What icon for the terrible unit of chaos

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

Doing a word bearers force and I'm to show my friend that chaos can still be viable I have decided to take 7 of them in a raider with my lord. I wouldn't mind giving them an icon purely for fluff reasons so if you had to take what is arguable one of the worst units in the dex what overcosted upgrade would you give them :D

[Hellios]

The Icon of Chaos Undecided... I mean glory...

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

Haha yeah thought that but my chappie will have a daemon weapon and MoT to feel more like a dark apostle. The rest of te army will roughly be

 

Apostle

Possessed in a LR

Dread

Maybe normal marines or cult (berserkers or plauges)

Raptors

 

I was trying to have each power represented in the force its hardly tournament winning but it should put up a decent fight and I will probably win a few

[Kol Saresk]

Depends on what you mean as viable. Right now, our most "effective" units are Normal CSM equipped with either 2x Meltas or 2x Plasma(depends on if you want to assault or camp respectively) with an Icon of Chaos Glory so you make Leadership rolls and an Aspirig Champ who has a Powerfist at the very least. We also have Khorne Berzerkers and Plague Marines. For Elites, well the Dreadnought is now somewhat tame thanks to the FAQ, Termies, their great for loading up on combi-weapons, powerfists and chainfists, and Chosen are great for loading up with Meltas, either Infiltrating or Outflanking, popping either a Rhino or another tank and then soaking up retaliation fire. Basically suicide squads. For Heavy Support, Obliterators are the best bet. Havocs have mixed reviews. Defilers, actually I don't know about Defilers to be honest. For Fast Attack, Raptors are extremely overglorified suicide squads. Load then up on meltas, jump them in close to a Rhino and blow up as fast as possible. If you're lucky, enough will make it out and repeat the process. Bikes are in the same boat. Except their champ can be loaded up with a powerfist and it isn't as wrong to give them an Icon of Nurgle. I think that is the somewhat "official" view on the viability of the units. Oh wait, I left out KSons and Noise Marines. Umm, I don't really know about those either.

 

Basically, the most viable list is either one or two Daemon Princes filling up the HQ slot with wings, Mark of Slaanesh and Lash of Submission, Abaddon, Khârn and Typhus. Elites, all three units have mixed results so it is really your choice. For troops, your most viable are Basic CSM as listed above at ten-man strength, Plague Marines(fluffy seven works fine), and Khorne Berzerkers(fluffy eight works), all troops are strongly suggested to have Rhino transports. You can either go with one or the other or mix and match. The usual seems to be something like Berzerkers assualt while supported by CSM with Plague Marines camping on objectives. Oblits are the most common Heavy Support, and no one really takes Fast Attack.

 

Oh before I forget, the Possessed. For the most part, they have no firing capabilities and only close combat weaponry. Unless you are lucky enough to roll on the number needed to get power weapons. That's their biggest problem. They have some great benefits, but you can only use one at a time and you don't even get to pick which one.

[Brother Nihm]

if you had to take what is arguable one of the worst units in the dex what overcosted upgrade would you give them

IoCG.

 

Since the unit is already overcosted then I'd take IoCG simply because it is the cheapest. It is also the most cost-effective icon we have.

 

My 2 Kraks

[Brother Ambroz]

Will you be playing against another fluff list from a newer dex or something from an older one? Could make quite a difference in proving C:CSM is still viable...

[Pariah Mk.231]

I wouldn't say the generic chaos marines are arguably the worst unit we have, they sit somewhere in the middle. As for an Icon, Glory all the way, though I may be biased as that's all I give them ... seems to work though, they almost never run away.

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

All pretty tame if I'm honest. An iron warrior player a few regular codex marines (one using a ton of legion of the damned) with a smattering of eldar grey knights wolves crons and blood angels Basically I will be playing the iron warriors, regular marines and crons the most.

 

And thanks for the advice Kol I've played the more efficient list in the past but never touched the possessed but considering ow laid back the group has got and how into the fluff battles everyone is there isn't the need to squeeze every last iota out of the list and it makes for a refreshing change to be able to stand and have a laugh about the entire thing. They aren't going to bring window licking crazy army lists there will be synergy etc but they will generally pick the units they like and figure out a way to support it

 

 

 

As an aside the defiled isn't brilliant but it has it's place through careful positioning and as a long time slaanesh player noise marines are great just bare bones or in a blastermaster support squad. Plague marines I feel are better on the whole but with things like the doom siren and the sonic boasters to being seen that often you can pull a fair few swifities especially on the lower to mid tables in a tournament. The upper tables will recognize the threat of course but it can still give you that slight edge in making them have to try and focus on a squad they don't see often

[Kol Saresk]

Oh yeah, my ideal fluffy list is a Raptor lord with a Mark of Khorne and Twin Lightning Claws, Chosen packed 2x Twin Lightning Claws and 2x Flamers, a couple of CSM squads with Icon of Glory, some more Raptors and Oblits.

[Biaz]

So you're asking what Icon to give possessed, simply for the fun of it? Fluff-wise I think possessed are the coolest thing in our codex, but I haven't used them in a game since I first started playing and they came in my battleforce :o and they never really helped that much, they are waaaaaaaaay to overcosted. But obviously you know all this

 

I would say, for the fun of it, the best Icon you can take is Slaanesh. The cheapest (bar glory, but when ur fearless glory will only help other dudes deepstrike), lets em hit before all those marines you'll likely come up against, though if you get Furious charge for a roll the Init boost is kinda pointless. The other one you can't go wrong with is Khorne. Only 10 more points then Slaanesh for an extra attack each,but you'll still be hitting at the same time as almost everyone else. So I'd say one of those 2, chosen depending on how many points you have.

 

Of course, if that wasn't what you were asking at all, ignore all of the above :D

[Excessus]

At first I didn't know what unit you meant since there are so many crap units in the codex, but it seems we are talking about possessed...

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

At first I didn't know what unit you meant since there are so many crap units in the codex, but it seems we are talking about possessed...

 

:P there's some shockers but it's hardly the tyranid codex which I also play so I always feel like I'm doing alright when I crack out the chaos lot

[Kristoff]

And it's not that our units are all bad (they could be better, but they aren't bad), they just aren't priced properly. Let's face it, we might see some Spawn or Possessed if they cost the same as a Chaos Marine instead of 2-3.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

And it's not that our units are all bad (they could be better, but they aren't bad), they just aren't priced properly. Let's face it, we might see some Spawn or Possessed if they cost the same as a Chaos Marine instead of 2-3.

 

Possessed aren't costly because of their random ability roll. It's the S5, A2, and 5++ that makes them so expensive. Even without their roll, they're decent assault troops; they're too costly to take instead of, say, Berzerkers, but they're not bad. They'd be awesome if, of course, you could pick what they had instead of rolling for it; Hell, I'd even spring for the old 3.5 version where you paid different points by squad for whatever special ability you wanted.

 

I'm still convinced that Possessed make for a decent bodyguard unit for an IC, since they're not losing out on special weapons due to the limitations of our APC capacities by going short, they have Invulnerable saves for running into enemies deathstar assault units, and S5 gives them good wound numbers on Marines of all stripes to support the punch-you-good from the IC's inevitable power/daemon weapon. It's just a pity that DPs are better across the board than Lords or Sorcerors, so the topic is -- sadly -- moot.

[Excessus]

If only they had grenades...

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

Yeah I feel MoS might be best to make sure I can hit first and hopefully minimise the returning attacks. I got a feeling that the other chaos player will take the mos on his lord and Khorne on his warriors (clearly a fluff gamer :mellow:) so taking him out first might work best. He is the player I do want to actually take down consistently because I may have ran my mouth about how much I'd flog him that we have a few grudge games for people to come and watch and hopefully get a bit of atmosphere going ;)

[Kol Saresk]

If you're both playing Chaos, then let him take his Slaanesh Lord and Khorne Warriors. Make a shooty army to keep him at a distance. That way victory in the grudge match is guaranteed.

[Kristoff]

Possessed aren't costly because of their random ability roll. It's the S5, A2, and 5++ that makes them so expensive. Even without their roll, they're decent assault troops; they're too costly to take instead of, say, Berzerkers, but they're not bad. They'd be awesome if, of course, you could pick what they had instead of rolling for it; Hell, I'd even spring for the old 3.5 version where you paid different points by squad for whatever special ability you wanted.

 

I'm still convinced that Possessed make for a decent bodyguard unit for an IC, since they're not losing out on special weapons due to the limitations of our APC capacities by going short, they have Invulnerable saves for running into enemies deathstar assault units, and S5 gives them good wound numbers on Marines of all stripes to support the punch-you-good from the IC's inevitable power/daemon weapon. It's just a pity that DPs are better across the board than Lords or Sorcerors, so the topic is -- sadly -- moot.

 

You miss my point. I said they were improperly priced. Their random roll should have reduced their price, especially when you can't use half of one of those skills they can roll! Combine that with the lack of ranged weapons and Assault Grenades on a dedicated Assault unit, and they really are over priced, especially when compared to other options that are available both in the army and in the same slot (which is not even a necessary slot).

[Sanguinius Chosen Wing]

I would do that normally but I have again pretty much saidmim bringing the possessed but I suppose I can make terestnof the list more shooting orientated to see what happens. Thanks for the advice guys

[Kol Saresk]

Make the list a normal shooty list with medium-ranged Troops selections and Oblits/Havocs in Heavy support with long range, and you can use the Possessed to tie up the units long enough to shoot them down. Maybe make a little Sorcerer with Mark of Slaanesh and Lash for 125 points to tie up his troops even further?

[Iron Father Ferrum]

You miss my point. I said they were improperly priced. Their random roll should have reduced their price, especially when you can't use half of one of those skills they can roll! Combine that with the lack of ranged weapons and Assault Grenades on a dedicated Assault unit, and they really are over priced, especially when compared to other options that are available both in the army and in the same slot (which is not even a necessary slot).

 

Yeah, fair enough.

[Paradigm]

Just turn the list into a plasma nightmare and you'll find it to be pretty effective. Especially against other CSM armies. Sure, you might lose a few models, but the four winds always need a little sacrifice. Use the possessed as a tarpit.