Remake of a chaos army

[nusphigor]

Good day/afternoon/night to all of you

 

I have a Blood Angels army but I just don't feel attached to it or at least too happy when im playing with it and honestly I kinda miss my old chaos army.

This is why I wanted to ask you some questions about Undivided armies and see if I can make a new chaos Army again :P

 

I hope you guys can help me with this:

 

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

 

What do you like the most of them?

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

 

 

I hope this will do, thanks a lot in advance ;)

[Vesper]

-Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

They have that feel, you know, something that feels deeper than "those guys ? Yeah, they worship X". They have great identities.

 

-What do you like the most of them?

Fluff, paint schemes.

 

-Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

Only one : Night Lords.

 

-Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

Everything is good as long as you're happy with it.

 

-Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

Could be the case, after all, some people are really keen on some traits ("Night Lords must have raptors !" and such). What is pretty funny (ADB would use another word), is that there's plenty of conflicting views, and I dare say we are the only board that constantly talks about identity subjects like what to think of the warbands, the state of the Legions, the identities of legionnaries, ect. To come back to your question, I don't feel restricted at all, I'm fine with people playing Khorne Berzerkers in their Night Lords, mine are non-Khornate assault units using Berzerkers rules just because I don't want god worshippers in my army. In the end, you do whatever you want*. Chaos is cool, even if GW and Gavin tried very hard to make you think otherwise.

 

 

* In the limitations of the Gavdex©, propriety of Games Workshop. At no point you could incriminate the user "Vesper" for the bad time you could(will) have playing the Gavdex.

[Irabrai]

I'm at the start of making a second Chaos Army, having going for a "pure" Tzeentch army, nothing without a Mark of Tzeentch, tho it does include some Raptors (if only i could find the 5th one i did :S) and a squad of Chosen Word BearersI'm also a Blood Angel player, so wanted something different.

 

Originally, it was going to just be a squad of Word Bearers to act as a chosen squad, but the fact that I enjoy painting red means that I'm liking painting Word Bearers. It was due to (mainly) ADB's The First Heretic, as well as bits of fluff in A Thousand Sons that made me want to do some Word Bearers as Chosen, but what with the new Rules coming out, I'm going to do a full force of them.

 

I cant really see the Word Bearers uniting behind any one of the Ruinous Powers, so Undivided gets the go ahead. I'm not bothered by not having any of the Cult Troops. Its a completely different army to what I already have, in that I'm planning it to be more of a "Stay back and shoot army", so no Bezerkers (and in most Chaos army I face...yawn). Plague Marines look cool, but some of the guys i game with use them, and i dont really want to do them - Plus painting them, no thanks, im just not that good. Never been a fan of Noise Marines, and I already have Thousand Sons so...

 

What do I like most of them. I dont know, Havent got enough models yet, but as I said previously, reading the HH books, as well as Oath of Moment, the whole sacrificial thing with the Cultists - A ploy I'll be using myself when i get there.

 

Will it be the one legion? Yes. My Thousand Son force will be staying at 5th edition, and the squad of them that I'm currently painting up will act as Chosen in both the 5th Edition TS army, and the upcoming purist Word Bearer army.

 

In regards to the fluff. I'm not too concerned by it. At the end of the day, its your own army so its your call, The logic I had with my TS force with the Word Bearers comes from A Thousand Sons. Lorgar and Magnus seemed to be very close, and I just kept the logic that even with 10,000 years having gone by since the Horus Heresy, some of them would still be getting along. In regards to my WB force, they'll be following some of the fluff, such as sending in waves of Cultists into close combat to soften the enemy up (hopefully) but I'm not too sure what else since just yet, I'm really waiting for september to get a peaceful trial game of 6th edition as well as the new Codex before making my mind up into what else goes into the army.

 

Hope what i've said helps you out - Its all my opinion, and what others do is up to them.

 

Irabrai

[Sception]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

Many years ago, I was impressed with a few highly converted armies based on themes external to the game. For instance, a cool vamp counts army based on Army of Darkness. I wanted to do something like that, and at the time I was a huge fan of the Powerpuff Girls, so I figured I'd do that. A whole army of recognizable powerpuff characters. 40k chaos actually seemed like a good fit, so I went with that.

 

I never got very far with the conversions - a keeper of secrets converted into 'Him', a poorly sculpted 'Mange' that I never figured out how I was going to use, bubbles dressed as Mojo piloting a hollowed out chaos dreadnought, and after the release of the 3.5 codex I converted Mojo Jojo as a chaos lord with a Kai gun - the only model of the effort that still exists. Anyway, after the release of the 3.5 book, I briefly considered porting the force over to Alpha Legion, but in the end went with Black Legion (repainting some of my models in the process), as that left the most options for conversions open.

 

As time went on, I read more fluff about the Chaos Marines and the Black Legion in particular, and got to be a fan. So when I gave up on the whole powerpuff army thing, I stuck with Black Legion just for its own sake.

 

What do you like the most of them?

I like the fluff of the Black Legion, I like the hate that drives them - hatred of everything, including themselves. I love how they obsess over Horus's legacy, worshipping him but hating him for his failure. I love how Abaddon picked them up and rebuilt them into something fierce and terrible. I love how they absorb warbands of other factions and incorporate them into their Legion.

 

Model-wise, I love chaos terminators and possessed, two of the favorite tools of the black legion. I also like the way a black legion army is dark and menacing, but punctuated with the bright colors of allied daemons.

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

I play Black Legion exclusively, but the Black Legion is the legion of all legions, incorporating soldiers broken off from all the other chaos forces. In the Black Legion you'll find Thousand Sons sorcerers who were banished by their primarch along with Ahriman, Death Guard warlords grown tired of their primarch's complacency, and remnants of the World Eaters and Emperor's Children broken off after those legions shattered themselves against one another.

 

I, however, focus my army on undivided chaos marines - those who hold themselves above and apart from chaos, rather than falling to the worship of any one power. Grim warriors, their armor as black as their hearts, marching to war against their eternal foe, the teeming, colorful hordes of daemons and base cultists streaming around them, and their lord and his mighty terminator bodyguard standing above them.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

With the possible exceptions of the Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, or perhaps the Alpha Legion (though their organization was never so rigid to begin with), the Chaos Legions of today are basically just alliances of individual warbands whose lords have sworn themselves to some overlord waving that legion's flags, be it one of the daemon primarchs or some other powerful figure. Apart from the three mentioned, all the legions have been shattered at least once in their long history since they were driven into the eye, forced to rebuild themselves from the remnants left over. As such, I think most chaos players are perfectly justified in crafting their warband to follow whatever the predilections of its individual lord may be, regardless of whether that lord in turn as sworn himself to the flag of any particular legion. Obviously the cult legions would accept no members dedicated to one of the other gods, but other then that I personally feel you should be free to do as you wish.

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

No... but then again I play Black Legion, whose fluff leaves them basically entirely free to do whatever they want. If I played another legion, well, let me put it this way. If I didn't want to play an army of lightning-fast shock assault terror squads, why would I want to play Night Lords, anyway? If I didn't want a relentless force revolving the thundering impact of big guns, why would I play Iron Warriors? I don't think the fluff of the legions should limit you too much, but at the same time, their preferred fighting style should influence which legion you sign up with in the first place, if indeed your warlord chooses to throw his lot in with any of them.

[Bearingtheword]

Good day/afternoon/night to all of you

 

I have a Blood Angels army but I just don't feel attached to it or at least too happy when im playing with it and honestly I kinda miss my old chaos army.

This is why I wanted to ask you some questions about Undivided armies and see if I can make a new chaos Army again :)

 

I hope you guys can help me with this:

 

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

I can blame it mostly on Black Library novels and their authors. After reading the Word Bearer trilogy by Anthony Reynolds I knew then and there that I wanted a Word Bearers army, then I read First Heretic, by our own ADB, and that hook was set even deeper. After doing some research and seeing some of the most awesome conversions and paint jobs done with chaos marines here on B&C I was totally hooked. Although I can't say that my Word Bearers have stayed wholly undivided. In order to match some of the fluff I have had to make some concessions as far as marks and icons go. Not sure how much of it will change with the new codex coming, but I do find it a great fun army to play

 

What do you like the most of them?

The attitude and fluff of them. There is so much than can be done to customize them, the possibilities are endless.

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

Just one host from the Word Bearers legion.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

The coolest thing with Chaos is that you can do whatever you want to do. If you want to field part of a legion, you can. If you want to field a warband, you can. If you want to come up with your own fluff and creation, you can. it is awesome that way.

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

I have never felt constrained by the fluff. I have tried to match some of the fluff, but I have never felt constrained by it. The rules in some cases I have but very few.

 

I hope this will do, thanks a lot in advance ;)

 

 

Hope these answers help.

 

~BtW

[SpooksGotHim]

What do you like the most of them?

 

I like the fluff of the Black Legion, I like the hate that drives them - hatred of everything, including themselves. I love how they obsess over Horus's legacy, worshipping him but hating him for his failure. I love how Abaddon picked them up and rebuilt them into something fierce and terrible. I love how they absorb warbands of other factions and incorporate them into their Legion.

 

I've got to second that opinion. For me personally Black Legion is the all-rounder in Chaos. The fact that the legion once belonged to the Warmaster speaks for its self. Yet, I also do not want to miss out on the other aspects of the other traitor legions. Each legion has its unique abilities and everyone of them is appealing. Which is why when I starter my Chaos army awhile back, I made it a conscious effort to include all other Legions, coming under the banner of Abaddon. The bulk majority of my troops don Black Legion colors, and the rest of the other "specialised" troops wore their legion colors, eg raptors in NL, dark apostles in WB and so on.

[Azarias]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

 

What do you like the most of them?

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

 

In order:

 

I chose Word Bearers way back when because of their heavy emphasis on Daemons - I still have fond memories of the old 3.5 Bloodletters tearing through my friend's Space Marines, or my brother's Imperial Guard. That they were undivided was simply part of the package. I've mostly stuck with them, though after reading Legion, and once I'd picked up the hobby again, I did make up a squad of Alpha Legion chosen.

 

The former. I'm currently working on my master's thesis on William Blake, and when I read ADB's The First Heretic, and the mention of Lorgar's title "The Urizen," a bizarre little connection was made between my hobby and my thesis. While I play Word Bearers, the homemade fluff for my army, The Sons of Urizen, allows me to personalize my models, so that their icons are iron books (cf. The Book of Urizen, plate 4), and so forth.

 

And as to your last question, I'm of two minds. On the one hand, I don't think some reductive, single reading of the fluff should circumscribe all your creative possibilities. On the other, restrictions do bring about interesting moments of creativity. For example, someone working within the diseased connotations of the Death Guard might be bored of the traditional puss-and-boil depiction, and come up with another really great way to communicate a sense of decay and entropy, while at the same time referencing these standards. A personal example: like most Word Bearer models I've seen, I've been a little heavy on the green stuff parchment. While I wanted to use this motif for my rhino, I couldn't think of a good way to use it until, on a smoke break, I saw some Tibetan prayer flags on a neighbor's front porch. Immediately a light went on in my head. The trick, I think, to navigating this question appropriately is nuance. If you can do something that looks like it fits into the spirit of a legion, but does something different at the same time, then you're good.

[nusphigor]

Thank you all for your heretical responses, it pleases my hate filled hearts to see such truthful answers. Both of them.

 

Those answers helped me a lot to clarify my own answers to those questions ;)

 

 

And now the only thing that I'm missing are the miniatures to make the army. XD

I used to have an Alpha Legion army with a squad of World Eaters and a squad of Death Guard helping them in their missions but then the army went to the warp, never to be seen again and I had only the plague marines left, and so my journey into the path of nurgle began and I made a small Death Guard warband (different color scheme as these were in red tones but still disgusting) but that army also went to the warp...

 

Well enough of those despicable dreams of times long past, now the future: The Crescendo of Hate warband of the Black Legion

 

I guess this can be a good list of miniatures to start with, what do you thing about it?

 

I wont include the point costs as the new chaos book seems to be near so maybe the equipment will have different point cost.

 

Chaos Lord Abig'grath, the Flayer of thousands

- Terminator Armour (because that miniature is awesome and everyone knows that a Chaos lord who deserves his title MUST have terminator Armour XD)

- Power Weapon/Daemon Weapon (this is based on the fluff I will make about him gaining that weapon, but he will start with a power Axe)

- Twin-Linked Bolter (just because I love that weapon ^_^)

 

Daemon Prince Abig'grath, the hateful (When he is ascended, it will be on the fluff)

- Unmarked (he is too cool to have any mark XD)

- Wings (of course)

- Doom Bolt (just to get Pyromancy or Telekinesis)

 

Chaos Sorcerer Ebilerth, The Watcher

- Mark of Tzeentch (just to get mastery lv 2, if the new codex gives the sorcerers the option to get lv 2 mastery then I'll change for it)

- Doombolt (To get Telekinesis or Telepathy)

- Another power (To get Telekinesis or Telepathy)

- Force Sword (I like the classic Swords :()

 

Chaos Terminator Squad The Despised

5 Chaos Terminators

- 1 Heavy Flamer (puryfing flame for the unbelievers [or the beliebers?], of course)

- 2 Power Fists (I like those weapons)

- 2 Power Swords (Swords are kinda cool)

- 1 Power Maul (just because XD)

- 4 Combi-Melta/Twin Linked bolters (Still can't decide)

 

Chaos Space Marine Squad The Hand of the Flayer

Aspring Champion Berinath

- Power Sword

- Plasma Pistol (pew pew)

- Meltabombs

9 Chaos Marines

- 2 Plasmagun (even more pew pew)

- Icon of chaos glory (because we need it)

 

Chaos Rhino Requiem of souls

- Daemonic Possession (nom nom green stuff)

- Combi-Plasma (because they need more pew pew)

 

Chaos Space Marine Squad The Blades of the Gods

Aspiring Champion Furion

- Power Fist

- Combi-Melta

9 Chaos Marines

- 1 Meltagun

- 1 Flamer

- Icon of Chaos Glory (Who says guardsmen arent good furniture?)

 

Chaos Rhino Retribution of Lupercal

- Daemonic Possession (Possessed by the soul of an ancient Sons of Horus Captain)

- Havoc Launcher (maybe this anti horde weapon can help)

 

Chaos Defiler Ancient Izticol

- 2 Close combat weapons (Assault? yeah)

 

 

 

 

Well thats about it for starters, what do you think? what would you add to this?

 

I will start writing the fluff soon so stay tuned :P

 

 

And again a lot of thanks for your comments, the really helped me a lot :)

[Trevak Dal]

I came into Chaos from Tau-and from having my group mostly shut down any and all fluff ideas for my Tau as being "Stupid" or "That wouldn't happen". With Chaos I was spoiled for choice (Tau don't have much consistancy when it comes to fluff). I really liked the Alpha Legion, but I didn't want to (if the new codex went the way of the 3.5 codex) be pigeon holed into an all Infiltration army, similarly with World Eaters, I didn't want to be pigeon holed into having to play a certain way, so that's why I ultimately went with Black Legion as they have some established background-but also lots of free range to make up your own stuff, so I'd have a foundation to build upon.

 

 

My army's fluff is that they're a warband created from captured Cadian child-soldiers, patched over and meted out to some Lords who'd gained Abaddon's favor some how or some way. The Nightblades are sort of like Evil Gaunts' Ghosts, because my Sorcerer Lord-originally "patched over" from an Alpha Legion warband came into control of the Nightblades after having gained Abaddon's favor, and it's caused him a great deal of struggle-probably partially arranged by a Lord of higher stature in the Black Legion.

 

Because they're Cadian in origin, I've painted their eye lenses purple (many people on Cadia have purple irises-in any game where I can color a characters eyes, I usually make them purple), and because I'm using the bit from Storm of Iron about how the Geneseed bank was sent to Abaddon so they have a myriad of backgrounds of traitor and loyalist geneseed.

 

I don't really like the horns, so I've cut most of them off, nor do I particularly like the idea of 'horribly mutated guys'. I imagine that like in the Horus Heresy, there's some lodges/individual worship services for the various beliefs-not to mention the temptations of the various paths. Personally, I don't like Nurgle, and I don't really like Slaneesh either. Khorne and Tzeentch are pretty awesome but my warband is "Undivided" with elements of Beserker backup, assuming that most of them pray to Khorne/chaos in general to give them strength, to Tzeentch to give them protection and quick wits to think outside of the box, to Slaanesh to find some suitable warbrides, and Nurgle to curse their Enemies' bodies and armor with failure.

[hornywingythingy]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

 

The models, I loved the new csm models, (well they were new back in 3.5) plus they were very different to my other army, nids.

 

What do you like the most of them?

 

The fact that they are the corruption of the protectors of the imperium, the antithesis of loyalist marines.

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

 

One, alpha legion, was thinking about switching to brotherhood of darkness, but I like alpha legion too much.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

 

I used to play an all infantry infiltrators force, the gavdex has forced me away from that more fluff based army towards a more competitive based army, I can't say I'm happy about that...

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

 

I will try to abide by the fluff somewhat, though the current rules really force you away from that.

[totgeboren]

I chose Word Bearers way back when because of their heavy emphasis on Daemons - I still have fond memories of the old 3.5 Bloodletters tearing through my friend's Space Marines, or my brother's Imperial Guard.

 

Hehe, just got to comment on this. I chose Word Bearers way way back in that case, during 2ed when they were all about Chaos Marines herding waves of cultists! With the new codex it looks like I can finally field my WB army in the way that made me start it in the first place. :)

 

And to the OP. You are as limited by the background as you want to be. For example, my Chaos Lord uses the Mark of Tzeentch for the rules, but story-wise he is entirely Undivided. I also got a unit of Khorne Berzerkers, but the models are based on Forge Worlds mk.V armours using bolt pistols and chainaxes. They are supposed to represent close combat specialists, not khornate worshippers.

 

I remember seeing a squad of Chaos Marines (I think it was Iron Warriors) with an apothecary, and the apothecary was used as a count-as Icon of Nurgle. I myself have used a Sorcerer as an Icon of Tzeentch (giving the squad a 5++ inv is very much like a psychic power), and I have also seen a Chaos Chaplain used as the icon of Khorne. You can do a lot with some count-as, just make sure all is clear and obvious to your opponent, and if you do count-as, I have found that it is really important to make the models look as good as possible.

People don't mind count-as if the models look cool, but they tend to hate it if the models are unpainted or just badly painted.

 

Using Cult troops in some undivided legions is no problem (BL and some NL warbands), whilst others (like the AL and to an extent the IW) are sort of themed around not being all-out worshippers of the Dark Gods. Some are in the middle depending on your point of view. I for example would put the WB squarely in the 'no cults' camp, but some feel that they should have no problem with cults. Night Lord warbands are sort of stated to run the entire scale, with some as fully fledged chaos cultists, and some who try to maintain their independence and reject the gods.

 

So it's up to you really. You are quite free to do what you will with the Undivided legions, but remember that they are called 'Undivided' for a reason. ;)

You should however stay away from having say a Tzeentchian World Eater Sorcerer or Death Guard Noise Marines, as that would totally contradict the fluff.

[Excessus]

I chose my Alpha Legion back in 2nd ed because I liked the colours... :P

 

They didn't have so much background fleshed out back then, not until the articles in WD at least...

[Snejk]

Alpha Legion because they are portrayed like less arrogant pricks such as the Word Bearers (Which would have been my second choice...)

[The Colossus]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

 

I never really sat down and thought about the army being "Undivided", it just happened. It offered scope for conversions, and usage of all the cult troops. Although, that turned into counts-as. Thus, my power-armoured Lord has the MON to account for his power armour being modified with terminator parts, due to his large size- ala Pasanius of the Ultras. My Berserkers are merely combat extraordinaires and my Plague Marines equipped with poorly maintained, heavy bionic augmentation (Allows for all the FnP, reduced init, etc).

 

 

What do you like the most of them?

 

The conversion opportunities.

 

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

 

Well, many, I guess, but its a predominantly Iron Warriors offshoot, that will take in any Astartes willing to follow my Lord.

 

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

 

Mine follow Iron Warriors doctrine, but with modification. That's not for a competitive streak- the ideas for the unit character comes first, then I fit the rules around that. Rather than, rules first, models/fluff second.

 

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

 

Nope. The Legions are huge, and whilst they will have a preferred method of warfare, they can perform equally well in all sorts of theatres of war- if you've got an idea, go with it, you'll have a unique and awesome army at the end of it.

[Kristoff]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

Well, mine's not Undivided, they have a specific patron, just his gifts are often similar to the major gods.

 

What do you like the most of them?

Freedom to build how I want with no "Germs for the Germ god!"

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

I play a fallen Cursed Chapter descended from the loyalist VII Legion, Imperial Fists. So, one. I love the Black Templars (no, they didn't come through them), so that tempered my decision.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

It depends. I like a good story, so I have stuff floating around in my head.

 

In fact, that's how I got into Chaos in the first place. I saw a challenge on finding a good reason for Chaos Marines to ally with Tau (oddly prophetic, now that I think about it), back when I was a Fish'ead. I came up with a concept that this warband was allergic to the current Warp, and the Tau were one of the few races that they could work with due to their low psyker signature (Necrons and their own converted IG being the others).

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

Yes, but then, I like a good story, and it's those little fluff pieces that make one want to start/continue such a force.

 

I have a Blood Angels army but I just don't feel attached to it or at least too happy when im playing with it and honestly I kinda miss my old chaos army.

This is why I wanted to ask you some questions about Undivided armies and see if I can make a new chaos Army again :)

Might I suggest looking up the Dornian Heresy? In there, the Blood Angels have been Marked as Nurgle's Own and wander the galaxy seeking organs to harvest to replace their failing ones. You could Nurglize your current models to show their corruption. Then have this corrupted warband meet up and join Abaddon and be invested into his Black Legion for the 13th/14th Crusade. You could kill 2 birds with one stone that way.

[Iron Warrior w/ Servo Arm]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

I used the painting guide on the 3.0 codex and ended up with around 20 Iron Warriors. Did not have the $$$ then to do a pure Thousand Sons army. Also they had no Sorcerers back then and it was basically just a bolter wall.

 

What do you like the most of them?

After painting them, GW published the Index Astartes articles and I liked their fluff. Also painting scheme is fun.

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

I used to have Iron Warriors, Thousand Sons, World Eaters, Death Guard, Black Legion, Emperor's Children, and Night Lords. Then I sold everything except the Iron Warriors and some leftover Thousand Sons. Iron Warriors I could not sell for sentimental reasons.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

Just make it your own. I write my own fluff and I love it. Commisar Molotov is a great example. Check out his Castigators.

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

Restrictions are good. Forces me to be more creative.

 

Also, if I want to play Blood Angels I would just play pure World Eaters. So much cooler.

[Khestra the Unbeheld]

Why did you make an undivided Chaos army?

 

Under the 3.5 CSM Codex, it offered the most flexibility as pertained to MTOE, and it also afforded the most opportunity to keep my opponents constantly guessing as to what I was going to field on whatever occasion.

 

What do you like the most of them?

 

Unrestricted access to unit types.

 

Do you play with only one legion or many legions?

 

It began as Black Legion with auxilia from other Legions added into the Grand Company, and I do still have that setup even today, but I've also begun branching into other Legions as standalone force organizations, most recently the World Eaters. I await the 6.0 Codex before committing to another Legion.

 

Do you think is it good to create a warband with only hints on the fluff of a canon legion or just following all the canon for your army?

 

I followed canon up until it came time to forge the actual fluff of the Grand Company itself, and then I began to digress from established Black Legion canon without actually affecting or disturbing it. I built my command structure, my TACSOP, and my MTOE, and then let them loose on the galaxy starting with the Medusa V campaign. I think it's a much more satisfying challenge to take established canon and craft a warband "between the lines" without having to deus ex machina some cumbersome ego trip or just blow canon off altogether because it's not working otherwise.

 

Do you feel constrained or restricted about the fluff when you are making an army of an established legion?

 

Not a bit. Unlike something like Synnibarr or another game system that has an established timeline of events and locations where X happened on such-and-such a date and nothing else could possibly have happened there and then and no one else but forces Y and Z were present at the time, Warhammer 40K plays fast and loose with timelines a lot, so it affords ample opportunity to insert your own fluff into that mix without spoiling the recipe, much less needing to break the mix just to cram your stuff into a space it's not meant to occupy. Legion fluff is a foundation, a solid one that can be built upon to make a standing structure from; if the foundation doesn't match the house plan, then change the house plan to fit, or at least don't drop a blueprint that obviously wasn't made for that type of foundation and suddenly expect the foundation to change itself.

[A D-B]

Deep breath.

 

Prepare Repetition Engines.

 

And... go.

 

Although I can't say that my Word Bearers have stayed wholly undivided. In order to match some of the fluff I have had to make some concessions as far as marks and icons go.

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

 

Chaos Undivided, especially in the context of the Word Bearers, is the worship of all the gods as a pantheon, choosing prayers to different gods for different tasks, deeds, and battles - but overall, choosing to worship them in their glory equally. Like a Roman soldier would venerate Mars before going to war, and Apollo if he wanted good weather on his wedding day, and Vulcan if he was forging a sword, and so on. Like in many polytheistic religions, and many fantasy settings, you worship the gods equally as a pantheon, but choose X when you need X, and Y when you need Y, and so on. Chaos Undivided (in the context of the Word Bearers) isn't worshipping some idea of "Chaos" instead of the gods, it's worshipping the gods as the epitome of Chaos, as the very core of the concept. It's recognising that they are Chaos. Undivided, in the Word Bearer sense, don't specialise in one god. They worship them all equally. You can raise an Icon of Khorne, of you want. You can raise an Icon of Slaanesh the next day. It's not limited to "We only raise Icons of Ehhhh, Whatever".

 

"With the thirty-seven keys of Tzeentch, we open the way for our brothers. With the thousand whispers of Slaanesh, we call to them. With the twelve plagues of Nurgle, we fell their enemies. And with the mighty axe of Khorne, we cut open the world for them."

 

 

If you want to field part of a legion, you can. If you want to field a warband, you can.

 

A warband is just the expression used for "A Chaos Marine army". It's not Legions vs. Warbands. Sometimes, a warband is an independent outfit, doing its own thing. But the term doubles in use: the way a Chapter is broken into Companies, a Legion is broken into warbands. If you play Word Bearers, you play "A Word Bearer Warband".

 

 

 

 

 

 

I... I think this did it. The post that finally broke me.

 

Farewell, B&C. I'll always remember our sweet, sweet nights together. I'm going to go sit in a corner, rock back and forth, and whisper comforting things to myself.

[Sception]

ADB, that argh is jaying the format. Please shorten it or add some line breaks. Thanks.

[Hyaenidae]

ADB, that argh is jaying the format. Please shorten it or add some line breaks. Thanks.

 

Are... are you serious? The guy just said "screw you, I quit", and that's your comment?

 

Good lord, maybe A D-B's on to something. I think it's time for a break too...

[Lord_Caerolion]

Damnit, please don't go, A D-B. We'll miss your wisdom and the general witty hilarity you tend to bring to threads!

 

Damn you, 3.5 Codex, and the fallacies you've installed as truth! Damn you to hell!

[Artein]

Damn you, 3.5 Codex, and the fallacies you've installed as truth! Damn you to hell!

2 months for the next Codex. Let's hope it'll fix our fluff. We must endure those 2 months.

[the jeske]

Damnit, please don't go, A D-B. We'll miss your wisdom and the general witty hilarity you tend to bring to threads!

 

Damn you, 3.5 Codex, and the fallacies you've installed as truth! Damn you to hell!

 

you do understand that stuff that is important for a writer[being able to create different and interesting characters , with much depth] is not the same a lot of people want from their armies [ which more or less is legions , playing NL for NL and not a NL which is actualy BL] right ?

 

As the gods go . There is a difference between official and personal cult . A soldier would have to venerate all officialy accepted Roman gods , but on a personal level they would worship one [ mitra , sol invictus , generaly depands in which era we find this generic legionery] .

there is also the problem of w40k cosmology . now GW can do with it what every they want [and they do] , but even today chaos gods are not know for being non exclusive . Being buffed by many gods is something rare and special . Not that it doesnt happen of course .

There is of course the problem of game mechanics and the "real"w40k world . Are icons like banners , fetish objects that sometimes may give some boost or are they more like the holy arc , a living bridge to a chaos gods power ? if the truth is the first option then , yeah dudes can switch between icons without problem . But then they wouldnt realy give any buffs . Gods arent stupid[they are gods above mortals] . Why should khorn buff a dude that is going to do slaughter anyway , if the same dude can switch his icon and start buffing one of his enemies [aka his brothers]? now buffing a marked dude makes sense , power transfer[both ways] is easier , if dude suddenly decides to go AWOL he is dead [if he is lucky] , but buffing icon bearers ? It would make no sense [game wise it would rise the question , why do icons do anything then].

 

If option 2 is true , then we have the exclusivity problem . To return to the legionery example . If he gave worship to Apollo , Mars would not get weaker . their domains didnt overlap and even if they did , humans could make gods stronger/weaker . In w40k that is not the case. IF someone starts buffing tzeench then nurgle is getting weaker [and vice versa] . Getting weaker is not somethina god can go around .

So actualy there is a problem with a happy chaos family kind of worship . Doing khorn today, tzeench tomorrow and nurgle in a week shouldnt work . WB under 3.5 did make sense because they didnt worship a single god[and there are few more single worship things in the world then carring someones icon around] , they worshiped all the gods at the same time , not as khorn or tzeench , but as a power with different aspects. [no god gets more , all get equal power from WB worship , not totaly happy but ok with it].

[Khestra the Unbeheld]

I... I think this did it. The post that finally broke me.

 

Farewell, B&C. I'll always remember our sweet, sweet nights together. I'm going to go sit in a corner, rock back and forth, and whisper comforting things to myself.

 

Calm down, author, now is not the time for fear. . .that comes later. -_-

[totgeboren]

Well said Jeske. And as you said, it is important to take into account what the individual interpreter want to do with the background. What a writer wants to do with the background can be quite different from what a gamer wants to do with it. Too much restrictions can spell the death of creativity, so I fully understand that someone who writes within the setting prefers the boundaries to be set loosely. This can sometimes end up really bad (Gotos backflipping Terminators and braying eldar for example), but can also end up really good (like A D-Bs works).

 

What ideological/theological teachings your own warband uses is entirely up to you collecting your warband to decide. I for example is an 2ed/3ed WB puritan, but still use marks for count as, letting their rules simulate some in-game effect. (Like the MoT on a Lord with a daemon weapon to represent a Dark Apostle with his accused crosius and daemon possessed book of Lorgar).

 

Using Icons of the different gods is entirely fine for the WB from one reading of the background, but somewhat iffy from another. I would draw the line at using Cult troops, unless you use them as count-as. I mean, the IA article for the BL made it a big deal that they of all the legions had the means of creating true Cult legionaries of all the Gods, indicating that becoming say a proper Berzerker required more than just the favour of Khorne, it required the psycho-surgery the WE are famed for. Becoming a Plague Marine in the same way also required some very specific rituals, more than just having the favour of Nurgle. I also indicated that the other Legions did in fact not have access to their own Cult troops (except the big four, who were made up entirely of their god-specific legionnaire of course).

 

I don't know if I really like this, but that's the way it was. Nowadays, I think an AL warband with Plague Marine AL troops lead by a AL DP with the mark of slaanesh and lash would be entirely fine. It would not be a typical AL warband, but the galaxy is a big place, and anything can and will happen.