Dreadknight and his sword

[Reclusiarch Darius]

I may be missing something here, but why wouldn't Dark Excommunication work on a greater daemon?

 

DK already ignores 'Iron Hide'. Greater Daemons have 4++ that can't be negated (which will rob him of a lot of his potency on the charge), he only has a 5++ against their S6/7 AP2 hits. There are maybe a handful of relevant Gifts to close-combat that would be annoying for him to remove, but a Greater Daemon will still tear a DK apart. It's happened to me multiple times. They just always seem to have more attacks, more damage output, and that 4++ is really annoying (even with re-rolls from the greatsword, Tzeentch Princes still give me hell, not to mention Bloodthirsters).

 

I do think this FAQ ruling will go away in a future version of the FAQ. It seems terribly, terribly wrong.

 

I doubt it. If they're consciously spelling out that you get the bonuses from both with no drawback, I don't think they'll change it back. Anyway, DK still only has I4 and a 5++. I've been playing it the 'all the bonuses' way for a while now, most of my opponents have no issue.

 

It's no different than the illogical ruling that any two 'specialist' weapons grant +1 Attack for two melee weapons. So yeah, chainfist and lightning claw are just fine, pick which one you'd like at the start of combat.

[Morollan]

So yeah, chainfist and lightning claw are just fine, pick which one you'd like at the start of combat.

 

That's kind of the point though. With the Greatsword you don't have to pick. You get both at the same time. Completely illogical and goes against the rules for pretty much every other comparable situation that I've come across so far.

[DK1]

I may be missing something here, but why wouldn't Dark Excommunication work on a greater daemon?

 

DK already ignores 'Iron Hide'. Greater Daemons have 4++ that can't be negated (which will rob him of a lot of his potency on the charge), he only has a 5++ against their S6/7 AP2 hits. There are maybe a handful of relevant Gifts to close-combat that would be annoying for him to remove, but a Greater Daemon will still tear a DK apart. It's happened to me multiple times. They just always seem to have more attacks, more damage output, and that 4++ is really annoying (even with re-rolls from the greatsword, Tzeentch Princes still give me hell, not to mention Bloodthirsters).

 

 

Wait what? what gives a daemon a 4++?...they have a profile 5++ and i dont see a rule that says they have a 4++... also because the daemon prince can take that gift that gives him a 2++ vs force weapons the Dreadknight can drop that. Im my experince i have never had a Daemon beat my DK unless i was already locked in CC or he only had 1 wound left. The GS already gives rerolls to hit and wound so PE is usless, but the daemonbane is awesome. I have pulled ScarBrand off the table a few times because of bad rolls.

At the same time a DreadKnight i find is best used at range, in combo with Skulls he can lay down alot of firepower each turn, and the Heavy Gat can lay alot of saves on a Greater Daemon in one turn...with the help of a libby near by and a cast to reroll svs is going to take alot of wounds.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Wait what? what gives a daemon a 4++?...they have a profile 5++ and i dont see a rule that says they have a 4++...

 

Every Greater Daemon in Codex: Chaos Daemons has a 4++ save. Bloodthirsters have a 3+ Iron Hide armour save on top of that. Lords of Change (Greater Daemons of Tzeentch) have a 3++ save. Fatewaver has a 3++ re-rollable save.

 

Tzeentch-marked units get +1 to their existing invulnerable save. Ergo, Tzeentchian Princes have a 4++ save (and like the Bloodthirster, can get Iron Hide as well).

 

At the same time a DreadKnight i find is best used at range, in combo with Skulls he can lay down alot of firepower each turn, and the Heavy Gat can lay alot of saves on a Greater Daemon in one turn...with the help of a libby near by and a cast to reroll svs is going to take alot of wounds.

 

I'm sorry, I don't believe you. Not being rude or anything, but the psilencer and Gatling psilencer are the worst weapons ever created. Also, you're assuming you roll that Divination power. With Mastery 3 (expensive), you have decent odds, but its still random. I wouldn't base my strategy for murdering enemy MC's on 'I take the worst weapon in the codex, successfully fire it without getting charged first, and I get that exact power and Librarian in range to debuff as well'.

 

Dreadknights are melee beatsticks. PsyDreads are the shooty support unit. Trying to make a DK shooty support or a Dreadnought an assault unit is unwise. I've killed barely anything with the incinerator or heavy psycannon, but I've murdered countless squads and tanks with the greatsword. Likewise, I can count on one hand the number of kills my Dreadnought made back when I went one autocannon+DCCW. When I switched to twin autocannons, my Dread actually starting killing tanks and infantry at range.

[DK1]

Wait what? what gives a daemon a 4++?...they have a profile 5++ and i dont see a rule that says they have a 4++...

 

Every Greater Daemon in Codex: Chaos Daemons has a 4++ save. Bloodthirsters have a 3+ Iron Hide armour save on top of that. Lords of Change (Greater Daemons of Tzeentch) have a 3++ save. Fatewaver has a 3++ re-rollable save.

 

Tzeentch-marked units get +1 to their existing invulnerable save. Ergo, Tzeentchian Princes have a 4++ save (and like the Bloodthirster, can get Iron Hide as well).

 

At the same time a DreadKnight i find is best used at range, in combo with Skulls he can lay down alot of firepower each turn, and the Heavy Gat can lay alot of saves on a Greater Daemon in one turn...with the help of a libby near by and a cast to reroll svs is going to take alot of wounds.

 

I'm sorry, I don't believe you. Not being rude or anything, but the psilencer and Gatling psilencer are the worst weapons ever created. Also, you're assuming you roll that Divination power. With Mastery 3 (expensive), you have decent odds, but its still random. I wouldn't base my strategy for murdering enemy MC's on 'I take the worst weapon in the codex, successfully fire it without getting charged first, and I get that exact power and Librarian in range to debuff as well'.

 

Dreadknights are melee beatsticks. PsyDreads are the shooty support unit. Trying to make a DK shooty support or a Dreadnought an assault unit is unwise. I've killed barely anything with the incinerator or heavy psycannon, but I've murdered countless squads and tanks with the greatsword. Likewise, I can count on one hand the number of kills my Dreadnought made back when I went one autocannon+DCCW. When I switched to twin autocannons, my Dread actually starting killing tanks and infantry at range.

 

 

Well as for the dreadknight, they heavy psylancer always wounds daemons on a 4+ with 12 shots...i have never had less then 3 wounds on a flying Daemon, or layed in 5 unsaved wounds on a grounded daemon...as for believing me i could care less, i have found alot of success with the DK with range then CC when needed...i take him as a 305pts build and he has never failed me. the heavy psy and heavy cannon have wiped out its fair share of tanks and troops.

 

Also with the libby its a primis power to reroll to hit, also i have PE so re roll of 1s to wound and hit...i not sure how much you have expanded into other builds but the Dreadnought i take with plasma cannon and DCCW locked in a stormraven, he has earned quite a few medels with term kills and tank kills.

 

you dont have to be so aggressive with the "i dont believe you" everyone has a different style of play and likes different lists to be built around. that's the joy of this game, i have success with my style, im sure you have success with yours.

[boreas]

The DK can be a great fire support unit. I never, ever, take one without the incinerator. The ability to jump and wipe out anm IG heavy squad (be it triple lascannon, triple autocannon, etc) is priceless... If I know I'll be playing Orks (my main opponent plays Orks, Nids and IG), I put Incinerator and Heavy Psycannon. That'll kill orks so quickly it's not even funny!

 

Of course, the DK shines in CC (or, I should say "also shines..."). Jumping on a vehicles squadron and utterly destroying it is priceless. But trying different DKs, for diversity's sake (or just plain old non-optimizing!) is fun. It also prevent you opponents from going "Ok, yeah, that DK with jump and sword, I know...".

 

Phil

[DK1]

The DK can be a great fire support unit. I never, ever, take one without the incinerator. The ability to jump and wipe out anm IG heavy squad (be it triple lascannon, triple autocannon, etc) is priceless... If I know I'll be playing Orks (my main opponent plays Orks, Nids and IG), I put Incinerator and Heavy Psycannon. That'll kill orks so quickly it's not even funny!

 

Of course, the DK shines in CC (or, I should say "also shines..."). Jumping on a vehicles squadron and utterly destroying it is priceless. But trying different DKs, for diversity's sake (or just plain old non-optimizing!) is fun. It also prevent you opponents from going "Ok, yeah, that DK with jump and sword, I know...".

 

Phil

 

I agree...but i like the DK more at range just due to how hard it is to get into CC in 6th...cant outflank and assault (was my prefered way to attack in 5th) with GS...always is on your enemys mind of "how to deal with it" so CC with the DK is just hard to get...not bad tho, i have only lost CC to a squad of terms TH/SS...but short of that in all hes a beast...a friend of mine calls him the baby carrier...i broke his toys with the baby carrier