GK psykers cheap trick!

[Kingkaneda]

Ok so my opponent uses henchmen psykers to throw STR 10 AP 1 large blasts in my face. No problem I just shoot them to pieces, right? RIGHT?! Oh wait he puts 1 psyker in the window of a ruin and the rest of the squad hides behind a wall? So when you shout at them you can only kill the 1 psyker that you can see? And next turn 1 of his coward psykers comes to the window and shoots a STR 9 AP 1 big blast? OH GREAT! So basically I cant really stop his psykers within 5-6 turns? Can anyone find rules to destroy this annoying formation? Does any of you use this trick? How does your opponent feel about it?

[carnosaur93]

damn that is cheesy... now we all know what Gandalf meant by "conjurer of cheap tricks!"...

[Raeven]

Easy. Don't walk in front of that window. :)

[puffin]

Use a blast template yourself. The FAQ has clarified that all models under a template are hit regardless of it they are in LoS (you just need to see the model you place the template over).

 

Some people will now respond saying that the rule says you can hit models out of LoS but not assign wounds to them, but these people are the same ones that have since been overruled by the FAQ about signums, assault vehicles, unwieldy, pile-in, etc and you should learn the lesson of obviousness over deviousness as it applies to 6th Edition.

[Kierdale]

Whirlwind, Thunderfire cannon or up close and personal with a flamer.

And perhaps something a little harsher than shouting at them :)

[Gentlemanloser]

Use a blast template yourself. The FAQ has clarified that all models under a template are hit regardless of it they are in LoS (you just need to see the model you place the template over).

 

You still can't wound them. :o

[Seahawk]

Get around the side? It's just a wall.

[Lysere]

Ok so my opponent uses henchmen psykers to throw STR 10 AP 1 large blasts in my face. No problem I just shoot them to pieces, right? RIGHT?! Oh wait he puts 1 psyker in the window of a ruin and the rest of the squad hides behind a wall? So when you shout at them you can only kill the 1 psyker that you can see? And next turn 1 of his coward psykers comes to the window and shoots a STR 9 AP 1 big blast? OH GREAT! So basically I cant really stop his psykers within 5-6 turns? Can anyone find rules to destroy this annoying formation? Does any of you use this trick? How does your opponent feel about it?

 

Question: Does your army have the ability to make someone suffer perils of the warp? If not see about adding something in just for that. If a model suffers perils in that squad every psyker suffers it. So 1 perils of the warp wound and the whole squad is gone.

 

Also assaulting them works well, as do drop pods of cover ignoring fire.

[Ushtarador]

Use a blast template yourself. The FAQ has clarified that all models under a template are hit regardless of it they are in LoS (you just need to see the model you place the template over).

 

You still can't wound them. :(

 

So this big bad Vindicator shell exploded right besides my face but I won't get hurt because the driver couldn't see me? Every question they answered in the last FAQ was resolved towards common sense, and I will slap every opponent who claims otherwise in this case -.-

[Gentlemanloser]

Never siad it was they way I'd play it, or the way I tihnk it *should* work.

 

But currently, you're unable to wound targets out of LoS.

 

/shrug

[Lysere]

Never siad it was they way I'd play it, or the way I tihnk it *should* work.

 

But currently, you're unable to wound targets out of LoS.

 

/shrug

 

That is a discussion for another topic. (In fact that has already been discussed quite a bit)

 

Some people play it one way, some another. For me I'll play it the way that makes more sense. (My LGS does as well)

[Kingkaneda]

I was hoping for a rule that tells him it isnt allowed, but thanks for all the ideas. Yeah im actually thinking about getting a whirlwind, since it can aim at units outside its los. Is only going to hit once every 3 shots though, so it isnt a great solution. Getting around the wall and/or assaulting IS great, but takes about 2-3 turns. I used infiltrating scouts in my last game for a 2nd turn charge, worked out alrignht...not great. He has 10 paladins babysitting his psykers, autokills my scouts if he wishes to.

[dswanick]

I was hoping for a rule that tells him it isnt allowed, but thanks for all the ideas. Yeah im actually thinking about getting a whirlwind, since it can aim at units outside its los. Is only going to hit once every 3 shots though, so it isnt a great solution. Getting around the wall and/or assaulting IS great, but takes about 2-3 turns. I used infiltrating scouts in my last game for a 2nd turn charge, worked out alrignht...not great. He has 10 paladins babysitting his psykers, autokills my scouts if he wishes to.

So he's investing 600+pts into this one-trick-pony? Well with 36" range and hidding behind walls it would seem relatively easy to avoid his rather narrow killzone and win the game based on mission objectives. Failing that, invest 155pts in a Farseer w/Runes of Warding and a Guardian squad and laugh maniacally when his henchman psykers implode due to Perils of the Warp.

[Elric the Silvercoat]

It really should have been Heavy to stop this thing. Well just stop playing the guy if he is going to play cheesy tatics.

[Leonaides]

I was hoping for a rule that tells him it isnt allowed, but thanks for all the ideas. Yeah im actually thinking about getting a whirlwind, since it can aim at units outside its los. Is only going to hit once every 3 shots though, so it isnt a great solution. Getting around the wall and/or assaulting IS great, but takes about 2-3 turns. I used infiltrating scouts in my last game for a 2nd turn charge, worked out alrignht...not great. He has 10 paladins babysitting his psykers, autokills my scouts if he wishes to.

A whirlwind will actually hit something like 50% of the time (as in doesnt actually move the template) and even if it scatters a couple of inches you should still hit someone in the squad and hopefully cause a pinning test (does it still cause that?) or break test...

[spartan249]

Well... you could, you know, play the game.

 

Get creative. Codex Marines have all the tools needed to fight against and defeat stuff like this.

 

Bring some Drop Pods with Sternguard in them. These guys do multiple things: Paladins can either go on offense and risk getting flanked by a bunch of combi-meltas (twin-linked with Vulkan) which will basically mean instant vaporization, or they can hang back and cower in fear from the might of sternguard, which is all good for you as you drop on objectives in cover and hunker down. Furthermore, you actually spend about equal points to him in order to counter his big unit, so no big loss.

 

Fast units and flamers serve the same purpose, as Paladins will probably not be fast enough to get around terrain induced blind spots and prevent your fast units from reaching his henchmen from a compromising position.

 

Null Zone + Vindicators and other AP2 shooting are useful against just about anything, and is relatively cheap.

 

Whirlwinds have now become essentially an auto-include in C:SM armies now, as their new ability to snipe out heavys and sergeants is invaluable. No cover saves, no invul saves, and no armor saves = dead psykers every time you hit them with a whirlwind.

 

There's always a solution to problems like this. You just have to know your tools.

[Axagoras]

How do wirlwinds snipe out special weapons and sergeants

[BassWave]

Also remember to "Deny the Witch", sure you only stop the power on a six, but its better than nothing. Also, you need to just calm down and reevaluate your tactics. There are plenty of ways to counter this. Tell us your list and what exactly happens in your games.

[spartan249]

How do wirlwinds snipe out special weapons and sergeants

 

Let's go on a reading journey~

 

pg. 15 BGB, concerning allocation of wounds based on range from shooting unit.

 

pg. 34 BGB, second bullet point on Barrage.

 

Wasn't that fun? :devil:

 

As long as you hit on target, you hit what is closest to the center hole. A whirlwind hitting on target can easily mean 5-6 saves on Mr. Sergeant or Mr. Lascannon or whatever else it may be. Sniper scope equipped artillery, GO!

[*Furyou Miko]

Is the Whirlwind a barrage weapon or just a blast weapon? (I honestly don't know, not being a Space Marine player).

 

Also, if they're in a Building rather than a ruin, then laugh at them and blow the building up. Every time you glance it you'll drop bits of ceiling on the psyker's heads. Also you can fill the building with krak grenades on the assault for massive laughs. :P

[Lysere]

Is the Whirlwind a barrage weapon or just a blast weapon? (I honestly don't know, not being a Space Marine player).

 

Also, if they're in a Building rather than a ruin, then laugh at them and blow the building up. Every time you glance it you'll drop bits of ceiling on the psyker's heads. Also you can fill the building with krak grenades on the assault for massive laughs. :P

 

I prefer frags or the occasional flamer of some kind.

[Axagoras]

How do wirlwinds snipe out special weapons and sergeants

 

Let's go on a reading journey~

 

pg. 15 BGB, concerning allocation of wounds based on range from shooting unit.

 

pg. 34 BGB, second bullet point on Barrage.

 

Wasn't that fun? :angry:

 

As long as you hit on target, you hit what is closest to the center hole. A whirlwind hitting on target can easily mean 5-6 saves on Mr. Sergeant or Mr. Lascannon or whatever else it may be. Sniper scope equipped artillery, GO!

 

After i got off last night I saw that line in the barrage weapon profile, didn't want to get back online to edit my post lol

[Cerrik]

You can always deecide before game, that ruins don't block line of site... as models and vehicles can go right through supposedly solid walls. (Infantry are considered to have cut or knocked holes through the walls to move through, per BGB. And as I recall, vehicles can just move on through as if the wall was not even there. I think if troops can cut "holes" in the walls to get through, you can certainly shoot through those "holes". Ruins give a cover save, just like forests and you can shoot into forest.

 

Or you can try a more conventional approach and hit them with flamers, move around the wall under the cover of LOS blocking terrain, use GK of your own and hit them with Purgiation squad of Psycannons from 24" away- 16 S7 shots :blink:

[King Willy]

I always think people like this were :P at sports and made up for it with board and video games.

 

Anyway, the psykers a :tu: in CC get in and squash him with Assault squads or use something juciy like SS/TH termies to draw the fire, while the rest of your army moves in for the kill, People a so scared of hammernators they will ignore the three Rhinos full of dudes coming up the other side, or better off he'll split his fire, trying to kill the termies with the psykers and trying to glance one of the rhinoes to death.

 

Or use pods. lots and lots of pods, a whole army of pods, two come in first turn with sternguard and use dragonfire to ignore his cover or hellfire if he has Invuln then watch as his Pallies try to move in for a charge then bring in the rest of your army, preferably with Hammernators to block his charge, use the pods to set up an area of no scatter, force him to charge the hammernators or one of the sternguard squad, if he's stupid he'll multi assault, but I'd still rather risk 200 pts to over 300, the 3++ will save some and then drop the hammer on a couple for ID goodness.

 

If you lose chose to fail and run away, he in Termie so can't follow, They shall know no fear will pop your Termies back up for round two of CC, rip into him with the Sternguard and use any other squads to mop up what ever else he has the table, turn the storm bolters on the drop pods on the pallies. Clean up any remaining pallies with the Hammernators.

 

The psykers a nasty but not tough to deal with, he'll probably only have riflemen or small squads if he's using this many points, tableing him should be easy with some planning.

[Warprat]

Hmm, how bout this...

 

Your turn 1, you land a drop pod in front of his window. Unload the tactical squad and let fly with a combi-flamer, flamer, thrown frag grenade (through the window), bolter shots.