Maj Tom Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Hello, I know I am not one to start threads, but I had an interesting conversation at my LGS. I was talking to the clerk about how I was glad the wound allocation rules had changed to stop paladins and Nob bikers from doing the crazy wound allocation that they used to. Then I was corrected and said that every Nob or paladin can make a look out sir save every time they are wounded to spread the wounds around. I submitted that that is not how it was meant to be, but he insisted that that was the conclusion of the 40k players of this locale because they went through the rule book "with a fine tooth" comb to determine the meta of this edition. I asked him to show me the wording in either the codicies in question or the rule book. A rule book wasn't available but apparently nobz are characters, like squad leaders and captains and the like. I agreed that a nob is like a sergeant in n ork boyz mob, but he countered and said that the nobz mob each count as characters. I have never come up against nobz in this edition, is this true? Or is my LGS going out of their way to re live the glory days of 5th? I am sorry about the example in question not being a power armored army, but I wanted to know and wanted to know what everyone's thoughts were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fury Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 unit type is listed in the rulebook appendix. Both nobs and paladins are characters. So yes both squads can do lame allocation shenanigans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warsmith Aznable Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 RAW say characters can get the Look Out Sir! save, and the rulebook says Paladins are all characters, so there you go. The only reason it sucks so much on the Paladins is because they are already frustratingly hard to kill, so letting them save crucial wargear with the LoS! save is just the foul icing on the crap cake that is playing against them. On the other hand, this is a rule that works for anybody, so my own Terminator squads can upgrade to all Champions and get the same benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azekai Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 The clerk is correct; paladins and nobz units are counted entirely as characters, as denoted in the 6th ed appendix. It is stupid, IMHO, but they can indeed do the magic wound shuffle on a 4+. I have no idea why they made these units count as characters, since it brings back the most irritating parts of 5th, but c'est la vie. On the other hand, this is a rule that works for anybody, so my own Terminator squads can upgrade to all Champions and get the same benefit. True, but I wonder how long that will last . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maj Tom Posted September 4, 2012 Author Share Posted September 4, 2012 Thank you for your fast replies. I really wanted to go all Phoenix Right on this guy. I really thought that these guys had studied and rules lawyered the crap out of the book. Regardless I am a tad disappointing that this still works that way. I guess my vindicator will be working over time at tournaments against these sorts of units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eberious Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Gah!, the bane of my game playing. I really only get to play against my mate who plays these foul creatures, and he always runs nobz. Usually 8, in a 1000pt game. Last game we played (2000pt) he run two groups one in mega armour (full unit) and another 7 on bikes. With that los "rule" it is so damn hard to take them out. Least to say I hate that unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Against these units, I just treat them as tanks and send Exorcists and Meltaguns after them. Instant Death simplifies things a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Lord Captain Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 But can a character use this rule? Surely the nobz are all equal in rank so why would they try and save a same ranked member of the squad? If this is indeed the case the rule should be changed to "look out mate". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Heresy Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Honestly I think this was one of those accidents that slipped through, but as it stands is perfectly rules legal. I wouldn't count on it not being FAQ'd at some point though, as it's very silly indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 I wouldn't count on it not being FAQ'd at some point though, as it's very silly indeed. Especially silly as, being Characters, all members of the squad get to allocate their wounds on a to-hit of 6 due to Precision Shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Last game we played (2000pt) he run two groups one in mega armour (full unit) and another 7 on bikes. IIRC, Mega Armoured Nobs are not characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexington Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 IIRC, at the GW Open Day this year, one of the designers said this wasn't intended, and that it'd get FAQ'd once they do a big update sometime near the end of the summer. Should be soon, then. 'Till then, take the game designer's advice and good common sense, and ignore that particular aspect of the new book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Heresy Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 The above post is good news if that's the case. My gaming club has hosue ruled it that the "character units" are only characters for the puposes of challenges for the time being...no "Look Out Sir" and no precision shots. Purely house rule ofc, but works for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rik Lightstar Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Actually, playing Devil's Advocate, I feel that Paladins without a doubt and potentially Nobs too, were pointed to allow for the fact that wound allocation was possible with them and they have left it in for that reason, and they should CERTAINLY count as Characters with regard to shooting! Rik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awfulawful Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 IIRC, at the GW Open Day this year, one of the designers said this wasn't intended, and that it'd get FAQ'd once they do a big update sometime near the end of the summer. Should be soon, then. 'Till then, take the game designer's advice and good common sense, and ignore that particular aspect of the new book. Played my first 6th ed. game with the GK codex last week, and my one squad of Paladins never took a LoS save. Shoot my guy twice, he's dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacinda Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Against these units, I just treat them as tanks and send Exorcists and Meltaguns after them. Instant Death simplifies things a lot. Played my first 6th ed. game with the GK codex last week, and my one squad of Paladins never took a LoS save. Shoot my guy twice, he's dead. I like Miko's way better ^_^ One shot, one dead paladin; but you get to pick the model that dies on a 4+ I have seen Draigo eat a few melta hits like this since it only costs him a wound and I'm fine with this. Otherwise, S8 AP1 = dead paladin. Put another way, you can get vehicles with fewer points than a typical paladin or mega-armored nob. When going against them, small arms is not enough. You need some anti-materiel weapons. If you hit them hard enough and wound allocation is no longer a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Heresy Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 So yeah, that was fast. Character units have much less scope for Look Out Sir lameness now in todays FAQ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacinda Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 So yeah, that was fast. Character units have much less scope for Look Out Sir lameness now in todays FAQ! That and they are no longer character units, either They fix the 'sloitz :P They nerfed the nobz :) I have yet to make up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Either way is has certianly taken some of the character out of the "hero" units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Heresy Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 So yeah, that was fast. Character units have much less scope for Look Out Sir lameness now in todays FAQ! That and they are no longer character units, either They fix the 'sloitz :) They nerfed the nobz :( I have yet to make up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Either way is has certianly taken some of the character out of the "hero" units. If by that you mean they no longer win games single handed, then yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 If these units get nerfed for their lookout sir roll, I hope their points drop accordingly. It would be a shame for GW to only half resolve the issue. Having said that, GK sales would drop through the roof. And it will be the shortest resurgence of ork biker lists ever :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexington Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 I don't think there's any realistic analysis that can show Paladins, Nobz or Wolf Guard to be priced "for" wound allocation shenanigans. They were abused in an exploit of the rules that the designers didn't account for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azekai Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 If these units get nerfed for their lookout sir roll, I hope their points drop accordingly. It would be a shame for GW to only half resolve the issue. Having said that, GK sales would drop through the roof. And it will be the shortest resurgence of ork biker lists ever The points cost for the former 'all-character' units won't drop- they were nasty before 6th, and were ungodly powerful before the FAQ update; neither of those facts changed their value. Editions change, and point costs stay the same, for better or for worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacinda Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 If these units get nerfed for their lookout sir roll, I hope their points drop accordingly. It would be a shame for GW to only half resolve the issue. Having said that, GK sales would drop through the roof. And it will be the shortest resurgence of ork biker lists ever :tu: Schadenfreude. I haz it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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