well ... that's so cool! :)

But do modifiers brought along by one's allied detachments really affect the main force as well? It doesn't say anything about that in the box you've posted. (No offense.) I wouldn't be surprised if there's a rule somewhere that does limit one faction's cheese to only that faction, although they can well be allies, and well follow the same God.

 

Thanks for bothering to upload the rules, Araziel!

 

Cheers, JT

 

I'm betting against the cheese limiting. I doubt it says anything about it. Otherwise, what would be the point? What would give a player incentive to go out and purchase more pieces from different armies? I'm not saying this is a cash grab by GW, but it certainly is a wise business move, while helping to balance the game IMHO. There's going to be some crazy tournament lists from now on, I'm thinking, and it's going to add so much to the game... I'm pretty excited about it.

 

I already have Daemons and Traitor guard units for Apoc games, so now I gets to play thems with regular games too... so stoked. [nurgling gibbering]

 

I also already have 5-man melta squads and flamer squads for chosen. That 5-man plasma squad is definitely next on the list, Tanith. Never really occurred to me before, but then, racking up kills early was never a major concern.

 

I wonder if I'll have to use those stupid Daemon rules for deploying units from the Daemon codex with an allies list...

[Araziel]

I wonder if I'll have to use those stupid Daemon rules for deploying units from the Daemon codex with an allies list...

 

I would say yes.

 

Especially so if you plan on using other special rules, such as Epi's buffs. Its one thing using his abilities to turn Plague Marine armies into something truly nightmarish, its another thing to just cherry-pick what rules you'd use.

 

 

However, in 6th, reserves start coming on from turn one now, and if you take a bastion with a comms relay as a fortification (not a bad idea for PMs, anyway) then you get +1 to your reserves. In short, it'll be very rare that Epi isn't on the table from turn 2 at the latest.

To anyone who has the Daemon book - does Epi have to be on the table for the buffs to begin mounting up? I'm assuming so, but thought I'd check.

[Brother Ambroz]

I'll check the wording on Epidemius's rule when I get home. At work now.

[Azekai]

On a related note, if this is possible, how many Death Guard armies are going to we going to see spring up after Saturday?

Nurgle is already a popular chaos god, but the obvious Epidemius synergy will probably clinch it. His rules state that the tally applies to 'any Nurgle daemon or model with the MoN, friend or enemy.' Pretty straightforward. I think we might just have a chance against those pesky Grey Knights now.

 

Epidemius is all sorts of win (he is terrific in apoc). I want to field him with the new MoN Decimator. :)

[Araziel]

You know, I'm trying so hard to not get him.

 

I don't want to be "one of those" gamers, we all know them. The guys that seem so have a new army whenever a new Codex comes out.

I keep telling myself to finally get off my butt and make a counts-as Dark Mechanicum army using the Necron rules.

 

 

....but... 3+ FNP!

[Muskie]

I probably won't do it. I've been playing Nurgle too long and never use special characters as a matter of pride. But I wouldn't bet that it is illegal. My distaste for always seeing special characters is not shared by GW HQ or some players. Nurgle loves all his children. If any army is one big happy family it is Nurgle. I will probably be buying the Demon Codex along with the new CSM Codex and the box set. I will probably be adding in non-power armor dudes to my army. I don't think I'll go all Nurgle as I fear to do so I may have to play as Typhus...

 

I probably will run a generic Chaos Lord. I then will bring whatever seems fun, including some allies from my collection of Orks and other old models like Beasts of Nurgle. I want a more mobile army. I also want a higher model count army even though I'm a slow painter. This makes IG or Orks more attractive as allies. Plus orks or wacky and I've been known to do the wacky... Chaos Demon HQ are expensive so using them always in 1500 points game will be a really small army. This may still work well as Grey Knights have proven that small elite armies can be both popular and tournament winning when combined with special characters and a certain dairy or meat product. I don't want to be that guy. I'd rather be the wacky guy with the swarm of Nurglings or the Looted Wagon full of Blood Axe burna boy mercenaries...

[Brother Ambroz]

I thought along those same lines for a long time too Muskie. Then I started to play against SW, GK and BA with their special character armies. Every. Single. Game. Each game I played I had to go with 2x lash DPs, oblits and zerk/PM spam. So lame. I'd love to be able to use one of our SCs, turn around and have them scream cheese for once. That's what I'm looking forward to with this :cuss

[Circus Nurgling]

Yes, Epi has to be on the board to rack up Tally. I'm glad I already have him. I resisted for so long, just because I hated the model with those poorly sculpted nurglings under his palanquin... that and it's god-awfully hard to rack up kills in a mono-nurgle daemon list. Now, though... omg nurglings will be 13 point models with 3 attacks, 3 wounds, and all that gooey stuff Epidemius imbues on his followers!

 

I'm really wondering how deployment will work if my main army is CSM, and my Daemons are allies. Are half of my Daemons to be held in reserve? I'm ok with that, actually. Epi and a squad of nurglings come out on the board, with another in reserve. PMs and Daemon Prince kill things. Uber nurglings come in from reserve.

 

I'm gonna start making my list :)

[Araziel]

I'm still going to wait to see if they FAQ him, or indeed, the ally rules that in some way stops us from doing this.

 

Rumour is our new Codex hits the streets in August, so we may not need to wait that long. Fittingly, I've heard through multiple people that plastic Plague Bearers are on their way.

I'll have to see if I can get the new Chaos book early by the same means I used to get the rulebook :)

[Circus Nurgling]

Well, I already have all the models to play with, and we're kind of having a 6th ed. party this Saturday when we pick up the new rulebook, so I want to have something nasty to christen the book with.

 

I posted the first draft of the list in the chaos lists.

[shortysl]

This is spectacular! "Codex: Daemons is such a bad codex, Grey Knights are auto-win etc. but now we're excited about using our Daemons because they're super-powerful alongside Nurgle Chaos Marines"........

 

I'll let that one hang, but I'll also let it be known I'm not attributing this attitude to EVERY Daemons players, just the ones who always whined about it until now.

 

Personally, I hope things go well for Chaos Space Marine players and even Daemon players. 40k should be about tactical superiority (and a touch of dice rolling luck of course). An army is no fun to play against if it can be steam-rolled, and similarly an army is no fun to play WITH if it can be steam-rolled. I look forward to playing against the new Chaos codex just as I look forward to getting the new Dark Angels codex.

[Araziel]

Well, I already have all the models to play with, and we're kind of having a 6th ed. party this Saturday when we pick up the new rulebook, so I want to have something nasty to christen the book with.

 

I posted the first draft of the list in the chaos lists.

 

I'll have to go and have a look at the list.

 

I'm with you on the 6th ed party. Well, kinda.

There's a club about 20 miles on either side of where I live. One of them has found out I've had the rulebook since Wednesday, and so knows all the rules. Due to some funding problems, said club can't afford to get the book for a fortnight... so I've been invited (read = begged) to get there first thing Saturday, like 8am, so the leader of the club can nosey through the book before club starts at 10am, and then we're both teaching the kids who regularly attend how to play together.

 

Between the fact that I've agreed to this, and all the writing/rules clarifications I've done for people in the Amicus/Imminent thread over the last day, I fully believe that I should now be made a Saint by the Imperium.

I'll accept no less, and if it's not granted by the time the new Chaos book comes out I'm going to burn Terra so bad it turns into a new sun.

 

This is spectacular! "Codex: Daemons is such a bad codex, Grey Knights are auto-win etc. but now we're excited about using our Daemons because they're super-powerful alongside Nurgle Chaos Marines"........

 

I'll let that one hang, but I'll also let it be known I'm not attributing this attitude to EVERY Daemons players, just the ones who always whined about it until now.

 

Personally, I hope things go well for Chaos Space Marine players and even Daemon players. 40k should be about tactical superiority (and a touch of dice rolling luck of course). An army is no fun to play against if it can be steam-rolled, and similarly an army is no fun to play WITH if it can be steam-rolled. I look forward to playing against the new Chaos codex just as I look forward to getting the new Dark Angels codex.

 

 

I'm with you there.

I have a small Grey Knight army and to be honest, I just completely lost interest in playing them. I bought them the month everything came out, and I still haven't finished painting them despite the fact that they only number thirteen models (go on, see if you can guess what build it is...). Come to think of it, I really should think about sticking them on eBay.

 

Back to the point though, I really think that if GW are going to continue with this trend of making every new Codex completely OTT, then they shouldn't leave any Codex's out of date. I'm surprised they do it, as I'm sure it must affect sales.

[Circus Nurgling]

Hail, Saint Araziel!

 

Funny this: I mostly play with an isolated group, so had no idea Grey Knights were so OP when I had the notion to add something to my collection. I just wanted something that was a polar opposite of my Daemon-based Nurgle warband. That and the loose connection in the Horus Heresy series, insinuating Garro was one of the first Grey Knights. I didn't even know they had a new codex!

 

I got into 40k right about when 3.5 was pulled off the shelves, and collected/envisioned my army based off of that codex. As soon as the new codex came out, you can imagine my disappointment when I was no longer able to field nurglings/plaguebearers/great unclean ones on a whim... further disappointed by how the Daemons codex plays as mono-nurgle, and being the stubborn person that I am and refusing to branch out into the other chaos powers, I started collecting towards small Apoc games so I could take allies. This allies thing really is the best thing that could have happened for me...

[Araziel]

I think I got into it around that time. I can't really remember anymore. I do remember having a terribly painted Word Bearer army that was filled with units like Khorne Berzerkers and Iron Warrior "tactical" CSM squads... anything and everything ;)

 

I was also somewhat dissapointed when I got back into the hobby during a few years off where I found women and beer much more interesting than plastic men.

I agree that allies are going to be, in the majority, a fantastic addition to the game. I'm just trying to ignore the fact that I now need to get at least four new Codex's in the near future (the new CSM book, Daemons, Imperial Guard and Necrons - for counts as Dark Mechanicum), not to mention the basic units needed to field a wide array of allied armies for different types of game.

 

Doing the rough maths, I think I need to spend somewhere in the region of £300 to be able to have the rough basics of each allied force and the Codex's. Yikes ;)

[jerryrich]

ok, i hate to be a party pooper (as i really love papa nurgle, and am gonna be goofy and say i lreally like the idea behind the demons codex) but to get the 3+FnP, you still have to kill 15 guys. now this is next to no problem versus a horde and is probably close to auto win if your opponent doesnt kill epi early. but agains grey knights getting those 15 kills is still going to be tuff. Do i think the allies thing will help our old codex, yes. but do i think it will be auto win, no. I myself am looking at going with A warphead and a BIG unit of shoota boys and mabye some tank bustas or burna boys. LOL now that has some potential to be fun. but hey my other army is an orc horde

[Muskie]

I'm officially dubbing the Typhus + Epidemius + Ku'Gath or any combination of them, the Nurgle All Stars. I won't be using any of these special characters, not unless I'm forced to bring Typhus to field a mono-Nurgle army in the new codex, but I'm sure someone will be doing this and it may even appear at the Golden Throne 40K tournament which is billing itself as the first major sixth edition tournament according to Tabletop Gaming News.

 

Also I've noticed GW's naming of Nurgle special characters seems to be copying my pattern, of using a Roman disease theme, whatever ending a word in 'us' signifies in Latin. I occasionally go off the board such as Bob the Necessary Evil, but I think I'll finally get around to repainting Cancerous the Extremely Naughty.

[General Ravensong]

Thed FAQ is up, and Epidemius has not been nerfed.