Angron's personality

[Arachnid99]

I agree from a rational 2012 perspective Angron is unfit for command, in fact he's an immediate discharge, but remember 2 things.

 

First of all this is a universe where charging the enemy machine gun nest with a chainsaw is a viable tactic and Angron is pretty damn amazing at it.

 

Secondly he's connected, he's the Emperors son, how many parents do you know who have complete horrors as kids but think the sun shines out of their bratty arses? Big E probably thinks Angrons just got a bit of a temper but he wouldn't really hurt a fly.

[jeremy1391]

I agree from a rational 2012 perspective Angron is unfit for command, in fact he's an immediate discharge, but remember 2 things.

 

First of all this is a universe where charging the enemy machine gun nest with a chainsaw is a viable tactic and Angron is pretty damn amazing at it.

 

Secondly he's connected, he's the Emperors son, how many parents do you know who have complete horrors as kids but think the sun shines out of their bratty arses? Big E probably thinks Angrons just got a bit of a temper but he wouldn't really hurt a fly.

 

QUOTED FROM A VERY SECRET GW SOURCE :)

 

BIG E: "Now Angy I know that the bad man needed to be purged but son you cant go around getting your pretty suit of armor covered in blood! Go to your room and think about what you have done..."

 

Angy: "BUUUUUTTTTTT DAD!!!!! UGH I HATE YOU!!!!!! KHORNE UNDERSTANDS ME!!! I WISH HE WAS MY DADDY!"

 

and thus the world eaters fell to chaos.

[A D-B]

LOL, I recovered from my chaos addiction of World Eaters and Emperors Children after the 3.5 dex. But I mean really is the Emperor that blind? I am a SSG in the real army and just the tactics used by the world eaters under Angron and the sheer amount of casualties sustained should be cause for him to be relieved of command. Honestly Khârn pre-betrayer should have been kept in charge and Angron should have been used as a terror weapon..... Just saying.

 

There are a lot of instances in Black Library literature that make me Facepalm as much, if not more. Its amazing how Power Armored Soldiers became the bulwark of the Crusades instead of Shock Troopers, because...

 

**** it, Wine and Badgers.

 

You'd probably enjoy the setting a lot more if you looked at it as it's intended, rather than as an approximation of modern era warfare. The point of 40K is that mankind has come full circle, never to progress again, always to decay and suffer and die. The best we can hope for is stasis. Warfare has come full circle. It's back to armies grinding together on plains with swords and shields, or tank battalions in the streets of Stalingrad, or the endless tacticless meatgrinder of trench warfare, where you run in a horde to the other team's lines. History, especially the Great War and World War II are replete with exactly that kind of senseless, insane warfare. That's 40K.

 

The one thing I never understand is when soldiers (usually American, as it happens) complain about 40K tactics not matching real world tactics. Well, no. Why would they? It's not a failure of research - they're not supposed to resemble them. It's the Bronze Age and World War I in Space, dialled up to 11. It's not marching a vastly overpowering occupational force into a third world country (often to act as a police force) - which is what war has become in our generation.

[Demus Ragnok]

I need to catch up on my HH reading especially Angron the character fascinates me.

 

The short story where Angron and Khârn meet for the first time made me kinda feel sorry for Angron and I've been hooked on the character since.

[jeremy1391]

ADB Don't get me wrong there are many tactically sound characters in the Heresy setting, Corax is a big one, Dorn, Horus hell even Curze is like the 40K equivalent of the CIA or KGB. And I don't mean for you to take offense, I love your writing and Angron is a cool character he is just certifiably insane a true warrior yes but he just strikes me as unfit to command a legion. I have always felt this way since I learned about the implants in his brain.

[Raven Angel]

LOL, I recovered from my chaos addiction of World Eaters and Emperors Children after the 3.5 dex. But I mean really is the Emperor that blind? I am a SSG in the real army and just the tactics used by the world eaters under Angron and the sheer amount of casualties sustained should be cause for him to be relieved of command. Honestly Khârn pre-betrayer should have been kept in charge and Angron should have been used as a terror weapon..... Just saying.

 

There are a lot of instances in Black Library literature that make me Facepalm as much, if not more. Its amazing how Power Armored Soldiers became the bulwark of the Crusades instead of Shock Troopers, because...

 

**** it, Wine and Badgers.

 

You'd probably enjoy the setting a lot more if you looked at it as it's intended, rather than as an approximation of modern era warfare. The point of 40K is that mankind has come full circle, never to progress again, always to decay and suffer and die. The best we can hope for is stasis. Warfare has come full circle. It's back to armies grinding together on plains with swords and shields, or tank battalions in the streets of Stalingrad, or the endless tacticless meatgrinder of trench warfare, where you run in a horde to the other team's lines. History, especially the Great War and World War II are replete with exactly that kind of senseless, insane warfare. That's 40K.

 

The one thing I never understand is when soldiers (usually American, as it happens) complain about 40K tactics not matching real world tactics. Well, no. Why would they? It's not a failure of research - they're not supposed to resemble them. It's the Bronze Age and World War I in Space, dialled up to 11. It's not marching a vastly overpowering occupational force into a third world country (often to act as a police force) - which is what war has become in our generation.

 

My complaint is more on the level of tech not tactics though I must admit there are times when the tactics used torks me off; Taros being a great example. I guess my complaint would be that stagnate doesn't automatically translate into incapable or incompetent and that is quite often how it is played in the fluff. It just annoys me to no end.

[Wade Garrett]

A thought.

 

A lot of us have assumed Angron's original rebellion was something along the lines of Russell Crowe defying the corrupt regime of Johnny Cash in Spartacus, but it's entirely possible this wasn't the case. Remember, his entire army was made of guys trained from birth to kill and with tech crammed into their skulls that makes every moment they aren't chopping another living thing into tiny pieces agony.

It could very have well have been less "My noble kinsmen! Today we shall rise up against the hated nobility, for he who stands with me shall be my brother..." and more "Okay! This killing one another in small numbers in the arena is boring. What if we break out, and then we kill...EVERYTHING. Blood for....er...Skulls for....you know, I really feel like I'm missing something here. Oh well, maybe it'll come to me once we've killed every man, woman and child in a twelve mile radius."

[AGPO]

A thought.

 

A lot of us have assumed Angron's original rebellion was something along the lines of Russell Crowe defying the corrupt regime of Johnny Cash in Spartacus, but it's entirely possible this wasn't the case. Remember, his entire army was made of guys trained from birth to kill and with tech crammed into their skulls that makes every moment they aren't chopping another living thing into tiny pieces agony.

It could very have well have been less "My noble kinsmen! Today we shall rise up against the hated nobility, for he who stands with me shall be my brother..." and more "Okay! This killing one another in small numbers in the arena is boring. What if we break out, and then we kill...EVERYTHING. Blood for....er...Skulls for....you know, I really feel like I'm missing something here. Oh well, maybe it'll come to me once we've killed every man, woman and child in a twelve mile radius."

 

I really like this idea! It certainly explains why the Emperor didn't save Angron's rebels, as those psychopaths aren't the kind you want becoming marines. A Primarch however is too valuable a resource to pass up, and once he is in charge he sets about doing exactly what the Big E wanted to avoid.

[Kazak1920]

A thought.

 

A lot of us have assumed Angron's original rebellion was something along the lines of Russell Crowe defying the corrupt regime of Johnny Cash in Spartacus, but it's entirely possible this wasn't the case. Remember, his entire army was made of guys trained from birth to kill and with tech crammed into their skulls that makes every moment they aren't chopping another living thing into tiny pieces agony.

It could very have well have been less "My noble kinsmen! Today we shall rise up against the hated nobility, for he who stands with me shall be my brother..." and more "Okay! This killing one another in small numbers in the arena is boring. What if we break out, and then we kill...EVERYTHING. Blood for....er...Skulls for....you know, I really feel like I'm missing something here. Oh well, maybe it'll come to me once we've killed every man, woman and child in a twelve mile radius."

 

I really like this idea! It certainly explains why the Emperor didn't save Angron's rebels, as those psychopaths aren't the kind you want becoming marines. A Primarch however is too valuable a resource to pass up, and once he is in charge he sets about doing exactly what the Big E wanted to avoid.

Good point. It would be nice to have book about this. Something like "Descent of Angels", but in Angron's version.

[Rime]

In one of the HH novels didn't the opposition call an orbital bombardment down on Angron's head while he and his men were killing everything inside a fortification building? And Angron just crawled his way out of the rubble, yelling and screaming his head off... I wish I could remember the novel. It was a world when technology from the Age Of Technology was found. The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

[Gree]

The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

 

Or Kor Phaeron, Guilliman said Phaeron could have killed him.

[Rik Lightstar]

The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

 

Or Kor Phaeron, Guilliman said Phaeron could have killed him.

 

Did a thread not JUST get closed over that discussion, it's off topic, start another thread, we can talk about it there.

 

Rik

[Gree]

The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

 

Or Kor Phaeron, Guilliman said Phaeron could have killed him.

 

Did a thread not JUST get closed over that discussion, it's off topic, start another thread, we can talk about it there.

 

Rik

 

That's not quite the same. I was responding to the idea that only a Primarch could kill another Primarch. Even Guilliman flat out states that Kor Phaeron could have killed him, thus proving that assertion incorrect. I'm not sure what the issue is here.

[Rysaer]

This is probably going to sound strange but my opinion of Angron is quite similar but a little different to some posted here.

 

I agree, that my envisonment of Angron is 'The Hulk' with Chainaxes.

 

Although Angron to me does still have that Bruce Banner element, Angron is by no means stupid or foolish, he is just as capable as leading a force as any other Primarch, with the exception being that it is through a focused anger and a simpler aim.

 

Simply put, Angron calmly makes decisions on how to deploy/attack (although more based on close quarters obviously) with the Bruce Banner part of his brain. Then when it comes to the actual battle himself, he becomes 'The Hulk' his anger drives him to possibly do things a bit more foolhardy or rage driven.

[Lord_Caerolion]

The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

 

And whatever it is that killed Dorn (almost certainly not a Primarch though), and the Callidus Assassin that killed Konrad Curze, or the Grey Knights that banished Angron and Mortarion, and Guilliman getting taken down by an anathame, with Horus almost getting taken down by it. The Lion also got mortally wounded by Luther.

 

Actually, there've been a fair few non-Primarch inflicted death wounds to Primarchs. So, we've got 5 Primarch deaths/banishments by non-Primarchs, and two near-fatal blows (Horus and the Lion), compared to Ferrus getting killed by Fulgrim, and Sanguinius getting killed by Horus. I suppose we could also count Horus getting killed by the Emperor.

 

So, we've got 3 deaths by Primarchs, and 5 deaths and two near-misses by non-Primarchs.

[Wade Garrett]

Does Typhus unleashing the warp plague and torturing his Primarch and his Legion until they broke count?

[jeremy1391]

This is probably going to sound strange but my opinion of Angron is quite similar but a little different to some posted here.

 

I agree, that my envisonment of Angron is 'The Hulk' with Chainaxes.

 

Although Angron to me does still have that Bruce Banner element, Angron is by no means stupid or foolish, he is just as capable as leading a force as any other Primarch, with the exception being that it is through a focused anger and a simpler aim.

 

Simply put, Angron calmly makes decisions on how to deploy/attack (although more based on close quarters obviously) with the Bruce Banner part of his brain. Then when it comes to the actual battle himself, he becomes 'The Hulk' his anger drives him to possibly do things a bit more foolhardy or rage driven.

 

So Angron is like the red hulk, still able to think but still very much enraged...... I can dig it.

 

The only thing we've seen so far that can kill a Primarch is another Primarch.

 

And whatever it is that killed Dorn (almost certainly not a Primarch though), and the Callidus Assassin that killed Konrad Curze, or the Grey Knights that banished Angron and Mortarion, and Guilliman getting taken down by an anathame, with Horus almost getting taken down by it. The Lion also got mortally wounded by Luther.

 

Actually, there've been a fair few non-Primarch inflicted death wounds to Primarchs. So, we've got 5 Primarch deaths/banishments by non-Primarchs, and two near-fatal blows (Horus and the Lion), compared to Ferrus getting killed by Fulgrim, and Sanguinius getting killed by Horus. I suppose we could also count Horus getting killed by the Emperor.

 

So, we've got 3 deaths by Primarchs, and 5 deaths and two near-misses by non-Primarchs.

 

DORN IS NOT DEAD!!!!! I refuse to believe this, his body was never recovered so until GW says so then I refuse to believe it! (I discount the fluff from the book space marine) ^_^

 

So he is listed in my mind as missing in action, last seen aboard the sword of sacrilige.

[Lord_Caerolion]

Actually, I believe his body was recovered, the only point of contention is how much of his skeleton the Imperial Fists keep encased in amber, either being his whole skeleton or just the hands, depending on the source.

[Apothecary Vaddon]

The Lexicanum says it's just his fist, and the less-reliable and rarely-in-text-cited WH40k wikia says we only know the fate of his fist.

[Grey Knight Purifier]

Dorn is running around somewhere, with big freaking chainswords grafted to his hands. Fluff says they have his armor, and his hands. Space marine armor is sealed, and we have no way of knowing, short of Lysander cracking that amber open, whether we have a dead Primarch or not.

[Lord_Caerolion]

we have no way of knowing, short of Lysander cracking that amber open, whether we have a dead Primarch or not.

 

You do know amber's see-through, right? Also,

The Chapter's Chief Librarian found his Primarch's body on the bridge in a chilling reprise of Dorn's discovery of the wounded Emperor, and bore him away before the stricken flagship escaped back to the infernal depths of the Eye of Terror

IIRC the Index Astartes article also mentions that his body was found, not merely his hands, although I no longer own that book, so I can't check.

[Grey Knight Purifier]

Yes...and it is molded around the Armor, not the Body. For all we know, the suit of armor could be empty.

[Lord_Caerolion]

Check my updated post. Sources say they found his body, not just his armour. Secondly, Lexicanum states that his skeleton is encased in amber, that's contoured to form a sculpture of him. It's not his armour encased in a rough chunk of amber. Do you have any sources stating that it's just his armour?

[jeremy1391]

That fluff is from the old space marine book, which I think has been retconned. It also says in that book that upon completion of becoming a space marine each marines family is sent a certificate saying their son has become a marine...... I find that pretty outlandish because they recruit from all over the Imperium would be kind of hard to send a certificate across the galaxy to say "Joe Snuffy" is now a marine.

[Lord_Caerolion]

That source from Rites of Battle hasn't been retconned though. I'm still yet to see any source suggesting it's just his armour. Rites of Battle explicitly mentions his body.