The Relic

[J!MM!L!C!OUS]

Hi there,

 

Title says it all really. I must have played 6thEd about 20 odd times so far and a good few of them have been 'The Relic' as it seems most fresh. However, in my experience it's nigh on impossible to actually move the relic anywhere due to the fact that you can only pick it up at the end of the MOVEMENT phase if you have a model in base contact.

 

So lets see, in a vacuum thats 1 turn to get near the relic, 2 turns to get to base contact, and on turn 3 you can move it.

 

Sounds good in theory, however your opponent is doing the same thing so actually on turn three you have CC erupt. Lets say the model holding the relic dies (he's apt to be targeted as a priority) If someone is lucky then they win the CC on turn 3 and then move up to D6 getting back in base contact with the relic, however, on turn 4 they have to wait until the end before they have officially picked up the relic, which means it's turn 5 before they can move it (assuming there's not another wave of CC to deal with) by which point the game could be over.

 

I like the idea of being able to carry objectives, but the Relic just doesn't seem to work in that respect for two reasons:

 

1: Everyone is going after the same objective

2: You can only pick it up at the end of a movement phase and not whenever you just happen to be in base contact (EG as a result of consolidation, or running)

 

What're your thoughts?

[MagicMan]

Ive managed to move it before, but that was against a shooty-orientated Tau army.

 

 

At the end of the game my plucky Sergeant carried the Relic back to my own board and hid behind a building, he was the last man left alive in my force, and my opponent had two broadsides left in a bastion. No real chance of them getting it back...

 

They did blow up the building he was hiding behind on the last turn, but he survived the cascade of rubble!

 

 

Fun game though, that Sergeant is definitely getting a purity seal or something...

[Jaigo]

Had trouble with this with playing against Eldar, those jetbikes can move like 48 inch, then take their time moving 6 inch with the relic.

[Morollan]

Why move it? Don't you just need to have it in your possession at the end of the game?

[Jaigo]

To avoid it being taken from you. Staying alive while you have it is something to aim for.

So cover or support is needed.

[MagicMan]

Yeah, but being able to move it to a more secure position can help you achieve that objective.

 

 

Its easier to hold onto the Relic with a squad holed up in cover than one that sits in the middle of the battlefield.

[Morollan]

To avoid it being taken from you. Staying alive while you have it is something to aim for.

So cover or support is needed.

 

Whenever we played the Relic has always been placed in some sort of terrain or cover so I've just moved a couple of units into the middle, one of them takes the relic, the other shields them from assault and then wait out the game.

[rpnightsend]

To address the OP, I feel like moving the relic is supposed to be more of a novelty then integral part of the mission.

Looking at the rules for moving the relic themselves, its not supposed to be going very far, and I think the main point of the mission is to turn the middle of the board into a killing field (A goal that I think it accomplishes admirably).

That being said, moving it does become an interesting part of the game, as Magic Man said, and favors slightly more mobile armies over gunlines. So it also accomplishes the goal of having a mission that slightly favors mobility over sitting on objectives (yay).

But I just don't think that moving the relic was supposed to be a huge part of the mission.

[J!MM!L!C!OUS]

To address the OP, I feel like moving the relic is supposed to be more of a novelty then integral part of the mission.

Looking at the rules for moving the relic themselves, its not supposed to be going very far, and I think the main point of the mission is to turn the middle of the board into a killing field (A goal that I think it accomplishes admirably).

That being said, moving it does become an interesting part of the game, as Magic Man said, and favors slightly more mobile armies over gunlines. So it also accomplishes the goal of having a mission that slightly favors mobility over sitting on objectives (yay).

But I just don't think that moving the relic was supposed to be a huge part of the mission.

 

I agree, the relic turns the centre of the board into a killing field. I reckon there should be an addition mission which combines the relic with that mission where there's several objectives each worth different points B)

 

Edit* possibly even some sort of capture the flag based game where you have to get stuff back to your own base :)

[egon1six]

I have used a combat squad with rhino or razorback to snatch the relic and then use the rhino to block LOS to the guys carrying it back to the lines. Your enemy has to choose to shoot said rhino or manuever into a better firing position.

[ShinyRhino]

They did blow up the building he was hiding behind on the last turn, but he survived the cascade of rubble!

 

How'd they do that? IIRC, you can't shoot or assault unoccupied buildings or fortifications.

[MagicMan]

It was a Bastion, the thing with a bunch of heavy bolters. Maybe that makes a difference?

 

Tbh it was both of ours second new edition game, could've gotten it wrong. Made for a pretty cinematic ending though. :)

[The Emperor's Champion]

Beware of devious Necron players.

A few of us discovered a RAW(almost certainly not RAI) way to get the Relic clear across the board without actually involving "movement" of any kind.

I'm not going to say what it is (because the less people who know that this is something they can do, the better), but you should be wary of crafty Necron players in "The Relic" games nonetheless who may have discovered it.

 

 

Also something to consider (and potentially another way the Necrons can just effortlessly steal Relics), what happens if a unit teleports with the Relic? They don't move in inches at all. They just vanish and reappear elsewhere. Depending on how you actually understand the game mechanics of teleporting, that could be another RAW way to do it....and Necrons can do a fair amount of teleporting if they really want to.

 

 

For Marines, I imagine that Scouts in Land Speeder Storms may be the fastest way to claim the Relic, and one of the units with the USRs to make them better able to run away with it.

[Jaigo]

any movement beyong 6 inch will make you drop the relic.

Teleporting and such will make you drop the relic

 

As with the eldar jetbikes, they can get there fast but are restricked to 6 inch movement if they want to go anywhere.

 

I do like the idea of using a tank as mobile cover. Will try that next time if oppertunity arrises

[The Emperor's Champion]

any movement beyong 6 inch will make you drop the relic.

Teleporting and such will make you drop the relic

 

As with the eldar jetbikes, they can get there fast but are restricked to 6 inch movement if they want to go anywhere.

 

I do like the idea of using a tank as mobile cover. Will try that next time if oppertunity arrises

That's just it. Teleporting doesn't involve moving a distance in inches. But I can see the argument, so that's fine.

The other Necron trick involves not moving at all. Not anything that counts as movement. Not Deep Striking, not Running in the shooting phase, or even charging in the Assault phase. Nothing to do with the Movement phase.

[ShinyRhino]

Don't all of the teleport powers involve a description of movement range maximums? I know Gate of Infinity says to pick a poitn within 24" of the starting point.

I feel it would be tuogh to argue that a unit that has been removed from one point on the board and then placed in another as not having moved.

[spartan249]

I have a specific method laid out for the relic missions now. I essentially make a conga line of knights from the middle to the end of the table, give a squad a Scout move (via GS), then claim it T1. I then pass the relic from the front guy to the back guy, who then drops it right next to the next squad in line. The other squad picks it up, passes it to the rear member, drops it, and so on until I reach the end of the conga line.

 

Whoever is in front dies a horrible death, but at least the relic is in my home field T2/T3.

 

Granted, this only works if I go first, but whatever.

[breng77]

There are plenty of ways to claim the relic turn 1 and get it moving.

 

1.) Drop Pods

2.) Rhino lined up at the edge of deployment (in 2 of 3 deployments) move 6" disembark 6"

3.)Scoring bikes/jump infantry(bikes are especially good, due to 6" move during shooting as well.)

 

As for the necrons I can see 2 ways that could be considered, but I would have to look at the Relic rules (if they say the relic cannot move...., then they probably don't work despite not using the word move.)

[Axagoras]

I have a specific method laid out for the relic missions now. I essentially make a conga line of knights from the middle to the end of the table, give a squad a Scout move (via GS), then claim it T1. I then pass the relic from the front guy to the back guy, who then drops it right next to the next squad in line. The other squad picks it up, passes it to the rear member, drops it, and so on until I reach the end of the conga line.

 

Whoever is in front dies a horrible death, but at least the relic is in my home field T2/T3.

 

Granted, this only works if I go first, but whatever.

The relic can only be passed to a friendly model once per movement phase, so no conga lines

[spartan249]

Exactly true. I only ever expend one pass in that squad, as the rules say. So I claim it T1, pass it off to the back guy, who subsequently drops it as far back as possible. This translates to about 7 inches of displacement. Next turn, conga line member 2 grabs it, passes off to rear member, drops it. Hence, relic in my field T2/T3. This is especially funny since there is no limit to how far away the passes has to be from the passer.

[Axagoras]

Exactly true. I only ever expend one pass in that squad, as the rules say. So I claim it T1, pass it off to the back guy, who subsequently drops it as far back as possible. This translates to about 7 inches of displacement. Next turn, conga line member 2 grabs it, passes off to rear member, drops it. Hence, relic in my field T2/T3. This is especially funny since there is no limit to how far away the passes has to be from the passer.

The model is passes to has to be in base contact with the model holding the relic to do the pass.

[spartan249]

Geh, I suppose it would do me some good to look the rules over more thoroughly. I think I can still do basically what I've been doing with a few modifications. Not as speedy, but only slightly.

[J!MM!L!C!OUS]

Geh, I suppose it would do me some good to look the rules over more thoroughly. I think I can still do basically what I've been doing with a few modifications. Not as speedy, but only slightly.

 

Nope, its can only be passed once per turn and only on to a model in base contact. So unless you have some troops with massive bases, your method will have the relic moving about 6" :)

 

In conjunction with that, you'll still get assaulted, and that will mean that the model in that unit holding the relic will lose ground when he makes his 3" pile in move towards the enemy at initiative.

 

Still falls under my original problem I'm afraid, that you can get to the relic, but it's then very difficult to move it anywhere.

 

The closest solution I've seen so far is as someone sugested, using a single drop pod, has to deploy on your first turn so you can just disembark into base contact. then turn two you can start moving it. Ofcourse this is still buggered if your opponent has any fast attack units... :(

[breng77]

Actually scoring bikes are the best method. Move 12" claim relic, during shooting move 6" away, pass back (bikes have big bases.) then move 12" per turn (6 in move and shooting)

[spartan249]

Geh, I suppose it would do me some good to look the rules over more thoroughly. I think I can still do basically what I've been doing with a few modifications. Not as speedy, but only slightly.

 

Nope, its can only be passed once per turn and only on to a model in base contact. So unless you have some troops with massive bases, your method will have the relic moving about 6" <_<

 

In conjunction with that, you'll still get assaulted, and that will mean that the model in that unit holding the relic will lose ground when he makes his 3" pile in move towards the enemy at initiative.

 

Still falls under my original problem I'm afraid, that you can get to the relic, but it's then very difficult to move it anywhere.

 

The closest solution I've seen so far is as someone sugested, using a single drop pod, has to deploy on your first turn so you can just disembark into base contact. then turn two you can start moving it. Ofcourse this is still buggered if your opponent has any fast attack units... :lol:

 

Let's do some grade school arithmetic, shall we?

 

Draigo & Friends scouts forward 6". Draigo & Friends moves forward 6" and claims relic, with Draigo bearing the relic. He then passes it to the apothecary, who will be right behind him. There's about 3 inches right there if the apothecary somehow drops it. Chances are Draigo & Friends is not going down T1 (Supporting forces will fight to ensure that). T2, unit moves 6" back, Apothecary passes off to another paladin, then Paladin drops it 1" away from himself. That's 6" + 1" + 1", so 8" total displacement from original position. At this point, that's 11" total displacement, at which point the strike squad can take stewardship and continue running around, putting the PalaShield between them and serious threats.

 

This gets more interesting with a Dreadknight I have given scoring status. Position the base lengthwise (~4"), jump forward T1, grab relic, then drop it behind him immediately. That's 5" straight from start, right into the hands of Draigo & Friends or one of my numerous strike squads (Depending on which list I'm playing). Mr. Dreadcarriage will probably die a horrible death, but at least I have the relic. Shiny.