Ironclad Dreadnaught

[Torvold]

Greetings Brothers and Sisters, I have been playing 40k for about six months now and I play vanilla Space Marines. I have heard talk of Venerable dreads, Rifleman dreads, TL-LC/Plasma Missile dreads but hardly any talk of the Ironclad. Now I like the Ironclad the way the model looks especially with the 2 HK and IC launchers on it. I like its roll and what it is built to do get near you and flame,melta, or bolter you then get in close and club you like a baby seal. I know fully kitted out its about the same cost as a basic 10 man Tactical squad. I know its slow has short range weapons well minus the HK's and I accept all this. I digress the purpose of this is to ask you learned people of the grim dark future what is you opinion of this machine of war.

 

~Torvold

[Stormshadow]

It’s awesome.(?) :)

[King Willy]

It's the king of Zone Mortalis games, Two HF templates, re rolls to wound and AV 13 make it a beast.

 

In small games it depends what you facing, its need to get close puts it in melta range so facing marines requires a little tactical thinking, Eldar and there Dark brothers a also a worry but due to Fire Dragons and Dark Lances respectively.

The pattern usually goes across all amries.

 

They suffer from all the weaknesses of a Dread in that it's a single vehicle, so either take two, or oddly use it to help take objectives by using a rhino wall to screen and get a cover save.

[Torvold]

King Willy a couple questions for you 1. What is Zone Mortalis? and 2. How does the Ironclad get to re-roll wounds?

Also the Rhino screen sounds like an interesting stratagem I'll have to give it a try sometime. I usually try to get close to troop carriers pop them with the melta and then try to assault them. If I know the troops are carrying melta or something equivalent.

[Guest Bucelufe]

I can answer the Zone Mortalis question: Forge World Zone Mortalis Rules

[DarkGuard]

I know some people like using them in Drop Pods as an alpha strike unit. They give them a meltagun and heavy flamer minimum and then you're able to kill either infantry or tanks, depending on where you come down. With AV13 they're very tough against anything that isn't a melta weapon, and in combat they're all but immune against ill equipped squads, having more attacks than other Dreads helps as well.

 

However, as mentioned, melta is still very good against AV13, and as they operate at close range that means they operate at melta range which means they're very susceptible to giving away free KPs if not used properly. Compare the points cost to the cheaper and longer-ranged MM/HF Dread, and you can see why some people prefer the latter. And of course, if you want to walk it it'll just be a big target and won't do much for a while.

 

So it's not a bad choice, it just has some hidden weaknesses in the current metagame, but that means that it's in no way bad. Maybe if 6th Ed dials down melta a bit it'll become a little better.

[ShinyRhino]

I use mine from time to time, and it does "ok, not great." I don't have any drop pods, so mine always walks. I give it two HK missiles, assault launchers, a seismic hammer with meltagun, and close combat arm with heavy flamer.

Because I can't place it where I want it via pod, it often ends up as an area denial tool, or a boogeyman unit. By area denial tool, I mean I park it near an objective or a choke point and take potshots with the HKs. Should something decide it wants the objective I'm on, they have to take it from the Ironclad and his nearby Troops unit. Not exactly easy. Most of the time people ignore it, as its long-range damage is minimal, and the chances of killing or crippling it aren't high enough to waste lascannon or krak shots. The most reliable way to kill the Ironclad is fast melta in the form of Blood Angels jump troops with double meltaguns, Space Wolves in Rhinos with double meltaguns, or multimelta speeders or attack bikes.

As a boogeyman unit, it just scares people with the AV13 and ability to fight in melee. They see it marching toward their line 6" at a time, and decide they have to kill it at all costs. Mostly only works against newer players :lol:.

 

One thing the Ironclad is really great at is annoying Grey Knights. GKs lack melta weaponry, so the AV13 is awesome aganst them. Even Rifledreads lined up and plinking at the Ironclad have a poor chance to kill it. If you can pod on into their lines early, it can cause some serious mayhem. You just have to get past Warp Quake to do so.

[WarriorFish]

I like mine (disclaimer: I love Dreadnoughts) and as long as you use him as a Dreadnought+ you'll be fine. Dreads are brilliant supporting units and that includes the Ironclad.

 

My favourite build is with a heavy flamer, melta gun and siesmic hammer. The extra armour value and attack are a nice improvement over normal Dreads and is an obvious clue to where it shines. As DG said podding one in as part of an attack on enemy lines can work well though you must be careful with your location. Stomping up the field is a good enough alternative but in my experience isn't as effective as the Ironclad is best in CC and spends too long getting to the action (or having the action running away).

 

Supported well your Ironclad can provide a solid core to an attack - just don't forget your opponent will gun for it with appropriate weaponry so take this into account. Sometimes the fact I knew my Ironclad would lure a certain enemy unit has been more useful than the Ironclad itself... That and the ever useful tar pit!

 

 

TL;DR: solid unit but don't rely on it to win the day alone or you might be disappointed when it attracts AT weaponry like politicians to expenses forms.

[Torvold]

I have two Ironclads myself and I have been toying with the idea of putting the two together as a team one CCW/flamer Chainfist/melta and the second Hurricane bolter Siege hammer/flamer both with 2HK and IC launchers. Foot slog the two of them using the bolter one to cover the melee one. At the very least it will be a one hell of an enemy fire magnet.

[ShinyRhino]

I have two Ironclads myself and I have been toying with the idea of putting the two together as a team one CCW/flamer Chainfist/melta and the second Hurricane bolter Siege hammer/flamer both with 2HK and IC launchers. Foot slog the two of them using the bolter one to cover the melee one. At the very least it will be a one hell of an enemy fire magnet.

 

The bolter one covers the melee one from what, though? Three twin-linked bolter shots isn't going to dent much that can threaten an Ironclad. If the enemy is within 12" and you get six shots, it still won't put a dent in anything the Ironclad can't handle alone. At 12", the melee Ironclad should be engaging in melee, and will ourstrip bolter shots every day of the week.

 

It is a cool image, though :P.

[WarriorFish]

The hurricane bolter option is almost as useless as the shotguns for biker scouts one. Even for free it feels impossible to justify for anything other than appearances - and I don't think it looks that great either :lol:

 

I've never used the launchers before so can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? I keep feeling I'm missing out but they don't seem to be of much use especially for the price.

[ShinyRhino]

I've never used the launchers before so can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? I keep feeling I'm missing out but they don't seem to be of much use especially for the price.

 

I use them purely to cut down on the number of incoming powerfist/klaw attacks I see. One less swing from those weapons makes it that much harder to crack the Ironclad.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

I've never used the launchers before so can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? I keep feeling I'm missing out but they don't seem to be of much use especially for the price.

 

I use them purely to cut down on the number of incoming powerfist/klaw attacks I see. One less swing from those weapons makes it that much harder to crack the Ironclad.

 

This. It's very important to keep those sorts of things down to a minimum.

[DarkGuard]

Do Ironclads really fear power fists that much? You're looking at 3 attacks max (2 if taking the assault launchers) at WS4 and needing a 5 to glance. Not massively good odds. Obviously its a threat, but not a massive one surely?

[Torvold]

@ShinyRhino I understand the Hurricane bolter is for the Ironclad basically a giant pea shooter and honestly not that great. I am only doing it for the cool factor. Now if I could have two Hurricanes on the Ironclad that would be kinda interesting...

 

I always put the launchers on my IC's just for the "Yup that's right not only am I heavily armoured but I've got grenades on top of the armour too." Not sure if its the wisest use of points but then again not sure I care. lol

[ShinyRhino]

Do Ironclads really fear power fists that much? You're looking at 3 attacks max (2 if taking the assault launchers) at WS4 and needing a 5 to glance. Not massively good odds. Obviously its a threat, but not a massive one surely?

 

Not massive, no, but the S9 Power Klaw in an Ork Mob is a little more effective. Sometimes the presence of the assault launchers convinces someone that it's best not to charge the Ironclad at all, since the chances of hurting it are abyssmal. It's sort of a psychological mathhammer thing, lol.

[WarriorFish]

Maybe if my Ironclad was taking more charges during a game I'd try them out but for now they're that little bit too expensive for me to consider throwing spare points at. Perhaps 6th Edition will change how grenades work?

[Stormshadow]

I’ve had my Ironclad get assaulted by 5 Hammernators. He killed one of them and the other 4 had “only” 8 attacks thanks to the launcher. 4 hits, 1 glance, 1 pen. Stunned and shaken, but still in the fight. If the terminators had 12 attacks instead of 8 things might have gone differently, I rarely go without launchers after hat.

[Phelaar]

Used in an appropriate list they are awesome. I used 2 with melta and heavy flame and a rifle dread, all in pods in a tourny a few weeks ago and they all worked well. The prospect of 2 Ironclads dropping in first turn forced two of my opponents to place their entire armies in reserve. The one that chose to deploy, a DE player, got flamed and assaulted. Over the course of three games I only lost 1 Ironclad. I made some bad decisions in one of the games and lost but the Ironclads were still solid. I suffer from dreadnought favoritism though, I always include at least one in my armies.

 

I am not a fan of the IC launchers or the the hurricane bolters. The IC launchers are too expensive and the hurricane is pointless.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

I’ve had my Ironclad get assaulted by 5 Hammernators. He killed one of them and the other 4 had “only” 8 attacks thanks to the launcher. 4 hits, 1 glance, 1 pen. Stunned and shaken, but still in the fight. If the terminators had 12 attacks instead of 8 things might have gone differently, I rarely go without launchers after hat.

 

This evening, it kept down the numbers of attacks off of a model with Mark of the Wulfen -- twice -- and yesterday turned six thunder hammer attacks into four, which kept it alive and fighting and, combined with Null Zone, saw off that whole Terminator squad (the one bright spot in a horrible game against Blood Angels). I love my assault launchers, and I never leave home without 'em.

[Brother Navaer Solaq]

@Deus Es Ferrum

 

Do you run two Ironclad Dreadnaughts in your army or one when you play? Just curious to know.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Just one. The other CC dread I run often is a Venerable with MM, HF, & extra armor. They both come down in pods and throw everything into disarray.