Failed Chapter master

[Jupiter Forge]

Ok... this is hard. I rushed it. To be absolutely honest this doesn't deserve to go in a hall of honor... but as it's as complete as I think I'm going to get it, here it is.

I took a half day off work, ended up not painting for most of it, and then got the idea to "try some more layering" then "try sand bases for the first time" and then the old "Oh hell, I have citadel varnish... lets give it a go". And to be honest I don't know if I like him as much as I was hoping; I didn't take as long on the paint job as I thought I should too, but I haven't put out an actual model for a while and wanted at least once do. Wow do I really not like that gloss varnish and I'm even considering going over it with another coat of black wash to see if it darkens because my oh my does it bring out the imperfections and my slovenly paint job; I don't think I'll be using that again! And the base, Jesus, looks pretty terrible. Will be practicing that. Saying all that though, the model itself doesn't look "too bad when not up close"... but for a piece I wanted to work, ended up terrible because of me rushing. So I learnt something there. And i just noticed the eyes... they'd need to be re-done, that was a terrible job. I actually painted more layers, thinned the paint, mixed some to make different shades, but in the end it looks worse than when I just paint out of the pot.

But here he is, my failed Crimson Castellans Chapter Master "Korealon". He's practice on how baddy someone can knobble an expensive miniature by doing a rush job and thinking "Meh, it'll look better in post production after some wash and varnish. He was originally going to be a Master of the Forge and the back was part of a conversion beamer and that was probably the best painted thing as I did it a few weeks ago; but put the part of the beamer on another miniature. I think I'd have been better off not "practicing" things on it. Also the conversion of the cloak took a while as it was my first time scrubbing off the DA symbol with a knife and file... wasted.

I also planned to do some conversion work on the backpack... but after this, i think I'll just leave it and move on to the next miniature.

Cheers for looking anyway (I seem a bit down about him don't I? Heck with it. practice is practice is practice and I have learnt a valuable lesson. The only nice thing I have to say about it, is that "It looks ok, in low light, when not under massive scrutiny.". So it's not all doom and gloom, at least I got a crack at the actual paint scheme I'm going to use for the Castellans),

J.F.

[Venemox]

Chin up, Bud.

 

You're doing something I'm not right now, and that's completing paint jobs.

[Jupiter Forge]

Haha, cheers... I guess I could look at it that way!

 

It's the only model I've completed so far this week; and it took me 4 hours in total including the shoddy base-work. I suppose as I was testing some new things I've not done before I can give myself a little leeway with it, but the fact that it was going to be my Chapter Master makes me think "Why, OH WHY!? Did I think I'll just rush through it?". But we live, we learn, we persevere and we move forward! <always motivational in the face of adversity>

 

Also one thing I can say, is that I'm no fan of almost one-piece models; this was All one piece aside from the head and backpack. All the models I've done before have been multi-part and I seem to do better painting when individually painting the pieces and then putting them together "after" they're done. And when I've painted some multi-part ones I assembled first... they look worse than the ones I didn't. So I think I'll go back to that unless really necessary. <looking at the Dark Vengeance models and my Grimaldus> Oh... deary me.

[Inquisitor Engel]

Completing paint jobs is always good. There's a good many of us that start and never finish. I bought 5,000 points of Imperial Fists in 2008 and I am STILL not done. ;)

 

My only advice would be to thin your paints. A bit of tile and a drop of water if you don't have access to a palette proper. It also looks like you might be using a single brush for all that, which I would recommend against. :lol: Yep. A palette and some more brushes will perk that head up. You're off to a great start! We all began somewhere!

[dizzy-xc]

Basic paint job is better than no paint job. PLUS, each paint job you complete makes you a better painter whether or not you learn what to do better or what not to do. Buck up. No one paints masterpieces the first few minis. It takes a lot of painting and a lot of watching tutorials to get better. Keep at it. You WILL get better. And besides... lol, it wont be too long before you buy some purple power and strip and repaint some of your better mash up jobs.

[Jupiter Forge]

Thanks all, appreciate the feedback. :woot:

 

@Engel - I was thinning the paint, but I'm guessing I wasn't thinning it enough. It did seem very watery but dried up pretty quickly; so I guess more thinning is needed and perhaps a wet-palette instead of just the basic one I'm using. I also was using more than one brush, but I'm just really heavy-handed. >.< (Good luck with the Fists if you're still going with them!).

 

@dizzy - Purple Power? I have never heard of that stuff but it has me interested, I shall investigate and perhaps strip it one day! (And I have done better than this before, not by much, but some things, so I'll just need to take more care).

 

@Cypher - Indeed, that does sound like a plan. The dry palette seems to dry-up far too fast for my liking so I end up having to mix more paint. Thanks for the link! :geek:

[Cypher 102]

You might want to try making a wet palette. It's very easy to make and use. It helps you keep your paints at the right level of watered down. I just started using one and it has already upped my level of painting.

[Larkyn]

Well, it doesn't look that bad. What color were you using for the red? I'd recommend one of the Base Paint reds, Mephiston or Khorne Red. Do two (maybe 3) THIN coats, and it'll come out looking good. And use Washes. I fraking love washes. They make the painting process so much easier, IMO.

 

Keep it up, and soon enough you'll be competing in the Golden Demon!

[J!MM!L!C!OUS]

Someone suggested a wet palette, I did a tutorial for making on on my signature that has served me well :cuss

 

But yeah, the guys are right in that a model painted is better than one left grey.

 

Something struck me in your OP, you meants to do him in an afternoon, but most of that time you didn't actually spend painting him? (Or something to that effect?) This could be a large contributing part of the problem. Take your time, do things in careful stages, paint with patience - I don't mean this to sound harsh but the mini above has rush job written all over it! :)

[Jupiter Forge]

@Warmaster - The Red was done by first applying a coat of Blazing Orange, then Blood Red, and finally a mix of Blood Red and Crimson Gore (I have the old paint set). I thought I'd thinned them down enough to do more transparent layers, but I was wrong. It came out just looking roughly like Blood Red. I'll try and thin them even more next time (and I'm going to go over that damn base in yellowy-orange paint and then wash it with sepia/mud so that it looks less like a grey-base with sand on it.

 

@J!MM - Cheers for the tutorial, same to Cypher; I will be making one of these when I can get hold of the bits for it (should be Wednesday). What i meant about painting him in the afternoon was "I took the afternoon and rushed the whole thing in that time"; if I was going for a Chapter Master I should have taken more time, been more careful on each stage, perhaps done some stages, left it, start another model, go back to him while that one's first stages are done, and so on so that I do it either in a day or work on it over a period of days so I don't get the "Rush... ALL THE STAGES!" feeling. And I agree with you; it is harsh... but it's fair, it is a rush job, which is why I'm so disappointed in myself.

 

Better model incoming sometime soon!

[Adeptus-Alaska]

I totally understand where you are coming from my friend. not a great paint job. there, I said it. BUT, it is a good paint job. especially if it's one of your first. if so, you are light years ahead of my first attempts. my first marine looked like I dipped it in the paint pot!

here are some suggestions I have learned the hard way;

1. google wet pallette, you won't be sorry you did.

2. check out les burton's aweome paintjob (just google it) he is on youtube as well.

3. offer to buy spare minis off other people, especially if you don't like the army or figure. painting a variety will challenge you in a way that youtube tutorial never will.

4. watch you tube tutorials, they do help.

5. buy GW's how to paint citadel minis book, it is jam packed with basic hobby and table top standard painting techniques. plus the DVD is quite nice.

6. if you can, track down GW's older how-to paint books. they seem to focus on how the 'eavy metal guys do it.

7. join a paint group/night in your area. if there isn't one, consider starting one. there is something amazing about a group of like minded individuals getting together to do what they love. and, humans are competitive by nature, so youll alll subconsciously push each other to improve.

8. find a painter in your area that you respect, ask him for help, most hobbyist are super nice. most of us would jump at the chance to help a beginner.

9. join compititions in your area. nothing forces you to perform like a deadline.

and finally, 10. make friend here, we are all retarded for this hobby and you will never lack for positive support.

 

now for a review of your mini. first, the color scheme has potential. I'm not a fan of purple, but that dosen't I don't respect your bold pallette. ballsy, don't lose your guts, ever. your brush control on the back is amazing. on the front, you seemed to lose it a little. don't fret, it takes time. all in all, you are off to a great start. keep at it.

 

I'm sending you a friend request. I like your potential. and I have a few resources you could use.

[Jupiter Forge]

@Furioso

 

And here's the kicker. It's not one of my first miniatures; ok, it's not been "many" past my first, but it's certainly a lot worse than the ones I've done before. Since I re-started the hobby I've done about 10 - 15 full figure paints (which may not sound like a lot, but when you work a lot and late... it feels like many more), and pretty much all of them aside from one have been better than this. Though I will admit, a lot of my time is spent not on painting but working out kitbashing things I want to do, bagging them up and then planning more. I think I'm more at home in front of my scrivener writing fluff and ideas more than I am painting. But I do want to improve that and even do a full army.

 

1) Yep, already done on the advice of others; I shall be making one this weekend. :(

2) Les Burton is great, I watch quite a lot of the youtube people (Les, Bluetable, TemplarsCrusade01, Mac, Ichiban, etc) - though all that's pretty much "Masterclass" standard and while amazing and interesting, not always good for someone at the stage I am.

3) As I said above, I have a lot of single figures ready to be cleaned up and painted. So I plan to do more practice work on them as soon as I can.

4) I do, but I still need to do a lot more practice.

5) Already got it, and it is a nice book!

6) Not sure if I have the old ones.

7) There is at the GWS near me, but that's during the day when I work.. and in French. I live France but don't Parlez the Francais too well. Though there are people where I work who play, so may see if they want to do something like that.

8) Good idea, I'll check with the people in 7 to see if there are any of them who could.

9) Don't think I'd be too good at that, especially the language barrier and all. But nice idea, could do that with the help of someone who speaks the language.

10) I noticed, and everyone here seems great; all the feedback I get is very appreciated and even when people say "it may seem harsh"... thats great, I'd prefer people to be harsh and truthful!

 

As for the mini,

- The back: that was done separately (if you mean the backpack and not his actual back!). A couple of weeks ago I just sat down with the backpack and conversion beamer and painted them up, took it steady and it turned out great. I just had to put it on this model and wreck it with varnish... oh well.

- The Front yeah, not too good; I only noticed most of the glaring errors after varnishing and photoing it. Which is what I was saying before, I was rushing far too much to notice.

 

Thanks for the feedback, it's much appreciated; and I'll get some better models done as soon as I can. For my usual quality you can see that in my more simple schemed models like this one (not great paints, but not as terrible as this one. I think I got TOO ballsy with the colour scheme, especially on a fully assembled model):

Space Sharks Marine with Power Sword and Shield

Soul Drinkers Marine with Thunder Hammer and Power Fist

[BERZERKER!]

Hi!

 

Before you wash anything, a coat off matt varnish will take the gloss straight off the model. Just so you know.

 

I would say you have too many bright colours on there for my taste. I find it can be a bit jarring.

 

Each different part of the model is clearly defined. It's actually a much better paintjob that it looks at first glance (no offence intended). I think what it lacks is depth. Try some more extreme highlighting/shading methods.

 

For a model that took for hours to paint, i think it's great. You often find that a few brush strokes make the difference between a mediocre model and an amazing one. You definitely have the skills, just keep up the practice!

 

Edit; This is definitely NOT a failure! Dont put yourself down, as it will uninspire you towards further work.

[Jupiter Forge]

@Berserker - Cheers, I will be keeping up the practice as much as I can.

No offence taken, I'm very hard to offend! Criticism of something doesn't cause offense, offense is only "taken" by people. :sick:

[lilloser]

Well done for completing the miniature. You learn far more by your mistakes and it's good that you can post this up in a tongue and cheek way. Sometimes you just have one of those days, you recognize what went wrong, now you can do it so much better.

 

Save this miniature, don't re-paint it. When you win a golden daemon you can look back on this and see how far you've come!

 

What do you have planned next? It will be interesting to see what you paint next.

 

LilLoser

[Adeptus-Alaska]

by the way man, that space shark is :lol: amazing! do that. a lot! I am actually getting a serious taste for you paint style. there are so many people afraid of the gritty look and if that space shark is any indicator........ :sick:

[Jupiter Forge]

@Furioso - I generally like the grittier style marine, my Crimson Castellans are kind of my foray into "Must... try... brighter... colours!", then I did the Soul Drinker and it was still dark. Then Mr Chapter Master? Far too bright and shiny. I may dull down the Castellans and make them more darkened like the Shark and Drinker.

If you check my galleries there's a few more completed pieces along the same style of darkish marines, but two of my favorites are:

Mechanicus Themed "Fabricator" for my Sons of Jupiter (essentially a Chapter Master)

Chaos Blood Gorgon Warband Marine (Ignore the sword hilt, that's now re-done)

 

 

@LiLoser - Thanks, I try to keep things light... even when they're heavy. Even though I'm bummed about this mini, I can keep my perspective, work off the criticisms and tips people give me, and get on with the next model. I'll look back at this one with pride when I get handed my Golde... Silve... Bron... Undercoated Demon, and say "Hah, I showed... someone!".

 

Next up I plan to do something more simple, just to work on techniques and go "back to basics" as it were. I stripped the Ultramarine Symbols from the 5x Snap-Together marines I got with a paint set back in, oh god, January? And I think they'll be a good testing ground for the same paint scheme as above (minus the purple cloak, that's Chapter Master only... the self-created lore demands it). So I'll be starting them this Wednesday with the scheme below:

Basic Crimson Castellan Space Marine

 

I'll probably end up doing at least 3 out of 5 of them in different styles to see which I prefer, as I've got three that I've tried out so far; "From the pot", "Wash build-up" and "Thin layer build-up".

The pictures in my post above are two of the different types, and then the chapter master is another; The Space Shark was a "From the pot" marine, the Soul Drinker was a "Wash build-up" and the Chapter Master was a "Thin layer build-up", then I'll see how I feel about the last two and do them in one of each of the two styles I like most. Practice practice practice!

 

And just for fun, I may do a "Police Car" style marine. I saw an American one on TV today and just thought this may look pretty good. But make the white a more grimy white like it's been through some battles, and have him in a pose with two bolt pistols. :D

Police Marine? Just for a little fun!

[Pig Of Sparta]

i took a look at this thread first thing this morning but didn't have time to reply then. Most of the things I was going to say have already been said by others with far greater painting ability than mine but what I will say is this.

 

EVERY miniature we paint is an opportunity to learn, whether it's a new painting technique, a new colour, or just trying to paint something you've never tried before. You should see this mini as just that.

 

There are some very positive elements to the paint work you've done here: For being only 10-15 completed paints back into the hobby your brush handling skills are pretty good, you're 'painting within the lines' as it were. You're thinning your paints (perhaps not always enough) but you're doing it which another really positive thing. This will pay dividends in future as it's a really good habit to develop early. You're also not afraid to experiment; not everyone would think to go from Blazing Orange to Blood Red to Blood Red/Crimson Gore in that order after only 10-15 mini's back into painting and as a matter of fact the red is one of my favourite parts of this mini. Try to hold on to that desire to try things out as it's really easy to lose it and it's a shame when that happens.

 

Being critical I'd say that the purple cloak is not quite to my liking but this is more down to the proximity of the red and purple shades to each other than anything else an aesthetic nit-pick if you will. I would also reiterate what was said about using washes to add shading and definition to your models. I've not looked back since the first time I cracked open a pot of Badab Black.

 

The only other things I'd like to say are never underestimate the importance of planning a painting project. I never used to do this and would find myself running into problems all the time. Now, however I use the 'techniques' I've learned and developed since I joined the B&C to plan the order of layers of colour I want to apply to each and every element of a mini to try and make the actual painting easier. When I'm trying something new I try to figure out ways to use what I already know to fill in the blanks to work out the things I don't.

 

I also do a lot of research into painting certain colours to find what might work best for me. This doesn't have to be as long-winded as sitting down with a notebook and writing things out. I like to 'play' mental painting exercises to try things out; I basically think through which paints I'd apply to a mini or part of a mini to achieve a certain look based on things I already know how to do. I'm probably a bit strange in doing this but I find it's a pleasant way of killing time at work, in the car, when queueing to pay for shopping. It's basically my way of practising but before I even get to doing a practice paint on a spare mini.

 

So approaching the conclusion of my rambling and probably by now surplus to requirements reply I'd just like to say that I think you should edit the name of this thread to '[insert name here] Chapter Master' and be proud of what you're achieved on this mini. Look forward to the next one and try not to dwell on what you're not happy with. As has been stated you can always come back to this mini, paint strip him and give it another go in future if you want.

 

The last thing to remember is that we all have to start somewhere and we've all got projects that either didn't pan out or didn't end up the way we wanted them to for one reason or another, but as I said at the start each one is an opportunity to learn, improve and push ourselves.

 

I look forward to seeing more your work on the board :D

 

James

[Cypher 102]

On the subject of color scheme. . . Meg Maples at Privateer Press has done a series of articles on the subject of color theory. Here is the first. If you do a search on the main website for her name you should be able to find the rest of the articles. Usually if you don't put any consideration into color theory before picking out a color scheme you end up with a result that looks wrong and you can't figure out why. In her further articles she takes on subjects like what color washes to use to make your colors warmer or cooler for different effects.

[Deathwing70]

2 things you mentioned you dislike can still be fixed, you've 'only' done 1/2 the work on them so far as far as some people are concerned.

 

The gloss varnish can be fixed by adding a matt varnish on top. A lot of people actually gloss varnish their miniatures before adding the matt varnish as final. Double varnish, the gloss varnish seems to be stronger than matt according to them.

 

The 'sand base' is so far just glued and dipped in sand. It deserves some paint as well :P

The colors you choose for this will definitely change the final appearance of the miniature, personally I don't really like bright bases and with the colorful colors the miniature has I think a darker base would make him stand out more. Though in the end its advisable to use the same color/technique on your entire army to make them coherent.

- If all options are open, paint the base black and start drybrushing the sand with bone/grey/white's for a basic ash like landscape.

 

Good luck and keep at it!

[Jupiter Forge]

@ Deathwing - Cheers for the tips! I do plan on working the base, I was going to go for a sandy color due to the chapter fluff, but I could do an ashy/rock one just to fit "more" with the plastic rock. :D

 

@ Cypher - Thanks for the article, I'll check it and the others out tomorrow when I'm not as dog'tired. ;)

 

@ Sparta - That's a lot of writing there! I don't think I could comment on everything you said or I'd be here all night, but I do want to thank you for it; I completely understand where you're coming from and you've summed up a lot of great points on what I can do to improve and for me that's really wonderful. I've been given a lot of helpful advice in this thread and yours was a big part of that, so a really big thanks for the motivation and ideas!

 

As for today... it's time to sleep, perchance, to dream, and then only one more working day until the weekend where I can make a start on the wet palette and some "back to basics" practice miniatures like I already mentioned in my above posts. Good night for now all, once again thank you for all your help and encouragement it does mean a lot.

 

Have a good one,

J.F.

[MordentHex]

Thats actually better than my first tries at painting back in the day. most important thing is to just keep trying. Its a skill and like all skills has to be used and for most people the more you do the better you will become. Patience is also the go to word when painting nice models. Unless your Necrons.:)

[Dark Scipio]

Good starter job, just paint more. My first look much worse, the more you paint the better you get. Look some tutorials on you tube (Girlpainting for example). Talent is only need for dream jobs.

[Sneekystabs]

some tips that I discovered, use the new paints, as mentioned use different brushes for the colour, and if you want eye glow like alot of people do put a tiny bit of white then do a very thin layer of green (or whatever colour eyes you have) anyway dont take what i say for sure i have only been painting for less than a year but have learned quite alot.