Custodian Athiair Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Hi I've been thinking since the rulebook came out about good allies to help my Salamanders work better in this edition. I think I should firstly post what I have roughly in my army so you have an idea why i decided to have the allies i chose. Captain Command Squad Chaplain - Terminator Armour Cassius Pedro Kantor Vulkan He'Stan Librarian 5 x Tactical Squads 1 x 10 man CC Scout Squad 1 x 5 man Sniper Scout Squad 2 x Rhinos 1 x Razorback 2 x Dreadnoughts 1 x 10 man Sternguard Squad 1 x 5 man Assault Terminator Squad 1 x 10 man Terminator Squad 1 x 8 man Legion of the Damned Squad 1 x 10 man Devastator Squad 2 x Predator 1 x Land Raider Redeemer I do plan on buying a 10 man Assault Squad with twin Flamers and a Drop Pod. Also my Librarian and Cassius aren't built yet and I need to modify the Librarian model (Inquisitor Cotez) and give him a combi-flamer which I don't have. Anyway irrelevant. On to my planned 500 point ally forces Eldar: Eldrad Ulthwé - or a heavily upgraded Farseer 6 Eldar Pathfinders 10 Dire Avengers - Exarch, Blade Storm and Twin Catapults Tau: Commander - Cyclic Ion Blaster, Missile Pod, Two Gun Drones 12 Fire Warriors - Markerlight, Photon Grenades 12 Fire Warriors - Markerlight, Photon Grenades Broadside Space Wolves: Rune Priest - Master of Runes, Wolftooth Necklace and Saga of Beastslayer Rune Priest - Master of Runes, Wolftooth Necklace 10 Grey Hunters - 2 Plasma Guns, Wolf Standard I also made a Grey Knight ally but didn't really like it so probably wont be doing it. Anyway brief explanation as to why I took each. Eldar - Mainly for Eldrad/Farseer, best psykers in the game and as I haven't made my Librarian yet, also Pathfinders just never die and Dire Avengers can cut a swath through most things. Just a nice force mainly to have psychic powers being flung everywhere. Tau - A firebase for my Salamanders to advance in Rhinos, Razorbacks, Land Raiders under. I always found that I struggled at range and the Tau's range and power could work quite nicely allowing my flamers and meltaguns to get where they can actually do damage. Also markerlights will be nice to make sure the meltaguns actually hit something - considering they rarely do even with twin-linking Space Wolves - Purely for dual Rune Priests, each casting a possible two powers a turn can dish out the psychic damage as well as sticking it to the enemy in close combat as a good wolf does. The Grey Hunters are known as the best troop choice in the game and will provide a nice bodyguard for on the of the Rune Priests as well as throwing a large amount of gunfire at the enemy. Anyway I put it to you to comment on what I've said, come up with any better 500 point ally lists for my gathered Salamander force. I'm open to most ideas really. I will hopefully be getting most of the Eldar stuff off a mate for free and I believe all of the Space Wolf stuff from my brother for loan each time. The Tau I will have to buy - which is a problem as I can't find Broadsides anywhere. But i don't think they'll be that expensive to buy overall. I'm looking to close of my Salamanders with these allies + the final units as mentioned above to give me 5000 Salamanders + 1500 Allies for changing around. So then I can move on to a new army when the supposed Chaos Legions book comes out. Anyway over to you guys. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyroknight Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 About marines: If you take two 5-man assault squads (instead of one 10-man), you get the second drop pod free. There are some advantages and disadvantages with this. Magnetize your flamers if you can so you can swap them. About your Tau allies: 1) Markerlights do not benefit anyone besides Tau. (pg 29 C: Tau) Your marines cannot use them. For so many other reasons, just drop the markerlights. 2) Fire warriors have always been of questionable effectiveness, and even with 6th ed improvements are best taken in moderation. Less Fire Warriors, more broadsides. 3) Small Fire warrior squads are better than large ones, because you want your tau to die when assaulted. 4) Blacksun filters and Multitrackers. You will like them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3119140 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpnightsend Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I'm a huge fan of allying 2 Marine armies (like your C:SM and Space Wolves), mostly because you can say they're all part of the same army! The Rune priests will be a huge boost to your ranged fire power if you take Divination too. My only recommendation is that you fit a Long Fangs squad in. You have a lot of Ranged Firepower, and adding another 4 missile launchers or 2 missile launchers and 2 plasma cannons is an excellent idea. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3119464 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Navaer Solaq Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 About your Tau allies: 1) Markerlights do not benefit anyone besides Tau. (pg 29 C: Tau) Your marines cannot use them. For so many other reasons, just drop the markerlights. That ruined my day and plan. though it saved me money. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3119547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Custodian Athiair Posted July 13, 2012 Author Share Posted July 13, 2012 About marines: If you take two 5-man assault squads (instead of one 10-man), you get the second drop pod free. There are some advantages and disadvantages with this. Magnetize your flamers if you can so you can swap them. About your Tau allies: 1) Markerlights do not benefit anyone besides Tau. (pg 29 C: Tau) Your marines cannot use them. For so many other reasons, just drop the markerlights. 2) Fire warriors have always been of questionable effectiveness, and even with 6th ed improvements are best taken in moderation. Less Fire Warriors, more broadsides. 3) Small Fire warrior squads are better than large ones, because you want your tau to die when assaulted. 4) Blacksun filters and Multitrackers. You will like them. Also where does this information about getting a free drop pod for two 5 man assault squads. And the Drop Pod isn't even for the assault squad it's for a sternguard squad. 1) No where in the codex or the FAQ does it mention just Tau. And because they are Battle Brothers where everything can be used together, I therefore make the assumption that the Markerlights can be used by my Marines. Feel free to give me an exact quote. 2) Are you willing to put forward any evidence or why they aren't effective? I'm listening for it though, cause Broadsides are lovely and fitting a few more in would be nice :unsure: 3) Why do I want my Tau to die when assaulted? Confused here! 4) Considering I have never played with Night-fighting Rules Blacksun Filters seem to be a little pointless. However a Multi-tracker on the Commander could be useful, not sure if Broadsides can take them. I'm a huge fan of allying 2 Marine armies (like your C:SM and Space Wolves), mostly because you can say they're all part of the same army!The Rune priests will be a huge boost to your ranged fire power if you take Divination too. My only recommendation is that you fit a Long Fangs squad in. You have a lot of Ranged Firepower, and adding another 4 missile launchers or 2 missile launchers and 2 plasma cannons is an excellent idea. Will look into the Long Fangs - always a big fan of them. However I'm trying to limit the amount of points I try and spend on allies. However I'd probably be willing for them to take a few more especially swapping the Dev Squad. I'll look in to it. Thanks Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3119903 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon999 Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 I suspect the reason he said you want your fire warriors to die is so that the unit that assaulted them will be left in the open for your shooting next turn, rather than the "safety" of being locked in close combat. And I can definitely say that if you take devs you will LOVE long fangs. They are everything good about devs with none of the bad side (aside from smaller max unit size I guess, hehe). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3120411 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Custodian Athiair Posted July 13, 2012 Author Share Posted July 13, 2012 Aaaahh okay, and I've re-read the Markerlight entry and it is correct that only Tau units can use it. It was weirdly worded especially with a bracket in the middle. And agreed with the Fire Warrior and Long Fang statements Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3120414 Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyroknight Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 0) About the drop pod. If you remove the jump packs on an assault sqaud, they get a free dedicated transport, regardless of how many models are in the squad. Since you listed the drop pod with the assault squad, i assumed they were going to be used together. I was trying to avoid talking about Tau tactics too much on a power armor board, but I will give you a quick rundown. 1) Markerlights only work on Tau (pg 29 Codex: Tau) Markerlights only have 50% chance to hit (BS 3 and can’t be increased) Markerlights are heavy weapons, and can’t be give their bonus to the unit firing it. (you need a second unit to take advantage) Markerlights are expensive. Thus markerlights are usually only good in large numbers. 2) Fire warriors are somewhat effective, but are generally considered over costed and not versatile. They have no heavy weapons, have the worst CC in the game, and poor BS and toughness. Especially when compared to tactical marines, which are good at all of those, and have a 3+ save; while only costing 60% more. 3) As Gideon said, you want your units to die in assault so you can shoot the assaulting unit and not leave them in the safety of CC. One fire warrior left swinging at I2 is not going to help you at all; shooting will. 4) There is a 50% chance of a mission getting night fighting in the first turn, and some chance of getting it in the 5th turn also (I think). Ignoring that with blacksun filter could be helpful. Broadsides can take multi-trackers. Unless you are facing AV13+, space wolves may be a more versatile choice. Long fangs can split fire, and rune priests can get divination psychic powers which are amazing. (Tau can no longer split fire) Aside from broadsides and a few other things, Tau don’t have a lot of competitive units and are not the best ally choice until they get a new codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3120535 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Custodian Athiair Posted July 14, 2012 Author Share Posted July 14, 2012 Okay comments taken on board, and I can see all of your points 100%. I would like to be able to try it out with a proxy model system just to see for myself, but if what you say is accurate it will definitely save me some money as I'll only have to buy the Eldar. Interesting that we've had no comments on the Eldar, is my idea for them okay or does it need work? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/256294-ally-ideas/#findComment-3120989 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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