appiah4 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Any more news on exactly how a storm raven loaded with troops will be effective in the new rules? Not being able to deploy its troops until potentially turn 3 at its earliest doesn't fill me with confidence. Not to mention inflicting S10 hits on all passengers if it gets shot down in the process. I plan on fielding the Storm Raven with TL Lascannons and Typhoon Launchers as long range support now, like a real gunship, with a minimal scoring unit inside. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3094981 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Any more news on exactly how a storm raven loaded with troops will be effective in the new rules? Not being able to deploy its troops until potentially turn 3 at its earliest doesn't fill me with confidence. Not to mention inflicting S10 hits on all passengers if it gets shot down in the process. I plan on fielding the Storm Raven with TL Lascannons and Typhoon Launchers as long range support now, like a real gunship, with a minimal scoring unit inside. Is there maybe some rule for assault ramps that hasn't been mentioned yet that might make the raven useful again?? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3094984 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If the Hull Points rumor is true, the TL Assault Cannon Baal Predator with Heavy Bolter Sponsons will decimate AV10-11, reliably wreck AV12-13 and reliably glance AV14. I think we may have the best Anti-AV tank in our roster. Not only us...everyone that can ally with us. <_< More on topic: These "rumors" about the new AP rules for CC weapons are concerning me a lot. Lemartes and every other Chaplain just got a huge nerf, and I mean nerf. +2 attacks for Lemmy is cool, even at S6/7, but without AP they are just too regular for his price. And the biggest nerf of all is Furious Charge. What are we going to do against pesky Dark Eldar/Eldar in CC without our beloved Init boost? Or against normal marines even? Shoot them? We are Blood Angels. We hit the enemy before he even notices that he's been hit, and when he tries to react his comrades are already slain, while we stand tall. At least the Init10 attack per assaulting JP marine sounds very fluffy. The new Power Axes stuff really makes no sense at all...unless that Powerfists now have a cost increase of +25 points and Axes are as expensive as PF used to be... Still, no sense at all. Yes axes are slower than swords, but not that much slower...ah well. So sad to see that they've already screwed some rules up...I'm gonna have to rebuild some of the models in my army. <_< Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3094987 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If the Hull Points rumor is true, the TL Assault Cannon Baal Predator with Heavy Bolter Sponsons will decimate AV10-11, reliably wreck AV12-13 and reliably glance AV14. I think we may have the best Anti-AV tank in our roster. Not only us...everyone that can ally with us. <_< More on topic: These "rumors" about the new AP rules for CC weapons are concerning me a lot. Lemartes and every other Chaplain just got a huge nerf, and I mean nerf. +2 attacks for Lemmy is cool, even at S6/7, but without AP they are just too regular for his price. And the biggest nerf of all is Furious Charge. What are we going to do against pesky Dark Eldar/Eldar in CC without our beloved Init boost? Or against normal marines even? Shoot them? We are Blood Angels. We hit the enemy before he even notices that he's been hit, and when he tries to react his comrades are already slain, while we stand tall. At least the Init10 attack per assaulting JP marine sounds very fluffy. The new Power Axes stuff really makes no sense at all...unless that Powerfists now have a cost increase of +25 points and Axes are as expensive as PF used to be... Still, no sense at all. Yes axes are slower than swords, but not that much slower...ah well. So sad to see that they've already screwed some rules up...I'm gonna have to rebuild some of the models in my army. <_< Snorri Agreed, it seems like from these rumours that BA are now more about brute force than speed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3094995 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judaz Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Anyone heard anything about two-handed weapons? And I really hope the Furioso gets 4 HP's. Hopefully the Talons won't be AP3? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095000 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Angel Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Sanguinary Guard may be in better shape, add a preist and see how they go. Hopefully Glaives dont get nerfed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095015 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Admetus Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If preferred enemy isn't as good, and psychic hoods are a bit nerfed, then I think my namesake chaplain may be making a long overdue re-appearance on the 40k tabletop. Sadly crozius' are defined as Mauls now - +2 to S, but no AP. <_< Even so, there's still hope in the Codex vs Rulebook thing. It says in the Chaplain's entry that a crozius arcanum is a power weapon, there's still a chance that it could remain classified as such even with the +2 strength. What a lot of people seem to be forgetting is that even if some of this stuff is in the new rulebook and confirmed, the overhauls are so big that we'll be guaranteed to be hit with a battery of FAQs and Erratas for each and every codex, so the nerfs might not hit us as hard as basing things on the rulebook alone would lead us to believe. Even if its not, I think I might take a reclusiarch over a librarian because they've both had their effectiveness reduced, but reclusiarch has a better stat-line. We'll know everything for sure soon enough... at the moment there's too many ever-so-slightly different from each other rumours that are floating around the same ball park. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095025 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I've been thinking, with the lack of bonus I from furious charge, meaning we only strike at the same I as a lot of other armies, surely this now means tac squads are a viable option, and hang back and rain bolter fire at other armies? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095092 Share on other sites More sharing options...
appiah4 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I've been thinking, with the lack of bonus I from furious charge, meaning we only strike at the same I as a lot of other armies, surely this now means tac squads are a viable option, and hang back and rain bolter fire at other armies? They always were. Now with FNP vs AP2 they are even better. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095116 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysteriousmaskedmystery Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 so wait, we get FNP against PF? so like, my terminators now get a 3++ and then 5+ fnp? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095173 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 so wait, we get FNP against PF? so like, my terminators now get a 3++ and then 5+ fnp? PFs still cause ID in most cases so FNP will not work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095179 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysteriousmaskedmystery Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 ahh, just against plasma then, what, else will have ap2? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
appiah4 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 ahh, just against plasma then, what, else will have ap2? Power Axes, apparently. And probably xenos weapons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 ahh, just against plasma then, what, else will have ap2? Power Axes, apparently. And probably xenos weapons. I doubt that there will be many xenos weapons with AP2. Can't have them killing off marines! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095203 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 How long will it be before we get some 6th edition unit analysis snorri? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095226 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 How long will it be before we get some 6th edition unit analysis snorri? I will have to re-write both of my analyses, for SG and DC are totally different to play after the new rules. No fear of powerweapons, reduced and somehow improved FnP, different Furious charge, 5+ invul(is that still valid?) with powerweapons in cc....man, that's gotta be a whole lotta stuff to play-test.... Well, without being precise here, I'm going to have to play about 20-ish games before I can make any statement...right now, I have finals upcoming from uni and the E Tenebra Lux challenge, which I'm painting my minis for when I'm not studying. Pretty tight schedule, I'd say you could expect some re-written analyses in autumn. :) Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I hope your finals all go well!! I am hoping for an errata on release day more than anything right now, otherwise Dante really will get 0 use for me, and astorath will only be used to remove the dc limit for my DC army, which tbh seems a waste of 220 points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095295 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 ahh, just against plasma then, what, else will have ap2? Power Axes, apparently. And probably xenos weapons. I doubt that there will be many xenos weapons with AP2. Can't have them killing off marines! Tell that to the Dark Eldar. So much access to AP 2 guns. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095323 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysteriousmaskedmystery Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 if astorath has a power axe that is ap2, i might start using him. now he's one of the only named characters with ap2 in assault, and he's strength 6, or maybe 7 with the axe thing? sure the I1 sticks, but if all of our other chaplains have mauls that count as ap 4 or something like that, then i'll take the low I on astorath to at least be able to hurt something, though, that would mean taking JP DC, so it might be cost prohibitive in the end, but i could take one small unit with him, and a couple bolter squads in rhinos or SR. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095336 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamwulf Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I'm not going to comment too much or get my panties all in a bunch over rumors and tid bits people may have seen at a store reading over someone's shoulder or having some red/black/whatever shirt answering questions. It's fun to speculate, but at this point, we are five days away from the actual truth. The only constant that GW has always maintained throughout all it's editions of 40K: Space Marines will always be a good army to play. @mysteriousmaskedmystery- I love using Astroboi! If for nothing else then the Red Thirst bonus, and he is a nasty little bugger in an Assault Squad with a Sanguinary Priest. I'm thinking that combo will still be good in 6th. :tu: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095367 Share on other sites More sharing options...
meniscusmike Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Hahahahaha and you all said that i was mad to put jump packs on my death company, look whos the crazy one now eh? Hahahaha. mic:) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095426 Share on other sites More sharing options...
benation Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Guys, I love the look of the new rules. Here are some things to keep in mind: Sanguinary Guard are 2+ save, they're the mobile terminator combat gods of 6th edition. They can be mounted in a stormraven with jetpacks. The way that their assault works in the new rules is this: The Stormraven says at the start of the turn that it is going hover mode, this means it works as a fast skimmer. Then it can move 6" (models can only disembark if a vehical has moved <6", assault ramp is as normal). After that 6" move, here is the change, models can then move their normal movement out of the vehical after disembarkation (no 2" disembark), so thats an additional 12". After that 12" (18" so far this turn) they can then assault 2d6 (2d6+1 if you take the commander trait for +1 charge distance). The 2d6 can be rerolled for jump infantry, so if you flop and roll a double 1 or w/e, no problem. Then you get 6 autohit strength 4 attacks at initiative 10! Then you're going to be hitting with all those lovely ap3 mastercrafted weapons. When people hit you back, you've got a 2+ armor save which they can't break with their power weapons, and then you get a 5+ FNP, again immune to power weapons! Ontop of this, Blood angels get access to the most psykers of any codex; 2 HQ Librarians, who can be epistolaries 3 Furioso Dreads with Librarian upgrade. Imagine Furioso librarians jumping out the back of Stormravens with their 12" Wings of Sanguinius move and then another power generated from the new rule book... pretty sick. also deathcompay dreads are going to be hideous; 6 attacks on the charge, strength 7 AP2, rerolling wounds and then an extra attack for each kill??? oh and heres the best part; ignore shaken or stunned in a game where hullpoints are the main way to kill vehicals.... lol! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095471 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie1984 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Guys, I love the look of the new rules. Here are some things to keep in mind: Sanguinary Guard are 2+ save, they're the mobile terminator combat gods of 6th edition. They can be mounted in a stormraven with jetpacks. The way that their assault works in the new rules is this: The Stormraven says at the start of the turn that it is going hover mode, this means it works as a fast skimmer. Then it can move 6" (models can only disembark if a vehical has moved <6", assault ramp is as normal). After that 6" move, here is the change, models can then move their normal movement out of the vehical after disembarkation (no 2" disembark), so thats an additional 12". After that 12" (18" so far this turn) they can then assault 2d6 (2d6+1 if you take the commander trait for +1 charge distance). The 2d6 can be rerolled for jump infantry, so if you flop and roll a double 1 or w/e, no problem. Then you get 6 autohit strength 4 attacks at initiative 10! Then you're going to be hitting with all those lovely ap3 mastercrafted weapons. When people hit you back, you've got a 2+ armor save which they can't break with their power weapons, and then you get a 5+ FNP, again immune to power weapons! Ontop of this, Blood angels get access to the most psykers of any codex; 2 HQ Librarians, who can be epistolaries 3 Furioso Dreads with Librarian upgrade. Imagine Furioso librarians jumping out the back of Stormravens with their 12" Wings of Sanguinius move and then another power generated from the new rule book... pretty sick. also deathcompay dreads are going to be hideous; 6 attacks on the charge, strength 7 AP2, rerolling wounds and then an extra attack for each kill??? oh and heres the best part; ignore shaken or stunned in a game where hullpoints are the main way to kill vehicals.... lol! Thanks for this, here is my question: can the stormraven start the game on the table in hover mode or is it forced to come in reserve due to being a flyer? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095481 Share on other sites More sharing options...
khurdur Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 sanguinary guard are going to be awesome-they can crack anything except terminators, and nothing except powerfists can hurt them. Better sell any razorbacks you have...a couple of assault cannons/heavy bolters will take them of the board. Devs should be our main heavy support now. Chaplains/reclusiarchs are a bit nerfed with preferred enemy weaker. Captains-if they had artificier armour, they'd be fine now. But no, our famed chapter with great artificiers gave all to sang guard. He'd be nice in termie rmour though. Libbys should still be fairly solid. Death company ought to be horrendous-5 attacks each on the charge, and their power sword attacks will all go onto the nearest model-two wounds, two kill, no trick! Finally, all terminators are very difficult to kill. We have perhaps the best termies, with BT. FNP, furious charge and the option of preferred enemy make them awesome. And, FNP protects against plasma weapons! break out the terminator death stars ! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095484 Share on other sites More sharing options...
benation Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 @ Robbie1984 I don't know is the honest answer, but the good news is: one of the new Divination powers (which blood angels have access to) allows you to roll 3 dice for reserves and pick which one you want. To add to this, there is a commander perk which lets you outflank with the unit he joins (which will affect his transport too!), or you could take one which allows him to reroll reserves. I think it would be best even if you can hover on to start off the board anyway, you always want to take 2nd turn and then make them waste their first turn, swoop in and be 6s to hit you and then you've got a cover save too. Also there are some pretty nuts psyker powers out there like ones that make your unit ignore cover saves, one that makes enemies reroll armor for a whole turn (!!!?!?!!!!) and one that make enemies attack them selves / do nothing. With some good use of psychic powers and cunning positioning of your storm ravens, I think they will be a royal pain in the arse to take down. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/253536-your-hopes-for-6th-in-relations-to-ba/page/13/#findComment-3095499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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