Fear to tread

[Galileo]

Am I the only one who tought that Kyriss and Kabandha acted like an old married couple?

 

All in all, I didn't find the book that great, but also not as disappointing as KNF or Prospero Burns. Let's say okeish. As several people already pointed out amongst the major flaws, characters are plain and cliched (including Amit), the SW presence is a waste of the reader's time, and Kabandha is sissified.

 

Also, the book doesn't really manage to convey a feeling of what a pre-flaw Blood Angel is, it is only mentioned that BA excel at close combat, that's it. No more insights into the legion tactics and role in the Great Crusade - pity, a wasted opportunity. Sanguinius is also a missed opportunity, although i have to say that some other primarchs have been handled worse than him.

 

There were also good things, though. A few memorable scenes (SW being shown who's the real alpha predator around, Horus skinning Erebus' face, and why not, Sang going wild on two greater daemon' butts at once), the creepy atmosphere builds up nicely as the BA progress in the Signus system, and i personally liked the Red Angel. Could have been much more though.

[Terrahawk]

Also, the book doesn't really manage to convey a feeling of what a pre-flaw Blood Angel is, it is only mentioned that BA excel at close combat, that's it. No more insights into the legion tactics and role in the Great Crusade - pity, a wasted opportunity.

 

This I think is the biggest problem of the book. If someone asked you "What are the Pre-Heresy Blood Angels like?" you still couldn't provide an answer, even after this book.

When you compare FTT to books like Prospero Burns, you just get the feeling that a lot more could have been done in defining the Legion.

 

I also think the epic event that is Signus Prime could have been handled better overall, if it was written by A D-B or Abnett. However, I don't think FTT is a bad book, not at all. It just isn't as awesome as it could have been. One could argue though that as a BA player and a huge fan of their fluff I have unrealistic expactations. ^_^ Anyways, one thing I think Swallow really nailed down is Sanguinius though. So major props to him for that.

 

Not a bad book, but also not ball-breakingly awesome.

[Ethrion]

Personally, I really liked Fear to Tread. It was probably the best James Swallow book I've read actually.

 

There was no repetition of phrases that I've noticed in other books - even though the same phrase might be pages and pages apart you notice when the same descriptors are used and in this book I never once noticed an over use of one.

 

Considering this story was ultimately about one giant battle between the Blood Angels and daemons it never once felt like bolter porn. The balance of narrative and combat was perfect.

 

Sanguinius was portrayed, in my opinion, just right and his battle with the bloodthirster wasn't drawn out and tedious like a certain lightsaber duel in a certain film that will remain un-named. It was furious and brutal but ultimately not boring.

 

Some have written that they didn't care for any of the Blood Angel characters in the book but I must admit I did feel for Meros when he sacrificed himself and I did feel for Kano when he realized who had been in his dream and when he spoke to Sanguinius about their shared visions.

 

As for the overall plot of the story it was the right amount of suspense leading up to the inevitable betrayal, the right amount of battle to get to the end game and the right amount of final act. One only has to remember back to Descent of Angels to know a rushed ending. This had none of that.

 

The meeting with Guilliman at the end leaves us with a nice cliffhanger as to how this will play out. We were promised after that first short story about the Ultramarines training and practicing wargames that the backstory and motives of the Ultramarines will be revealed and it looks like another piece of the puzzle has been shown to us. How this all fits together remains to be seen but now we have the Dark Angels and the Blood Angels all being drawn to Guilliman's banner prior to striking out for Terra. All very intriguing...

 

Finally, the little bit about Horus and how we are now seeing him start to do his own thing and already break with what the daemons had planned for him. Pretty cool little side story there in my opinion.

[Kol Saresk]

I'm only on page 208 but so far I'm really liking it. Then again, I also liked his first books because those were the first exposure I had to the Blood Angels.

[Inquisitor Engel]

Personally, I really liked Fear to Tread. It was probably the best James Swallow book I've read actually.

 

Agreed. I think I have 50 pages left to go. (Busy week) I didn't even make it 50 pages into "Nemesis," so the bar is not high for me. :(

[JimmyJ]

As far as I am concerned FTT is firmly in the "average" bracket for HH novels so far.

 

Someone in here said they would have preferred more battle and less of the build as the Angels made their way through Signus system. I thought that this was the strongest part of the book. The slow build, the impending doom, the haunted house in space that the Blood Angels had walked into was probably the most well realised part of the book, and I thought it worked brilliantly. Planets watching them? The stars vanishing? Chaos stars being burned into planets as the ships pass? Awesome. However, the actual realisation of the Daemons in Ka'Bhanda a Kyriss was a let down. I just don't think millennia old evil daemons that delight in evil and pain and suffering should be bickering like children. Hell, i don't think they should talk. They should keep the Daemons as impenetrable, impossible-to-understand malign intelligences. The two main daemons here came across like moustach twirling villains from the silent movie period.

 

The characterisations of the individual angels was poor as well. i simply did not care about any of them. Not one. I think that the idea of the Blood Angel legion is a great one, but must make it so so hard to capture in written form. Such a conflicted and nuanced legion character can't be easy to get down on paper in an extended form.

[Týr]

As far as I am concerned FTT is firmly in the "average" bracket for HH novels so far.

 

Someone in here said they would have preferred more battle and less of the build as the Angles made their way through Signus system. I thought that this was the strongest part of the book. The slow build, the impending doom, the haunted house in space that the Blod Angels had walked into was probably the most well realised part of the book, and I thought it worked brilliantly. Planets watching them? The star vanishing? Chaos stars being burned into planets as the ships pass? Awesome. However, the actual realisation of the Daemons in Ka'Bhanda a Kyriss was a let down. I just don't think millennia old evil daemons that delight in evil and pain and suffering should be bickering like children. Hell, i don't think they should talk. They should keep the Daemons as inpenetrable, impossible-to-understand malign intelligences. The two main daemons here came across like moustach twirling villains from the silent movie period.

 

The characterisations of the individual angels was poor as well. i simply did not care about any of them. Not one. I think that the idea of the Blood Angel legion is a great one, but must make it so so hard to capture in written form. Such a conflicted and nuanced legion character can't be easy to get down on paper in an extended form.

 

Well said.

 

I also felt that the first part was the better in the book. It contained the immagination that the second part completely lacked.

Indeed the daemons were terrible written and didn't came across as being "great evils O´doom". If they were silent and mysterious it would have left a better impression.

We all knew what the bad guys were after, so it felt unnecessary everyone from team Horus had to spell it out with caps lock in every scene that "the BA need to be broken..bla..bla..bla".

Silence and the BA guesswork, to what is going on, could perhaps have saved the second part of the book...perhaps.

[Aegnor]

Am I the only one who was disappointed that when the treachery of the Word Bearers, especially the Chaplain Kreed, became apparent, that none of the Blood Angels took the chance to yell "KRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

Oh, I am. Ok...

[Valkyrion]

It's on a par with Deliverance Lost. I haven't quite finished it yet, but it's fun enough to keep reading, if a little uninteresting and I've often found myself skimming through the walls of descriptive text to get to the dialogue.

 

It's quite clear that the Black Library Elite are Abnett, McNeill and ADB though.

 

I don't know if it was ever mentioned before that Slaanesh were present on Signus Prime, but it that is something new invented by the author then I don't like it. It should just have been Khorne, IMO.

[Aegnor]

My recollection is that it was always Khorne AND Slaanesh.

[Gaz Taylor]

I enjoyed Fear to Tread. I can see the reasoning behind some of the comments, but too be honest this was a tricky story for anybody to pick up as it is one of the cornerstones of the 40K background and you don't have a massive amount of space to run around in unlike some of the other Horus Heresy books.

 

The plus points for me was how Sanguinus was portrayed as well as the whole Daemonic Incursion. I really liked how the Greater Daemons were Bond Villain like and bickered with each other. The negative points were how one dimensional some of the other characters were and I thought how the Word Bearers could have done more in the story rather than be the mobile phone technicians

[Aegnor]

The Word Bearers were necessary to the narrative, to provide the PoV for those scenes with the greater daemons that you liked, and the PoV for the tension between Horus and the daemons. I guess the cultist leader who arrives at Signus at the start could have fulfilled a similar role.

[Gaz Taylor]

As you said though, I think it would have been more interesting using the cultists rather than the Word Bearers for that aspect of the story.

[Valkyrion]

The Word Bearers were necessary to make the Blood Angels have the obligatory ':P, betrayed?' moment when they realise they are betrayed by their own.

Cultists wouldn't have been able to achieve that.

[Tezzy]

I really liked it, a similar novel to A Thousand Sons in that it fleshed out not just a major Heresy event but also a major Heresy legion.

 

Good:

Sanguinius was awesome.

Amit the Flesh Tearer was hella awesome.

The two Greater Daemons were awesome, I really liked their representation.

 

Horus cutting off Erebus' face!

The cliffhanger ending with the Blood Angels snapping out of the warp in Ultramar is very interesting. With Betrayer coming soon, there's so much potential now for previously unwritten stuff to go down before we get to Terra. Angron and Lorgar vs Sanguinius and Roboute Guilliman tag team match?!

 

 

Complaints (slight):

Raldoron was a little two-dimensional for me.

Azkaellon was satisfactory, he fit the bill of the type of character who'd be the captain of a guard unit. Someone similar to a Custodes.

Meros was okay but I thought too much time was spent stressing that he was rank and file, not a hero.

Kano was good but I'd have liked him to be a little more of a scholar like Ahriman.

I'd have liked the Bloodthirster to have referenced Angron to Sanguinius.

The World Eaters look very much like second string choices for Khorne now after the failure to bring the Blood Angels to the Red Path. I think it would have been a great pay off for Ka'bandha to say something like "Your brother, the Gladiator, he sees the glory of the Red Path, the two you both as Champions of the Blood God, the taker of Skulls... that is the future." Then the Angel could be like "Angron, him too? Horus... Angron... Magnus..." That would have been good if it were thrown in whilst he contemplated falling prior to the heroics of Meros.

 

 

I actually didn't mind the inclusion of the Space Wolves and the reason why they're there, I just felt that they'd have been better if they were developed into a proper sub-plot or left out all together. They were neither one thing nor the other. I thought their mission was an interesting idea and I also liked the dialogue towards the end where

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

[Gaz Taylor]

The Word Bearers were necessary to make the Blood Angels have the obligatory ':(, betrayed?' moment when they realise they are betrayed by their own.

Cultists wouldn't have been able to achieve that.

 

Maybe but it wasn't that dramatic how it was done (IMO) and they just seem to have skulked off rather than helping out with some sort of boarding action, turning on the Angels and then sacrificing their geneseed.

[Galileo]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

[Baluc]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

 

Its not sanction that is the fear. Its the questions it would bring up. "Why are your Captains murdering Loyal Astartes?" Then he would want blood.

[DarKnight]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

This has the potential to take the thread way off course but please bear with me, this isn't any SW fanboyism. I'm curious as to why you think the Wolves were unsuccessful with the Razing of Prospero? Heavy losses on both sides to be sure, but crippling a Primarch and forcing a Legion into the Eye seems like a victory to me. Maybe edging towards Pyrrhic until we get solid numbers, if we ever do. Either way sounds like a win to me.

[Arachnid99]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

This has the potential to take the thread way off course but please bear with me, this isn't any SW fanboyism. I'm curious as to why you think the Wolves were unsuccessful with the Razing of Prospero? Heavy losses on both sides to be sure, but crippling a Primarch and forcing a Legion into the Eye seems like a victory to me. Maybe edging towards Pyrrhic until we get solid numbers, if we ever do. Either way sounds like a win to me.

 

Before Prospero you have two lower than normal strength Legions loyal to Terra. The Thousands Sons were already sorcerers in hock to Tzeentch, but they were still loyal at that point. Russ's "interpretation" of the Emperors "Bring Magnus back to Terra" order into genocide left the Imperium effectively down a legion and a half (all Thousands Sons plus half of the Space Wolves). So while there were tactically successful it was a pyrrhic victory and a strategic disaster. A bit like the German sub that sank the Lusitania.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

This has the potential to take the thread way off course but please bear with me, this isn't any SW fanboyism. I'm curious as to why you think the Wolves were unsuccessful with the Razing of Prospero? Heavy losses on both sides to be sure, but crippling a Primarch and forcing a Legion into the Eye seems like a victory to me. Maybe edging towards Pyrrhic until we get solid numbers, if we ever do. Either way sounds like a win to me.

 

Before Prospero you have two lower than normal strength Legions loyal to Terra. The Thousands Sons were already sorcerers in hock to Tzeentch, but they were still loyal at that point. Russ's "interpretation" of the Emperors "Bring Magnus back to Terra" order into genocide left the Imperium effectively down a legion and a half (all Thousands Sons plus half of the Space Wolves). So while there were tactically successful it was a pyrrhic victory and a strategic disaster. A bit like the German sub that sank the Lusitania.

 

I hate to get in this, because people start screeching fanboy over a screen name, but thats not entirely accurate:

in older fluff, Horus altered the orders from arrest to destroy. Still thinking Horus loyal, Russ obeys.

in Prospero Burns we dont see the orders being presented to Russ, but we do see Russ plead through Hawser (who everybody thought was a pawn of Magnus) for Magnus to surrender peacefully.

 

so Russ went to Prospero under the orders to purge, regardless of what source you want to use. He didnt have to "interpret" anything. And he did try to bring a peaceful resolution...or as peaceful as it could have been. (Which shows great restraint on his part, and brotherly love, if he thought he could talk down a brother he believed was chaos-touched)

 

if the T-Sons were truely loyal, they wouldnt being using daemon familiars.

and even Ahriman calls out Magnus over the daemonic spell used to warn the Emperor of Horus's fall. Magnus realizes he was wrong in its use after his moment with the Emperor.

(i know that many people like to view magnus as the poor tragic hero, doomed by fate. i see him as more of a faustian failure, and his arrogance of his power is his true failure.)

 

but lets "grimdark" up more stuff. yay.

WLK

[DarKnight]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

This has the potential to take the thread way off course but please bear with me, this isn't any SW fanboyism. I'm curious as to why you think the Wolves were unsuccessful with the Razing of Prospero? Heavy losses on both sides to be sure, but crippling a Primarch and forcing a Legion into the Eye seems like a victory to me. Maybe edging towards Pyrrhic until we get solid numbers, if we ever do. Either way sounds like a win to me.

 

Before Prospero you have two lower than normal strength Legions loyal to Terra. The Thousands Sons were already sorcerers in hock to Tzeentch, but they were still loyal at that point. Russ's "interpretation" of the Emperors "Bring Magnus back to Terra" order into genocide left the Imperium effectively down a legion and a half (all Thousands Sons plus half of the Space Wolves). So while there were tactically successful it was a pyrrhic victory and a strategic disaster. A bit like the German sub that sank the Lusitania.

I was speaking from more of a purely tactical frame of reference of the assault in particular as opposed to the true intentions of Chaos to further sow dissent and mistrust within the Imperium. But you still make great points.

[Valkyrion]

Azkaellon tells Sanguinius, Sanguinius tells Russ, Russ goes mental, Russ tells Malcador, Malcador tells the Emperor, the Emperor sees Magnus Part II, Russ goes off to kill the Blood Angels.

 

Worst case scenario and why Sanguinius couldn't be told.

 

Even best case scenario would have been the SW not trusting the BA, and when you've 8 legions confirmed renegade, 3 with severe losses, 2 missing, 6 of unknown loyalty or strength, and yourself - not worth the risk.

[Galileo]

the legionnaires lie about what happened to Sanguinius because they know what will happen down the line if they do tell the truth. Sanguinius will not keep what happened from Leman Russ and Leman Russ will not understand or see the bigger picture going on. The Wolves will destroy the Blood Angels, probably destroying themselves in the process after just prosecuting the Thousand Sons and thus cripple the loyalist defence force for the coming civil war.

 

I think that's a bit too extreme, they were probably more afraid that

Russ would have asked for Amit's head, and the relationship between the two legions would have soured, which in a time of civil war is not the best way to go. Besides, the sanctioned punishment of a legion is already a very extreme measure, rarely heard of. Marching against another legion just because of a personal grudge seems a bit too much. And finally, given also how the wolves failed against the TS despite help from the Custodes, SoS and Magnus himself, it's hard to see how the could take on the BA and hope to achieve something. But anyway, we'll never know the answer to such a "what if"..., that will be left to each fan's own interpretation.

 

This has the potential to take the thread way off course but please bear with me, this isn't any SW fanboyism. I'm curious as to why you think the Wolves were unsuccessful with the Razing of Prospero? Heavy losses on both sides to be sure, but crippling a Primarch and forcing a Legion into the Eye seems like a victory to me. Maybe edging towards Pyrrhic until we get solid numbers, if we ever do. Either way sounds like a win to me.

 

Well Prospero was razed pretty good, no doubt about that. What i meant is that the TS and Magnus were still a threat afterwards; actually, from a potential threat they became an actual (and pretty pissed off) menace. A tactical win, as someone as already pointed out, but a strategical failure. As for Magnus in particular, in Aurelian he doesn't look so crippled, he actually seem pretty eager to kick butts. And after all, in the 41st millennium, he's still there (somewhat), while Russ is not

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Magnus is as present in the 41st millennium as Russ is.

 

and we dont know Russ's fate yet.

 

WLK