So many new Psychic Powers...

[Gentlemanloser]

Runes of Warding have not been nerfed.

 

Good going GW.

 

Introduce a boat load of new powers, then allow just about everyone to ally in RoW.

 

Pointless.

 

(Yes this is little more than a rant. Sorry. I was quite intrigued by the new powers, now I couldn't care less, and I'll never take one. As *everyone* is going to ally a Farseer with Runes. /sigh)

[Cmdr Shepard]

RoW are 24" right? Well still enough to nullify a lot of powers, especially the ones which target sepcific units.

Farseer with runes it's another unit that will reduce the effectiveness of most pyschic powers.

 

GK+Eldar= Roll 3d6, suffer a -1 (or even -4) LD penalty= I want see how many checks will be passed

SW+Eldar= Roll 3d6 and If you are lucky and pass the check you have 50% chances your opponent nullify the power= I'm curious to see how may powers will produce an effect of some sort.

 

Anyway I'm more eager to see flyers in action than the new psychic powers :D

[Gentlemanloser]

Nope, whole board.

[Cmdr Shepard]

Nope, whole board.

I was talking about SW runic weapons... sorry for the mistake.

[Gentlemanloser]

Ah! NP! :unsure:

 

I'm not too worried about Space Wolves. Powers being nulified is ok. But the silly increase to failing to cast a power, and the no unsaveable Perils that comes with it, is too much.

 

That is can be used across the whole board, so you can hide the 'seer out of LoS, just takes the biscuit!

 

Anyone who can, but doesn't, ally in a Farseer is going to be at such a disadvantage it's unreal.

[adamv6]

New psychic stuff is pants :lol:

 

You know they have got it wrong when Necrons are rolling a 6 to shutdown your Sanctuary... (taken from a game I played today <_< )

[RedemptionNL]

Doesn't 'Deny the Witch' only work when the power targets an enemy? So powers that don't target, such as Hammerhand and Sanctuary, can't be nullified by them?

[Abaddonshand]

New psychic stuff is pants :(

 

You know they have got it wrong when Necrons are rolling a 6 to shutdown your Sanctuary... (taken from a game I played today ;) )

 

How did they manage that? I thought the deny the witch rule only worked on powers targeted against enemy units?

[*Furyou Miko]

It does. Deny the Witch is effectively a bonus 6+ save vs any and all Psychic Powers.

[shortysl]

As *everyone* is going to ally a Farseer with Runes. /sigh)

 

Not everyone. I personally despise Eldar so I defintiely won't be taking any.

 

My Dark Angels are most likely going to have a small allied force of Blood Angels.

 

My Grey Knights are probably going to ally with some Imperial Guard.

 

My Imperial Guard are quite possibly going to get them some Tau as allies.

[Abaddonshand]

It does. Deny the Witch is effectively a bonus 6+ save vs any and all Psychic Powers.

 

But surely to get a save the psychi power has to be impacting the unit seeking the save? With sanctuary, any wounds caused are from dangerous terrain tests, not the psychic power itself. Sorry if I seem confused here, my rule book has yet to arrive, despite pre-ordering the collectors edition over a week ago now.

[Cmdr Shepard]

It does. Deny the Witch is effectively a bonus 6+ save vs any and all Psychic Powers.

All Psychic powers that target the given enemy unit.

GK have a +1 bonus from Brotherhood of Psykers. If you add an IC with a Master greater than the casting model's one you'll get +2 (not cumulable with the first)

 

So a standard GK squad nullifies the enemy power costed on it with a 5+ roll

If an IC with a Mastery greater than the attacking model's one is in the squad they nullify it with a 4+ roll.

 

EDIT:

 

It does. Deny the Witch is effectively a bonus 6+ save vs any and all Psychic Powers.

 

But surely to get a save the psychi power has to be impacting the unit seeking the save? With sanctuary, any wounds caused are from dangerous terrain tests, not the psychic power itself. Sorry if I seem confused here, my rule book has yet to arrive, despite pre-ordering the collectors edition over a week ago now.

As I said above the save applies only to powers who target a specific unit. Sanctuary does not "target" a specific unit so the enemy cannot cancel it (except Space Wolves. If I'm not mistaken their Runic Weapons still cancel any power within 24" on a roll of 4+)

 

If a power targets a specific unit (a shooting power, for example) the affected unit may try to cancel.

 

If I'm not mistaken this is the sequence.

 

You pass the check

Cast the Power

Affected units try to cancelt before it produces any effect.

 

When sanctuary produces its effect the power is already "active", thus no save.

 

I suppose Purifiers power can be cancelled, though

[boreas]

Runes of Warding have not been nerfed.

 

Good going GW.

 

Introduce a boat load of new powers, then allow just about everyone to ally in RoW.

 

Pointless.

 

(Yes this is little more than a rant. Sorry. I was quite intrigued by the new powers, now I couldn't care less, and I'll never take one. As *everyone* is going to ally a Farseer with Runes. /sigh)

 

The Eldar ally will be:

 

-A fad... After a while, it'll go away.

-Used commonly by WAAC players in tournament, IF tournement allow allies. I don't do tournaments because of WAAC players.

 

So, if that player does indeed have eldar allies, just put a bit of effort into killing that first :lol:

 

And Cmdr Shepard has it right: just as long as they're benediction (buffs) and Force Weapon activation, there's no denying the witch!

 

Oh, and don't forget, poeple, no more save at all against Perils of the Warp! So shoot those SR missiles on pesky psykers (like eldars allies!) and that should kill them quickly!

[RedemptionNL]

Well Farseers still have that Ghosthelm against Perils of course.

[boreas]

Of course, but between failing that 4+ (IIRC) save and taking the st4 hit, and the TL-multimelta and the TL assault cannon shots (don't forget, flyers can shoot 4 weapons at full ballistics!), the unit is bound to crumble!

[Reclusiarch Darius]

If tournaments allow Allies, everything will go to hell in a handbasket. Eldrad breaks the game, regardless of what flavour ally he's with.

 

So, assuming they don't, yeah in casual play you might have to agree to just not take him as an ally B) . Otherwise, no one will use psykers

[thade]

Eldrad Teclis breaks the game, regardless of what flavour ally he's with.

Fixed that for you. People around my area are musing that Space Wolf Rune Priests (with their 24" 4+ psychic shutdown stick) will be auto-ally.

 

Shadows on the Warp and Runes of Warding can (and frankly should) still work. Why? Consider, for instance, GK in melee against Eldar. Do we need +1 or more Strength? Then don't cast it. <3 Problem solved. Mulch them with holy Bolter Fire and the Emperor's wrath. Really, the psychic powers are nice but we're pretty strong without them. Don't sweat it too much.

 

The new powers look like a lot of fun; I intend to try some with my Inquisitors (and marine Librarians).

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Fixed that for you. People around my area are musing that Space Wolf Rune Priests (with their 24" 4+ psychic shutdown stick) will be auto-ally.

 

Not really. You have to take a pack of useless Blood Claws or pricey Grey Hunters (as they need a Wolf Guard babysitter, who eats your Elite slot and costs more points).

 

Eldrad will be auto-include because Runes of Warding completely shuts down enemy psykers (enjoy never passing a test and just taking wounds all day). On top of that, he brings three excellent buff powers, one of which still benefits allies (as its not a buff, its a debuff to an enemy unit ie Doom). Rune Priests look like children next to what Tec..Eldrad does.

 

Knights without powers is kinda meh, we pay points to have 'Hammerhand' and force weapons etc.

 

You should definitely try the new powers; I recommend Coteaz though, he has Mastery 2 (hence you get the capability of two generic psyker Inquisitors, plus Henchmen Troops, artificer armour and a nemesis hammer thrown in for good measure). For Marine allies, Blood Angel or Dark Angel Librarians are pretty cool, they bring the same Divination options or can roll on the otherwise inaccessible Telepathy table (Telekinesis isn't much to bother with, neither is Pyromancy).

[Cmdr Shepard]

Knights without powers is kinda meh, we pay points to have 'Hammerhand' and force weapons etc.

I played my GK against Eldar several times during 5th Edition, twice in a "campiagn", and being unable to use my powers was not a great issue. GK are effective even without psychic powers.

 

Just a question:

Runes force enemies to roll 3d6 what about allies of convenience. Rulebook says they are considered eneme units you cannot target etc.

Since allies of convenience are considered enemies unit do runes affect them too. Logic would exclude it, since it will harm the player who is using the very model but I'm still curious... :blush:

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Just a question:

Runes force enemies to roll 3d6 what about allies of convenience. Rulebook says they are considered eneme units you cannot target etc.

Since allies of convenience are considered enemies unit do runes affect them too. Logic would exclude it, since it will harm the player who is using the very model but I'm still curious...

 

:blush: Because GW cannot into clear English, I'll explain this one;

 

If your Primary detachment (ie main army) is Grey Knights, and you ally in Eldrad, his Runes won't affect you

 

If your Primary detachment is Eldar, and you ally in Grey Knights, Runes of Warding will affect them

 

Don't ask me why, that is the RAW

[Cmdr Shepard]

Just a question:

Runes force enemies to roll 3d6 what about allies of convenience. Rulebook says they are considered eneme units you cannot target etc.

Since allies of convenience are considered enemies unit do runes affect them too. Logic would exclude it, since it will harm the player who is using the very model but I'm still curious...

 

:blush: Because GW cannot into clear English, I'll explain this one;

 

If your Primary detachment (ie main army) is Grey Knights, and you ally in Eldrad, his Runes won't affect you

 

If your Primary detachment is Eldar, and you ally in Grey Knights, Runes of Warding will affect them

 

Don't ask me why, that is the RAW

Is it because rulebook says Primary detachment considers the allied one "enemy units" but the text does not say the contrary?

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Is it because rulebook says Primary detachment considers the allied one "enemy units" but the text does not say the contrary?

 

Yep. GW once again smoking hard before writing their rules.

[Cmdr Shepard]

Is it because rulebook says Primary detachment considers the allied one "enemy units" but the text does not say the contrary?

 

Yep. GW once again smoking hard before writing their rules.

Very hard :)

However I'd expect a clarification in the first 6th edition FAQ.... hopefully ;)

[thade]

Knights without powers is kinda meh, we pay points to have 'Hammerhand' and force weapons etc.

I played my GK against Eldar several times during 5th Edition, twice in a "campiagn", and being unable to use my powers was not a great issue. GK are effective even without psychic powers.

Yea, Str 4 wounds skinny T3 Eldar on 3s; also, are you taking Psybolt ammo? Wounding them on 2s at 24". They are basically all 4+ saves, but even those few that are 3+ will still buckle in an assault. Fighting Eldar is as ever the same: shoot the chargey, charge the shooty, and do NOT get separated, lest they pick you off like a savvy Eldar player. Hammerhand is overkill, much less how brutal the Librarian can be.

 

Just a question:

Runes force enemies to roll 3d6 what about allies of convenience. Rulebook says they are considered eneme units you cannot target etc.

Since allies of convenience are considered enemies unit do runes affect them too. Logic would exclude it, since it will harm the player who is using the very model but I'm still curious... :)

Here's hoping the FAQ this as fast as Power Scroll was nerfed in 8th (Ed Fantasy). Honestly they could stand to hack down the effect range on the puppy-stick to 6". It's one thing for skinny Eldar to have ways of shutting down psychic powers...but Space Wolves are still Space Marines, even without the stick. Just wishful thinking on my part though.

 

EDIT: Clarification.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Yea, Str 4 wounds skinny T3 Eldar on 3s; also, are you taking Psybolt ammo? Wounding them on 2s at 24". They are basically all 4+ saves, but even those few that are 3+ will still buckle in an assault. Fighting Eldar is as ever the same: shoot the chargey, charge the shooty, and do NOT get separated, lest they pick you off like a savvy Eldar player. Hammerhand is overkill, much less how brutal the Librarian can be.

 

Why would I pay for psybolt, when I can buy psycannons for the same price and get way more utility? I've fought Eldar before, I know they die in a stiff breeze but removing our psychic powers is still a kick in the guts for Knights. Without them, we're sorta screwed when you roll Wraithlords and the Avatar into our lines.

 

Here's hoping the FAQ this as fast as Power Scroll was nerfed in 8th (Ed Fantasy). Honestly they could stand to hack down the effect range on the puppy-stick to 6". It's one thing for skinny Eldar to have ways of shutting down psychic powers...but Space Wolves are still Space Marines, even without the stick. Just wishful thinking on my part though.

 

They'll FAQ it once Eldrad shows up in tournament lists everyday forever as an ally :P . Which means not for another year at least. Space Wolves are fine, just asplode his brain with a Mind War and the problem goes away.