Very short extract from Prince of Crowes

[Brother Captain Andrew]

Though, I do wonder at it. While I like to think I do a decent job of bringing my own take on the established lore, and flesh out a lot of the details in ways that's true to what came before, it's also fair to say that if I get hold of your Chapter/Legion, they're never going to come across as bombastically victorious as if another writer dealt with them, and there's a 90% chance in the story that they'll just lose. The Black Templars lose in Helsreach, though admittedly I didn't invent the storyline for that one. But the Cadians are

almost massacred to a man

in Cadian Blood. The Night Lords run from almost every single fair fight in the Night Lords Trilogy, the main character hates his Legion, and at the end

they're all killed

. Lorgar loses to Corax in The First Heretic, and the Legion is shown at its lowest, demoralised ebb.

 

If you look at Prospero Burns, Dan made the Space Wolves into the Emperor's executioner Legion - the guys made to kill other Marines. In The First Heretic, the Word Bearers are a Legion who don't even know their place in the galaxy. If you look at the Ultramarines Series, it's about a Chapter triumphing against the odds, on the grandest scale. If you look at the Night Lords Trilogy, it's about a handful of Chaos Marines that hate each other, whose ambition is just survive another few days. If you look at pretty much any short story or novella in the Heresy, it's about that faction winning against whoever they're fighting. But Savage Weapons - a Dark Angel story - is about the Dark Angels in a deadlock with the Night Lords, coming out of it slightly worse. Prince of Crows - a Night Lord story - is about the Night Lords Legion being annihilated by the Dark Angels, and the psychology in the aftermath of that defeat.

 

So, yeah, I always wonder if I'm a poisoned chalice. It's amazing to be told "I wish you'd do my favourite Legion", but it always makes me think "Why? Don't you want them to win? Ask Dan or Jim, instead."

 

Poisoned chalice might be a little harsh :D Its not so much that we want our favorite legions to lose, it is more that your characters are some of the best and most "Human" ones in the Heresy. IMO Sevatar, and Argel Tal and Aquillion rank up their with Loken, Garro, and Ventanus. If you were, by some miracle, to find a story you wanted to tell where the characters were to actually prevail characters with this type of depth are what we want our heros to be. Too often I think we see stereotypical or shallow characterization of loyalist legions and characters due to the fact we are seeing them in "battle books" where the focus is more on the legions being attacked (i.e. Know no Fear, Fear to Tread). I know that part of this is the due to the course of the Heresy as well as the Darth Vader Effect (Bad guys are always cool) but the depth given to the Traitors (First Heretic, Fulgrim, Horus Rising, etc.) leaves the loyalists clamoring for some similar development of their legions and Primarchs ;) .

[Baluc]

I know that part of this is the due to the course of the Heresy as well as the Darth Vader Effect (Bad guys are always cool) but the depth given to the Traitors (First Heretic, Fulgrim, Horus Rising, etc.) leaves the loyalists clamoring for some similar development of their legions and Primarchs :D .

 

I think part of that has to do with the loyalist are loyal because that's who's team their on. We have to know why the traitors rebel, from a perfectly decent galactic situation. Meaning the author has to show all those undesirable human qualities, that can spark a rebellion. Which "humanizes" these post-humans. I think the Khan might be the first loyalist to get the same treatment, of why he stayed loyal.

[Týr]

To ADB:

 

Do you regard the fact that everybody wants you to tackle their favorite Legion or Chapter as a honor (like King Aragon) or do you see it more as a burden you sort of wish you could lay aside (like King Robert Baratheon)?

 

In licensed fiction, it's about the highest compliment you can get.

 

Though, I do wonder at it. While I like to think I do a decent job of bringing my own take on the established lore, and flesh out a lot of the details in ways that's true to what came before, it's also fair to say that if I get hold of your Chapter/Legion, they're never going to come across as bombastically victorious as if another writer dealt with them, and there's a 90% chance in the story that they'll just lose. The Black Templars lose in Helsreach, though admittedly I didn't invent the storyline for that one. But the Cadians are

almost massacred to a man

in Cadian Blood. The Night Lords run from almost every single fair fight in the Night Lords Trilogy, the main character hates his Legion, and at the end

they're all killed

. Lorgar loses to Corax in The First Heretic, and the Legion is shown at its lowest, demoralised ebb.

 

If you look at Prospero Burns, Dan made the Space Wolves into the Emperor's executioner Legion - the guys made to kill other Marines. In The First Heretic, the Word Bearers are a Legion who don't even know their place in the galaxy. If you look at the Ultramarines Series, it's about a Chapter triumphing against the odds, on the grandest scale. If you look at the Night Lords Trilogy, it's about a handful of Chaos Marines that hate each other, whose ambition is just survive another few days. If you look at pretty much any short story or novella in the Heresy, it's about that faction winning against whoever they're fighting. But Savage Weapons - a Dark Angel story - is about the Dark Angels in a deadlock with the Night Lords, coming out of it slightly worse. Prince of Crows - a Night Lord story - is about the Night Lords Legion being annihilated by the Dark Angels, and the psychology in the aftermath of that defeat.

 

So, yeah, I always wonder if I'm a poisoned chalice. It's amazing to be told "I wish you'd do my favourite Legion", but it always makes me think "Why? Don't you want them to win? Ask Dan or Jim, instead."

 

 

For me I never really cared about the whole "Emperor's executioner" thing that can really gey everybody's blood pumping. I enjoyed Prospero Burns because it reinvented my favourite legion, and did it in a way that was very credible. It breathed new life into this legion. That was the big thing Prospero Burns really did.

 

I belive when people ask you to do their favourite legion, it's because they want their legion to be laid out as wicked badass. It's not about winning or losing. Heck it's the Heresy and we all know everybody ends up losing everything.

As I just wrote it's all about how your favourite legion come across. Not how much bolter-porn they can exercise in the course of 400 pages and if they end up winning the battle.

I think a lot of people don't care if their legions lose this or that battle, as long they get some punches in and are cool all the way through. Then they are allowed to loose.

You have done both with the Word Bearers and Night Lords. The reason people like them so much, is not based on what they achive but how they achive it. And how the journey towards their goals affects and changes them.

[Brother-Sergeant Bohemond]

I find the DA to be personalised, its just not a personality or trait the 21st Century is used to, or the large part of the population is used to.

 

The Lion and the Legion is shown to be Knightly, they are shown to serve their liege-lord unto death with failure not an option. This kind of attitude is no longer really in existence, it is the feudal Lord-Knight relationship.