Quicksilver vs hammers

[MFive]

as i have been going to try using a libi i have been wondering if it will make the hammers strike at I10 i asked one of the guys in my group and his thoughts where no it dosn't(he runs SW and Nids and is starting CSM) as the weapon profile almost always takes precedence over most things.

[Zeratul29]

Well I've always used quicksilver with halberds to make them I10, so i'm not sure about hammers, I'm assuming there might be something in the faq or dex, but if it makes swords, halberds, and staves I10, why not hammers?

[dswanick]

3 page rules debate here : http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=256155

 

Current tl;dr : Codex > Advanced Rules > Basic Rules. (I think, it might be Advanced Rules = Codex > Basic Rules) ;)

[MFive]

both are however are codex rules, as the demon hammer is a thunder hammer, and even in 5th it struck last

 

EDIT: never mind :cuss i found my answer thanks for the fast reply's!

[Zeratul29]

And the answer is?

[Toasterfree]

hammers strike at i1

[Azekai]

No one will play you if you try to play with I10 hammers. It's clearly an oversight and not much fun to play with or against.

[MFive]

the answer being that you are I10 but due to Unwieldy you will strike at I1, as the rule ignores your I and makes it so you will always strike at I1 unless your a Monstrous Creature or a walker so in short both are correct and you are both I10 and strike at I1

 

No one will play you if you try to play with I10 hammers. It's clearly an oversight and not much fun to play with or against.

and that :huh:

[thade]

What was it that nighthawks once said to me? "There are some rules that are so well established that they forget to make a point of them in the books." I'll concede that this idea can be very frustrating, but then we need to keep in mind what kind of a game we're playing. It's poorly suited for purely competitive play; very well suited for story-driven/narrative games.

 

Unwieldy doesn't seem to be intended to be a massive departure from the way power fists and thunderhammers previously worked; rather an attempt to simplify it for quicker explanation. They always strike at I1, as they always did; that's the way it's being played around here and - honestly - I haven't seen anybody around my area even hint at making a stink otherwise.

 

Is the RAW satisfactory? No, but any chain of rules arguments in the OR can show you that: in fact, many come out and say it. Some people feel they are doing the game a service by harping (ad nauseum) on a strict pecking order for what rulebooks supercede what other rulebooks, if only to help highlight loopholes that need to be addressed. What gets lost in that "exercise" is their message may reach (and cause trouble for) many players and not reach their intended target - the devs. Very likely you'll see hammers and fists swing strictly at I1 wherever you're at. <3 Regardless of whether or not speed-up powers are at play.

 

EDIT: Clarification.

[MFive]

the only thing i can think of that I10 hammers would help you with is maybe a necron wagerer that removes you on a failed I-test, but you will still strike at I1, so the warscythes would probably kill you be4 you got to attack against i think i would recommend falchions as you are going to go 1st against any one in the army(except maybe an HQ or 2) or maybe some tyranid stuff

 

Edit: what is 'RAW'? cannot seem to figure out what it is and feel foolish for asking xD

 

Is the RAW satisfactory? No, but any chain of rules arguments in the OR can show you that: in fact, many come out and say it.

[elphilo]

Edit: what is 'RAW'? cannot seem to figure out what it is and feel foolish for asking xD

 

Rules as written.

 

RAI = Rules as intended.

[thade]

As elphilo says :) RAW is "rules-as-written", which means the as-literal-as-possible meaning of the rules, to their letter.

 

RAI is "rules-as-intended" which involves a great deal of inference in cases and is typically relegated to 'your neighborhood' or local gaming group, as it were.

 

(Long-winded version now.)

 

RAW is by far preferable, because - ideally - it's less ambiguous than RAI and, thus, more likely to be played similarly in different places; it means we are playing and talking about the same game. This is especially valuable to players were tournaments and other competitive settings are concerned.

 

RAI can result in different interpretations in different places, or even just between different people. This can come up where the RAW is unfortunately ambiguous; that is, where the rules are written such that two contradicting interpretations seem equally permitted. When this happens, people here will throw out their RAI interpretations for everybody to consider (after demonstrating - either clearly or on accident via circular arguments - that the RAW has a hole in it) and, thus, players and their respective groups can consider "What those B&C guys do" when trying to decide how to play it themselves. At least, that's the best-case scenario. <3