henrywalker Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 cast your minds back to when we unwrapped our shiny new dreadknights, all excited at the idea that we could give them two dreadnought close combat weapons that would strike at strength 10. then alas it was FAQed that this was not the case as the rule for a DCCW specifically stated that it doubled a walkers strength. However... it seems that in the new rulebook this restriction is removed, we can it seems take 2 strength 10 fists. i'd love to hear if anyone has a reason this isnt true but i really cant see anything against it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vor Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 God this better not be true. It was only a few months ago I had to remodel the fists out when that FAQ screwed them over. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 God this better not be true. It was only a few months ago I had to remodel the fists out when that FAQ screwed them over. New Rulebook rule for Dreads CCW does not limit it to walkers. It states every model double its S and gain AP2. Since PT does not make DK flying MC this rule it's the only reason we have to field DK. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101405 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 God this better not be true. It was only a few months ago I had to remodel the fists out when that FAQ screwed them over. New Rulebook rule for Dreads CCW does not limit it to walkers. It states every model double its S and gain AP2. Since PT does not make DK flying MC this rule it's the only reason we have to field DK. According to the new FAQ, the PT makes the Jump Monstrous Creatures. V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101464 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abaddonshand Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I may have jumped the gun in the other thread on this, does a jump monstrous creature operate differently from a flying one? GW took their sweet time posting my collectors edition, despite my ordering it at 15 minutes past midnight when the preorders went up, so it seems I won't have my book until at least monday <_< Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101471 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I may have jumped the gun in the other thread on this, does a jump monstrous creature operate differently from a flying one? GW took their sweet time posting my collectors edition, despite my ordering it at 15 minutes past midnight when the preorders went up, so it seems I won't have my book until at least monday <_< Jump MC just follow Jump Infatry rules, nothing more. So no "hit only on 6" etc... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101479 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abaddonshand Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Thanks, that's what I thought. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raus Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Thanks, that's what I thought. With the FAQ:s posted for 6th edition, it is now official: Dreadknight is a Jump infantry MC. Nemesis doomfists make it Str 10. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Thanks, that's what I thought. With the FAQ:s posted for 6th edition, it is now official: Dreadknight is a Jump infantry MC. Nemesis doomfists make it Str 10. :D Indeed. The "only walkers double Str" argument was an exemple of flawed logic, even though it was the official one. 6th Edition finally fixed it. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101576 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeratil Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 DCCWs are also not specialist weapons, so if you take the sword it looks like you keep the higher number of attacks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 DCCWs are also not specialist weapons, so if you take the sword it looks like you keep the higher number of attacks. And you can even choose your weapon when you attack. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 DCCWs are also not specialist weapons, so if you take the sword it looks like you keep the higher number of attacks. Ooh, that's awesome. Looks like he'll get full attacks (5 on the charge), and will get to pick between using the Sword at S6 (to get re-rolls to hit and/or wound) or the Fist (to get S10 attacks). If that is the correct ruling, then this is an awesome boost! Might make that 75 point PT worthwhile again, too, just to ensure he gets into an assault (up to 24" assault range? yes please!). V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeratil Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Yeah, this plus 2+ armour, the ability to destroy light vehicles in CC make the dread knight very nice. I'm not too convinced on the price of the PT still, but it's certainly worth considering. I've always been rather dismissive of my dreadknight, but I have to say even before this he never failed to perform reasonably well. I think I shall field him tonight and see how he does now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Yeah, this plus 2+ armour, the ability to destroy light vehicles in CC make the dread knight very nice. I'm not too convinced on the price of the PT still, but it's certainly worth considering. I've always been rather dismissive of my dreadknight, but I have to say even before this he never failed to perform reasonably well. I think I shall field him tonight and see how he does now. Destroy light vehicles in CC? With 5 S10 attacks in charge he can destroy any vehicle! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101623 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raus Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Yeah, this plus 2+ armour, the ability to destroy light vehicles in CC make the dread knight very nice. I'm not too convinced on the price of the PT still, but it's certainly worth considering. I've always been rather dismissive of my dreadknight, but I have to say even before this he never failed to perform reasonably well. I think I shall field him tonight and see how he does now. Destroy light vehicles in CC? With 5 S10 attacks in charge he can destroy any vehicle! And don't forget the Smash rule, rerolling armor penetration, making it pretty easy to penetrate a landraider with the fists. Sadly, the 2D6 armor pen is gone, so the Sword is quite a bit worse at opening vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101702 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Yeah, this plus 2+ armour, the ability to destroy light vehicles in CC make the dread knight very nice. I'm not too convinced on the price of the PT still, but it's certainly worth considering. I've always been rather dismissive of my dreadknight, but I have to say even before this he never failed to perform reasonably well. I think I shall field him tonight and see how he does now. Destroy light vehicles in CC? With 5 S10 attacks in charge he can destroy any vehicle! And don't forget the Smash rule, rerolling armor penetration, making it pretty easy to penetrate a landraider with the fists. Sadly, the 2D6 armor pen is gone, so the Sword is quite a bit worse at opening vehicles. Forget the Smash rule - he's already at max Strength (10). Re-rolling AP isn't nearly worthwhile when you trade half of your attacks to do it. In fact, it would be absolutely stupid to do so. Sure, the Sword is worse at opening vehicles, but when you're assaulting a vehicle don't use your Sword (use your left hand that still has the default Fist). V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3101740 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raus Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Yeah, this plus 2+ armour, the ability to destroy light vehicles in CC make the dread knight very nice. I'm not too convinced on the price of the PT still, but it's certainly worth considering. I've always been rather dismissive of my dreadknight, but I have to say even before this he never failed to perform reasonably well. I think I shall field him tonight and see how he does now. Destroy light vehicles in CC? With 5 S10 attacks in charge he can destroy any vehicle! And don't forget the Smash rule, rerolling armor penetration, making it pretty easy to penetrate a landraider with the fists. Sadly, the 2D6 armor pen is gone, so the Sword is quite a bit worse at opening vehicles. Forget the Smash rule - he's already at max Strength (10). Re-rolling AP isn't nearly worthwhile when you trade half of your attacks to do it. In fact, it would be absolutely stupid to do so. Well, the reroll-AP part of Smash is always in effect, whatever attack you choose to use. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3102663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Still a bad idea Raus. Consider this: Smash rule gives you two advantages 1) reroll AP rolls, and 2) double your Strength in trade for a single drawback: only get half of your attacks. Now, that second benefit is a wash, because you're already striking at S10 with your Doomfists. That means your are trading a decent chance of getting 4 or 5 glancing/penetrating hits for an almost guaranteed 3 penetrating hits. Maybe, maybe, when attacking a Land Raider or Monolith this would be an okay choice, but even then I think I'd gamble on the non-Stomp attacks to try to wreck it by voiding out all of the Hull Points in one go. V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3102872 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Guys, greatsword doesn't require that you use it to get all the re-rolls. You just have to be equipped with it. So, don't bother smashing, buy the greatsword (its dirt-cheap anyway), and just use the doomfist forever. S10, re-roll everything, +1 to damage result because of AP2. Win :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3103658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vor Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Guys, greatsword doesn't require that you use it to get all the re-rolls. You just have to be equipped with it. So, don't bother smashing, buy the greatsword (its dirt-cheap anyway), and just use the doomfist forever. S10, re-roll everything, +1 to damage result because of AP2. Win ;) You sure? I've never heard that before... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3103777 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Check the rules. Greatsword grants it bonus so long as you have it, you don't have to use it. Ergo, just always use the doomfist instead, for the aformentioned stacking of rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3103781 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Check the rules. Greatsword grants it bonus so long as you have it, you don't have to use it. Ergo, just always use the doomfist instead, for the aformentioned stacking of rules. I hate to say it, but this seems right. So let me get this straight, the dreadknight now... -always has 4 attacks (5 on the charge) -can always choose to strike at S10 at normal initiative -for 25pts can re-roll all to-hit and to-wound rolls with his S10 fists I've been a big fan of the dreadknight for a while, but this is just awesome. I still like my 160pt dreadknight with heavy incinerator, but I might try finding 25pts somewhere for that greatsword too. The one thing I don't get is the doom and gloom about the PT not making it a flying MC. For one thing, that makes sense: the teleporter wouldn't let him glide around the battlefield. Mostly though, it doesn't change how he works. Granted, I have never thought the PT was worth the crazy amount of points it costs. But if you used to like the PT, I don't understand why you would suddenly now think it's not worthwhile. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3103925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
drou feov Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Does the NDK also always move 12" if it's equiped with the teleporter? The jump units entry in the 6th edition book would seem to say so. Edit: a bit of a silly question actually. Yeah, of course it does. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3104103 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 So let me get this straight, the dreadknight now...-always has 4 attacks (5 on the charge) -can always choose to strike at S10 at normal initiative -for 25pts can re-roll all to-hit and to-wound rolls with his S10 fists Well remember, the greatsword technically replaces one of the doomfists. So, when you declare what weapon you are using when you make your attacks, be sure to say its the doomfist (your left hook :P ). But yeah, DK with greatsword hilariously sidesteps a lot of the issues for new MC rules (no 2D6 anymore). The one thing I don't get is the doom and gloom about the PT not making it a flying MC. For one thing, that makes sense: the teleporter wouldn't let him glide around the battlefield. Mostly though, it doesn't change how he works. Granted, I have never thought the PT was worth the crazy amount of points it costs. But if you used to like the PT, I don't understand why you would suddenly now think it's not worthwhile. I still think its completely worthwhile. Yes, its an expensive investment, but think about what you get for that investment. Suddenly your slowpoke MC is now able to shunt once per game (amazing), move 12" a turn ignoring all terrain/models etc, and he now re-rolls one of the D6 for charge distance (netting you a higher average charge range than before). Even if you Outflank the DK (one of the common ways of getting around his slow speed on the cheap), a PT is still good, as if he lands on the wrong side or nothing is in charge range, a shunt or quick jump will get him into position (~18" from either board edge is a scary threat range). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3104473 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 -for 25pts can re-roll all to-hit and to-wound rolls with his S10 fists Don't forget he can also re-roll all armour penetration rolls, too. Valerian Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/254952-dreadknights-are-taking-off-the-gloves/#findComment-3104523 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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