Which unit should I take..claws vs hunters.

[KGatch113]

10 claws vs 9 hunters, with MOW and wolf standard,(Either unit would be in a LRC, with wolf priest and Arjac attached)

 

Does the overall utility of hunters, with MOW and standard, beat Berserk Charge?

[vanguardwolf]

the stength of BC is more in their numbers then over all.

their low bs and ws is compansation for the extra attacs.

 

but in CC they both are good in cc but the bolter of the GH is the reaon why i go with hunters,

 

also i would not put a TDA in an BC or GH pack you loose the your chance of overrunning the enemy after cc is rounded up.

 

IMHO GH are the best choice.

 

blood claws are very good in cc if you take 15(no WG) or 14(with WG) MOTW, wolf standart, LRC WG with FB or PF/CW or SS

and ragnar blackmane.

 

its a expensive unit bit it will rip to any thing that is lower then I5 (furious charge)

i will give you 5 to 7 attacs per BC(bezerke charge, insane bravado)

 

but if you are just starting best thing is to go with GH first, then later experiment with BC or their variants

 

greets

[Toasterfree]

price is the same, but claws are going to be hit more often in combat (ws3) than hunters (ws4). are goign to hit less in shootying (bs3) than hunters (bs4) and do not have boltguns. the distinction being is that they are the same price now. if it was in the old book when there was a 2pt price difference, i would say take your 1 manditory GH unit and the rest in BC.

 

this book, answer is always GH

[hendrik]

grey hunters are imo always the better close combat option. in addition to what toasterfree said you can't forget that grey hunters have more close combat orientated options aswell!

[jmurph]

GH all the way. Even in offense, 9 GH w/Banner perform almost as well as BCs on the charge (10 BC= 40 attacks, avg 20 hits for 10 wounds against T4, 9 GHs = 27 attacks, avg 15.75 hits after rerolling ones for 9.19 wounds after re-rolls). And GHs can use it with countercharge! Add in the rending and extra attacks from wulfen, the bolters, and the fact that they are gimped from before assault, there is no contest.

 

BCs are, sadly, pretty worthless in this book. Should either be 12 pts. or dump Headstrong for LD check at beginning of turn or suffer from Frenzy and can take multiple special cc weapons.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

BCs are, sadly, pretty worthless in this book. Should either be 12 pts. or dump Headstrong for LD check at beginning of turn or suffer from Frenzy and can take multiple special cc weapons.

 

to be honest, heavens no. 12pts is way too cheap.

 

realistically, the GHs should be 17-18 and the BCs should 14-15

 

WLK

[Toasterfree]

realistically, the GHs should be 17-18 and the BCs should 14-15

IIRC this is the way it was with the 3rd book. 16 for a GH +1 to have a BG and 14 for teh BC.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

realistically, the GHs should be 17-18 and the BCs should 14-15

IIRC this is the way it was with the 3rd book. 16 for a GH +1 to have a BG and 14 for teh BC.

 

yea, and it worked well in my opinion. if we get all the awesome toys we should pay for it.

 

WLK

[Valerian]

Agreed that Hunters are better in the current edition; however, although our codex isn't likely to change any time soon, the basic ruleset is within 3 weeks of being overhauled. At this point, with rumors being tighter than ever before, we have no idea what the impact of potential changes to close combat might be. You never know, but by the end of the month those extra attacks in close combat might really be worthwhile.

 

My advice for you, like it always is for my young pack-mates of the Fang, when change is on the horizon, is to be patient. Develop the situation before committing hastily to a poorly considered course of action.

 

Regards,

 

Valerian

[Hfran Morkai]

Once again this topic makes me a sad Wolf.

 

Blood Claws do have their place in lists, they just require a bit more care and attention (which is ironic given their nature) to do well.

 

Hey, in a footslogging list they're invaluable, because they can take large numbers.

[CainTheHunter]

GH for competitive lists since they are more predictable and can be relied on. BC for fun lists and Apoc games (14 in LRC with Wolf Priest and Ragnar!).

[Guest Drunk Guardian]

I would imagine Ragnar complements Grey Hunters far better than Blood Claws no? Blood Claws naturally get +2 on the charge while Grey Hunters only get +1 so Ragnar boosts them more. Further, Hunters can take Mark of the Wulfen and the Wolf Standard. Further, taking Grey Hunters leaves room for Ragnar's wolves and a wolf guard pack leader to boot. Further, this unit has far better wound allocation symantics and WS 4 means they die less. They also have more flexibility once out of combat with their bolters. They can also charge out of a Land Raider and pop a vehicle with their melta before charging the contents...

[MonSTeR]

As Valerian said, later this month the game changes. I'd hold off on assembling and painting for a couple of weeks until more about the sixth edition is known.

[dswanick]

I would imagine Ragnar complements Grey Hunters far better than Blood Claws no? Blood Claws naturally get +2 on the charge while Grey Hunters only get +1 so Ragnar boosts them more. Further, Hunters can take Mark of the Wulfen and the Wolf Standard. Further, taking Grey Hunters leaves room for Ragnar's wolves and a wolf guard pack leader to boot. Further, this unit has far better wound allocation symantics and WS 4 means they die less. They also have more flexibility once out of combat with their bolters. They can also charge out of a Land Raider and pop a vehicle with their melta before charging the contents...

Ragnar also complements Wolf Guard better than either Grey Hunters or Blood Claws. 3+d3 S6/I5 Power Weapon attacks per model?

[MonSTeR]

Ragnar also complements Wolf Guard better than either Grey Hunters or Blood Claws. 3+d3 S6/I5 Power Weapon attacks per model?

Wrap it up, I'll take it.

[Guest Drunk Guardian]

I would imagine Ragnar complements Grey Hunters far better than Blood Claws no? Blood Claws naturally get +2 on the charge while Grey Hunters only get +1 so Ragnar boosts them more. Further, Hunters can take Mark of the Wulfen and the Wolf Standard. Further, taking Grey Hunters leaves room for Ragnar's wolves and a wolf guard pack leader to boot. Further, this unit has far better wound allocation symantics and WS 4 means they die less. They also have more flexibility once out of combat with their bolters. They can also charge out of a Land Raider and pop a vehicle with their melta before charging the contents...

Ragnar also complements Wolf Guard better than either Grey Hunters or Blood Claws. 3+d3 S6/I5 Power Weapon attacks per model?

 

That's true though I don't necessarily know that it is a desired result.

 

Against most units that unit combined with Ragnar's buffs is going to annhilate whatever it faces on the charge. Sometimes you want to stick around for a second turn. Seeing as how Ragnar will do a lot of the killing himself it might be overkill to use Wolf Guard (though certainly fluffier). It would be more points efficient to use Grey Hunters and also provides the benefits of having a scoring unit and the wolf standard for some extra defense.

[Vor]

I would imagine Ragnar complements Grey Hunters far better than Blood Claws no? Blood Claws naturally get +2 on the charge while Grey Hunters only get +1 so Ragnar boosts them more. Further, Hunters can take Mark of the Wulfen and the Wolf Standard. Further, taking Grey Hunters leaves room for Ragnar's wolves and a wolf guard pack leader to boot. Further, this unit has far better wound allocation symantics and WS 4 means they die less. They also have more flexibility once out of combat with their bolters. They can also charge out of a Land Raider and pop a vehicle with their melta before charging the contents...

Ragnar also complements Wolf Guard better than either Grey Hunters or Blood Claws. 3+d3 S6/I5 Power Weapon attacks per model?

 

That's true though I don't necessarily know that it is a desired result.

 

Against most units that unit combined with Ragnar's buffs is going to annhilate whatever it faces on the charge. Sometimes you want to stick around for a second turn. Seeing as how Ragnar will do a lot of the killing himself it might be overkill to use Wolf Guard (though certainly fluffier). It would be more points efficient to use Grey Hunters and also provides the benefits of having a scoring unit and the wolf standard for some extra defense.

 

That's true. I much prefer combat to start in my turn and end in the other guys. You can't be shot then.

[DanPesci]

Wouldnt bother running a BC with less than 15 dudes in. Their strenght is in the overwhelming attack count they get. Grey hunters can go in smaller units due to their higher WS/BS and rapid fire bolter opportunities.

 

Ragnar with wolf guard (frost blade spam) and a wolf priest is horrendous...but as mentioned above, only really viable for fun/apoc games due to the massive point cost this would be (throw in the land raider and your hitting 800/900+ points for one unit!)