Smurfalypse Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Howdy howdy. Haven't seen many battle reports up lately and figured I would break the ice since everyone seems to be waiting for the new CSM Codex to get announced. Played a buddy of mine at a local gaming store, 2k pts DA+IG vs Word Bearers+Daemons. Mission: The Relic Deployment: Hammer & Anvil CSM Warlord Trait: Target Priority DA Warlord Trait: Conqueror of Cities CSM ARMY LIST HQ Daemon Prince w/wings+doombolt (rolled up The Puppet Master) Khorne Herald on a Chariot w/Unholy Might+Fury of Khorne (Using a Skaven Doomwheel as a proxy currently, THE SHAME!) ELITE Terminators x10 IoCG+x8 combi-melta x2 Champion w/Reaperautocannons+Power Fist x4 Power Mauls, x4 Power Axe CSM x10 Champ w/Power Maul+Melta Bomb IoCG+x2 melta-guns Rhino CSM x10 Champ w/Power Maul+Melta Bomb IoCG+x2 melta-guns Rhino Obliterators x2 Defiler Plaguebearers x7 Screamers x9 (Still putting together and painting my screamers, so using my old 4th ed Flamers for the job currently.) Fiends x6 (Going to wait for some plastic model to come out before i buy these. Using my Daemonettes on Steeds as a fill in, sorry) DA ARMY LIST I am not sure 100% what he had off of the top of my head but i will list what i remember. Belial Librarian x3 Five man TH+SS Terminator Squads x10 Tactical Marine Squad w/rhino x1 Dreadnought in a drop pod x1 Valk x10 IG Veterans w/melta bombs+demo charge. They were in the valk x1 Primus Psycher That is all i remember off hand, he may have had more. This is how the table was set up. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_18-50-00_827.jpg This was deployment. I set up to so that my Terminators would be able to soak any fire coming from the DA, though he doesn't have much I wanted a cover save if a stray Krak Missile hit a Rhino. He deployed opposite of me, literally on the opposite side of the map. Probably wanted to put as much distance between himself and the first turn summoned Daemons. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_19-25-39_724.jpg My first turn. I moved up in a straight line basically, keeping my important Rhinos behind my wall of 2+/5++. My primary force of Daemons did come on Khorne Herald on a Chariot and my Screamers of Tzeentch (Khorne Herald on a chariot - no model for this yet, so using a Doomwheel in the meantime. . . DONT JUDGE ME!). The Screamers scattered to an area where the Land Raider filled with an angry Belial would be within charge range on the next turn, so they turbo boosted to the other side of the map like real men. He moved forward toward the objective as well. Though my Reaper Autocannons inflicted three hull points to his rhino, and my Defiler took a pop shot at the unit that went to ground inside of the wreckage. The rest of his force was moving up like bosses and shooting missiles at stuff. My Screamers took two wounds and lost one, the Khorne Herald took a wound as well, other than that I was unscathed. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_19-49-04_589.jpg Second turn. B) gets real! The rest of my army came on this turn, Obliterators, Fiends, and Plaguebearers. I put the Plaguebearers in his deployment zone inside of a building, because they weren't much use for anything other than a free victory point. The Oblits I placed six inches away from one of my rhinos with an icon inside, 12 inches of the Land Raider, one of my rhinos moved forward 6 inches, troops moved out of it six inches but were short by half an inch with their melta-guns. All in all I took 4 melta shots at the Land Raider and did not even inflict a single hull point :) The Gods are fickle my friends! My Herald of Khorne did his best Braveheart impression and charged the Land Raider. . .Nothing happened. Things were going much better on the other side of the map. My Daemon Prince and Screamers assaulted a unit of Thunderhammer+Storm Shield termies and were able to easily wipe them out before they had a chance to retaliate. I knew they were going to take a beating on his next turn though. My Fiends came in close to my Screamers and just did a run move forward about 2 inches. On his turn he bit into my Screamers with the Tact squad, and the other unit of Terminators. The Screamers were good on their saves and I took two wounds, killing one poor manta ray. He then assaulted with second unit of TH+SS terms, however the Screamers again proved their worth and inflicted about 15 wounds, combine that with a bad round of saves and the termies were removed before they had a chance to attack. It wasn't all bad for the DA player however. His Dread decided the time was not right to enter the game, however the Valkyrie thought it was a perfect time to blow the crap out of some poor, innocent, sexy CSM unit who were all piled up just outside of their Rhino. The first missile shot scattered onto my Terms and killed one, the second one was a direct hit and killed 9 poor guys. He mopped the poor survivor up with some heavy bolter fire. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_19-48-55_848.jpg Third turn. Daemons proving their worth. . .This is where the game really went bad for the DA player. The Screamers mopped up the Tact squad hiding out in that rhino wreck. The Daemon Prince began to make his way over to the Land Raider and Belial, he had been up to this point forcing guys to shoot at each other with The Puppet Master psychic power. The Fiends made it to the side of the middle ruins, and held there to see if they would be needed anywhere. This is the moment that it all went sour for the DA. This is also why many competitive players loath the random charge length. Needing 6 inches to make it to melee with both my Defiler and Obliterators, the poor guy rolled up 5 inches. That very much sums up the turn. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_20-34-42_86.jpg Fourth and final turn. I now had the chance to take out Belial, but there was no way I was going to be able to do it with my average shooting so I had to throw everything at them. The Oblits moved closer, the Defiler moved closer, the Terminators moved closer. Shot everything (except the battle cannon from the Defiler, was worried it would scatter back onto my own stuff), two plasma cannons, termies used up all of their combi-meltas. I didn't make a dent, the few shots that did get passed the 2+/3++ didn't make it passed the 5+++ FnP. Then EVERYTHING assaulted Belial. Defiler went in first to soak up the little bit of overwatch fire he had, then the Oblits made it in, then the Terminators rolled a 12 for their assault range allowing most of them to make it into combat that turn. The Gods taketh my flour and sugar but giveth me back cookies! Delicious 12 inch Khorne assault cookies! The Khorne Herald charged in as well, cause he aint scared of nothin. . . Since the other side of the board was pretty much wiped of the DA all we had to handle was Belial and his ruffians. The Herald inflicted a few wounds and actually killed a guy, then the Terms with Power Mauls went, they inflicted a huge amount of wounds. I think it was about 10 or so, he lost a guy to this maybe however. Next was the Defiler, who managed to 1 shot poor Belial (DA player failed his Look Out Sir! roll, on a 1), after all of this we went to initiative 1. I had two power fists on my reaper autocannons, they also happened to be champions and I rolled up two sixes and took advantage of precision strike and laid those hits on the apothecary killing him. Between the terms power fists, power axes, and obliterators power fists, the DA unit was knocked down to a one or two guys. 710 points shot and assaulted Belial and his term squad and were not able to finish the job, though they did knock them down to a number that was easily going to be managed, the 2+/3++/5+++ really showed how strong it is in that fight. http://i508.photobucket.com/albums/s326/Smurfalypse/2012-08-21_21-09-17_3431.jpg At this point it was getting late and the DA player offered to call the game. We both agreed, packed up, and went home. We talked a little after the game and he isn't sure what he could do about the Screamers, in every game i play they seem to just be soooo strong. If you aren't a very very shooty army that can lay down a pile of small arms fire on them and knock them down to a manageable number, they are going to run through any unit they decide to lay their barbed tails on. If you think about it, the Daemon Prince + Screamers single handedly took out two units of TH+SS terms and a Tactical squad. That is about 350-375 worth of points on my end taking out about double that on his end, and controlling the other side of the board while 3/4th of my army was free to deal with Belial. I took more pictures but got tired of uploading them all, so tried to match up as best I could. If you cant figure it out, to bad. . .=x Again i apologize for the few "proxys" I have. It has been almost six years since I have cared about Daemons, so I am just starting to collect them again. 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hornywingythingy Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Wow, looks like a cool battle, though the terrain density seems low. Well done sir! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kierdale Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Congratulations on the win! A very entertaining battle report. One question: is that a Lego Christmas tree counting as the relic? :cuss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HJL Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 very nice, interesting tactic putting your terminators in front of your rhinos, thats something i havent tried and wouldnt even have thought about in 5th. is it a good idea risking your very expensive terminators as bullet shields for your cheep rhinos though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 Congratulations on the win!A very entertaining battle report. One question: is that a Lego Christmas tree counting as the relic? :unsure: LMAO as the DA players said "Santa is a heretic and must burn!" very nice, interesting tactic putting your terminators in front of your rhinos, thats something i havent tried and wouldnt even have thought about in 5th. is it a good idea risking your very expensive terminators as bullet shields for your cheep rhinos though? Yes, a few things dictated that for me. 1. 24" no mans land on this deployment meant that mobility was going to win this game. I was more mobile and able to swarm anything that came near the center of the table. If my rhinos had been popped on the first or second turn, that Valk would have come on and just went to town on the unit (battle cannon missile, 6 heavy bolter shots, 3 scatter laser shots per turn) and the unit would end up walking a very long way to the objective area. I did make the mistake of getting one of my CSM units out of their rhino to take some shots at the land raider thinking that 4 melta shots would kill it. . .I didnt kill it, the valk came on and wiped the squad though it did use both of its missiles. 2. He had no long range AP2 weaponry. Everything that was AP2 was melee or 24" range, and even that was only two or three total. So i was going to get my 2+ saves as i kept my troops screened. 3. I wanted to pop his rhino badly. It was my first target as I wanted to limit his mobility and i knew I couldn't do anything about the land raider from long range, so I used my reapers and brought it down. If they had been behind my rhinos i may not have had range or line of site (it was already tricky as i shot through some ruins to get it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Looks like a good game. Question though, why were the screamers so good? Unless I'm thinking of a different unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 As of the daemon update in this past white dwarf, they've got three attacks each at reasonable strength with AP2, four on the charge. With a bunch of attacks and the ability to chew through even terminator armor at initiative, they're really something to be feared at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 Looks like a good game. Question though, why were the screamers so good? Unless I'm thinking of a different unit. As of the daemon update in this past white dwarf, they've got three attacks each at reasonable strength with AP2, four on the charge. With a bunch of attacks and the ability to chew through even terminator armor at initiative, they're really something to be feared at the moment. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HJL Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 it sounds like a good tactic if your opponent lacks ap2. i think ill try it out in my next game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Cool battle, but remember to read the Daemon FAQ. As you only have one daemon troop, I assume you used them as allies? If Daemons are used as a secondary detachment, the entire Daemon army count as being in the second wave. So no daemons first turn if you use them as allies for your CSM. They all arrive by normal deep strike in that case. And I must say I wonder if the idea behind Lamprey's Bite was for it to be like a grenade, only they forgot to write it? Only one extra powerful attack or three normal ones? As you say, they are silly powerful as it is, I would say slightly over the edge of being 'broken'. And as said, what does the rule "Daemon" mean? Fear and 5++? Deep strike, eternal warrior and Fearless? All of that? Nobody knows... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HJL Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Where did you read that an allied daemon army works like that...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Cool battle, but remember to read the Daemon FAQ. As you only have one daemon troop, I assume you used them as allies? If Daemons are used as a secondary detachment, the entire Daemon army count as being in the second wave. So no daemons first turn if you use them as allies for your CSM. They all arrive by normal deep strike in that case. And I must say I wonder if the idea behind Lamprey's Bite was for it to be like a grenade, only they forgot to write it? Only one extra powerful attack or three normal ones? As you say, they are silly powerful as it is, I would say slightly over the edge of being 'broken'. And as said, what does the rule "Daemon" mean? Fear and 5++? Deep strike, eternal warrior and Fearless? All of that? Nobody knows... I can't find it anywhere in the FAQ that the Daemons work that way. As far as I know you split up the daemon part of your army as you would a daemon army. The Lamprey's bite is posted like a melee weapon in the pamphlet, so I assume that it's supposed to be used like one. "Daemon" is stated in the codex to make their saves invulneable, as well as eternal warrior I believe. The "daemonic assault" and "fear" is FAQ:ed and is given to all models chosen from C:CD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 Cool battle, but remember to read the Daemon FAQ. As you only have one daemon troop, I assume you used them as allies? If Daemons are used as a secondary detachment, the entire Daemon army count as being in the second wave. So no daemons first turn if you use them as allies for your CSM. They all arrive by normal deep strike in that case. And I must say I wonder if the idea behind Lamprey's Bite was for it to be like a grenade, only they forgot to write it? Only one extra powerful attack or three normal ones? As you say, they are silly powerful as it is, I would say slightly over the edge of being 'broken'. And as said, what does the rule "Daemon" mean? Fear and 5++? Deep strike, eternal warrior and Fearless? All of that? Nobody knows... Had no idea about the deepstriking ally thing :) Good to know. As for the what "Daemon means", it is fairly simple. The FAQ changes some of the things and adds the Daemon USR, nothing says to lose it so you get both. It isn't a no one knows scenario, it is fairly straight forward. If you take it as they lose the Daemon stuff and only get the new Daemon USR, then they don't have to deep strike at all, since that is under the Daemon rules in the codex. Yeah Lamprey's Bite is nutter, but there also needs to be more than one thing in the codex that can take out armor 2 more readily than relying on the random rends. The biggest issue with the Screamers is how they come in, being able to turbo boost in the shooting phase after always ensures they are going to be in a good safe spot to strike from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 If daemons were supposed to come in turn 2 as a second detachment then that would leave the primary detachment seriously vulnerable. I don't think that's true, although as seen earlier with lamprey's bite, I need to reread the FAQ as I just glanced over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 Cool battle, but remember to read the Daemon FAQ. As you only have one daemon troop, I assume you used them as allies? If Daemons are used as a secondary detachment, the entire Daemon army count as being in the second wave. So no daemons first turn if you use them as allies for your CSM. They all arrive by normal deep strike in that case. And I must say I wonder if the idea behind Lamprey's Bite was for it to be like a grenade, only they forgot to write it? Only one extra powerful attack or three normal ones? As you say, they are silly powerful as it is, I would say slightly over the edge of being 'broken'. And as said, what does the rule "Daemon" mean? Fear and 5++? Deep strike, eternal warrior and Fearless? All of that? Nobody knows... Yeah, i just went through and read the Daemon FAQ and not one mention of the stuff you are talking about with the deep striking and not having the two separate waves. Where did you read that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circus Nurgling Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I don't think that's right. Allied detachments arrive according to their rules, so you would split up your Daemons force into two groups of equal numbers as normal, and half arrives via deep strike the first turn, half rolled on the reserves tables the subsequent turn(s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Sorry guys, my mistake. I could have sworn the FAQ said that a detachment chosen as allies from Codex: Chaos Daemon always came in one wave as normal reserves. I must have been dreaming. Well, that would make those new shiny Plague Bearers much more useful at least. :D At least Characters from CD cannot join CSM units, even though they are Battle Brothers. So it was something about allies and how they work in the FAQ. :cuss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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