The "Essential Heresy"

[chymz]

Hi Guys,

 

I’ve just finished Reading Fear to Tread and really enjoyed it. While reading it, I was thinking that it felt good to be reading a Horus Heresy book again that actually advanced the overall plot of the Heresy in a meaningful way.

 

That got me to thinking and I skipped to the front of the book and read through the list of the 21(!) books released so far (excluding audio dramas, limited edition releases, ebooks etc etc) that make up the series. I realised that (to me at least) there were only a handful of these that actually advanced the series in some meaningful way. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve really enjoyed the other books in the series, but I just feel like the list below would constitute the essential reading for the HH, and the rest are simply “nice-to-have fluff”.

 

What do you guys think? What in your opinion would be the “Essential Heresy”?

 

Mine is (in release order):

 

 

1 Horus Rising

2 False Gods

3 Galaxy in Flames

12 A Thousand Sons

14 The First Heretic

15 Prospero Burns

21 Fear to Tread

 

 

Thanks!

[Olis]

Well, what you've listed, with the exception to Know No Fear, is every major Heresy plot point, in book form, that has been created up until now. The major events that we've known for decades are (mostly) encompassed by your list. But that isn't the point to the heresy novels (at least, imho). They are there to 'fill in the gaps', add more depth and to create events anew, rather than merely retell a story that goes back almost twenty-five years. For a fluff-hound like me, it's great stuff as it makes the universe we all know and love much more tangible. Besides the odd bad novel, I have looked forward to each new instalment over the past five years or so and I'll continue to look forward to many more, plot advancing or otherwise. :blush:

 

For the sake of being on-topic, my list would be:

 

Horus Rising through Galaxy In Flames

Legion

A Thousand Sons/Prospero Burns

The First Heretic

Know No Fear

Fear To Tread

[A D-B]

Well, what you've listed, with the exception to Know No Fear, is every major Heresy plot point, in book form, that has been created up until now. The major events that we've known for decades are (mostly) encompassed by your list.

 

This is a subject pretty close to my bleak, black heart.

 

I'd argue that The First Heretic isn't famous lore from the past at all, which is a massive part of the reason that when I was writing it, I was so afraid it would do badly upon release. I haven't really had a chance to touch any of the famous old lore - at least not on the scale that the other guys have gotten to play with. The only old lore about the events of The First Heretic was a vague reference to Lorgar being reprimanded by the Emperor and going into seclusion for a month after it. Compare that - a vague line from a 10+ year old White Dwarf article - to events as famous and detailed as Signus Prime, the Razing of Prospero, Isstvan III, the Battle of Calth, the Flight of the Eisenstein, and so on. It's really not on the same level. Even showing Isstvan V was a gamble, since it was already shown in Fulgrim, and doesn't feature much in The First Heretic.

 

For better or worse, I think my stuff stands as an example of filling in the gaps, but hopefully doing it by making new lore essential. The First Heretic explores a lot about the nature of primarchs; their relationships with one another; the nature of the warp and Chaos itself; as well as the origins of several Chaos Marine tropes, but none of that's because it was there in the old lore or waiting to be used in this context. I wrote it (read: made it up) because I thought it was interesting and would make a good story. What I mean, specifically, is that the events in TFH really weren't the things we've famously known for 20ish years.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm flattered TFH is always considered a vital book in the series, but I think it proves a very good point from a fan perspective as well as an author one. "The non-essential" books are a frequent complaint. The solution is to take something that isn't necessarily a famous event, and place it in wider context, making it interesting enough to really matter. Make everything about it (and around it) into something vital and interesting, even if it's not based on one of the famous battles.

 

I think maybe it matters more to me because I don't get the famous events. They were already reserved by the time I joined.

[Sazabi24]

Did you get the Battle for the Webway?

[CyderPirate]

Surprised to see Fulgrim missing from both of those lists, definitely a must for me. One book that follows a legion's transition from loyalty to treachery. Not to mention the death of primarch and the evolution of another!

[chymz]

I think that even though TFH is not part of the old "core-lore", its a LOT more than just being a really well written story, and has a serious claim to be considered more than at home in the "Essentials" list.

 

The turning of Lorgar in TFH explains Erebus' motivations for doing what he did with Horus in the first three books, the actions of the Word Bearers in Fear to Tread and I'm sure I'm missing a bunch of other points too.

 

 

 

 

Wow, A-D-B has read something I've written! I'm going for a lie-down.

[Ubermensch Commander]

While it may seem like a cop-out, I would propose that all of the books are essential to one degree or another.

So much of the value of the books relies on personal preference.

For example, I would throw Legion and Prospero Burns right out the window, as I consider their "additions" detrimental,

while very much enjoying Nemesis for giving the readers a view of the Non-Astartes aspects of the Imperium, letting us get a glimpse of how the heights of government functioned. Yes, yes, the Emperor ordered and folks obeyed...but its a big empire, how does this actually go down?

So it largely depends on whether or not you want existing fluff expanded on, or new bits of the heresy explored. If you want both, read as much as you can.

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

I considered Nemisis to be an important book too. It gives a good reason why the Assassins did not get too involved.

[Brother Captain Andrew]

Well here goes

 

I (Essential Reading for all)

1. Horus Rising, False Gods, Galaxy In Flames (The fall of Horus, cleansing of the loyalists)

 

2. Flight of the Einstien (Garro and the start of the Inquisition, is the foundation for all the Garro/Loken short stories)

 

3. Thousand Sons + Prospero Burns (The tragic fall of Magnus and his legion, most in depth coverage of Nikea which has become much larger even than I ever thought it would, Reinvention of Wolves.)

 

4. First Heretic (The seed from which the Heresy started, Horus may be the chosen one but Lorgar is the gateway)

 

5. Legion (Alpha Legion is looking like the third faction in Traitors vs Loyalists, Explains the Cabal, and introduces Grammaticus)

 

II (Essential as background to individual legions)

Dark Angles (Fallen Angels, Descent of Angels)

Ultramarines (Know No Fear)

Blood Angels (Fear to Tread)

Emperor's Children (Fulgrim)

Raven Guard (Deliverance Lost)

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

I would argue that all of them are essential except Prospero Burns, which contains nothing of note about the Heresy at all and is entirely superfluous.

 

Maybe it's just me but I don't see why you'd want to deliberately skip large chunks of material. It's like just reading the synopsis of a movie and calling it done, IMO.

[Arachnid99]

I think maybe it matters more to me because I don't get the famous events. They were already reserved by the time I joined.

 

I've seen you mention that before and it really pisses me off. This is a project that has already been going for 6 years and is probably going to be over a decade from start to finish. I fully understand that you've got to plot out and assign the next two years of releases but the idea that the decision about who gets to write the Siege of Terra or the Fall of Caliban was made in 2006, a decade before those books are released seems really, really stupid. Frankly not all Heresy authors are equally skilled and not all authors contributions to the lore are equally well received, the decision about who gets to write the climax of this very long running, multi-author series shouldn't be made on a first come first serve basis. It should be done based on who can do the best job and get the best reaction from the fanbase. A decision that you can't make before a single book has hit the shelves.

[Bungicats]

The First Heretic was the very first HH I ever read. Had I not randomly looked at the book in the store one day I don't think I would have ever read the series. Don't get me wrong I had read many a gw, black library book and other assorted material as I do enjoy having a history of the *40K* Universe. I'm sure many of us didn't start with book 1 and I think that's the magic of the collection. Each book has it's own *magnitizing* draw to different people. For me though TFH sucked me in even deeper, and I must say It is quite hot and humid in the dark place :D

[Týr]

In my humble opinion people dosen't seem to understand that the Horus Heresy is not just a story . It is much more a setting.

It dosen't make sense to say book X is vital, but book Y is not vital because it dosen't contribute to the overall storyline. Every book is vital (except for Battle for the abyss, because that book dosen't exist) and contribute to the story in their own way. More importantly they each explore a certain part of the setting.

 

It is so much more interesting to let the books evolve the setting and elaborate it instead of just rushing through the story. The Horus Heresy series could be finished within the next few years, but all we would have is extended standard GW fluff and cliche characters/legions.

[Bigger-than-Jesus]

I'm amazed no-one mentioned Fulgrim, even though it featured Istvaan V.

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

In my humble opinion people dosen't seem to understand that the Horus Heresy is not just a story . It is much more a setting.

It dosen't make sense to say book X is vital, but book Y is not vital because it dosen't contribute to the overall storyline. Every book is vital (except for Battle for the abyss, because that book dosen't exist) and contribute to the story in their own way. More importantly they each explore a certain part of the setting.

 

I completely agree, except for Prospero Burns. It added literally nothing to the Heresy. Decent Space Wolves book, terrible Horus Heresy book.

[Týr]

In my humble opinion people dosen't seem to understand that the Horus Heresy is not just a story . It is much more a setting.

It dosen't make sense to say book X is vital, but book Y is not vital because it dosen't contribute to the overall storyline. Every book is vital (except for Battle for the abyss, because that book dosen't exist) and contribute to the story in their own way. More importantly they each explore a certain part of the setting.

 

I completely agree, except for Prospero Burns. It added literally nothing to the Heresy. Decent Space Wolves book, terrible Horus Heresy book.

 

It completely reinvented a legion just like The First Heretic did. Besides it delved into how the legions all "spied" on each others with secret agents, and how the seed for distrust between two prominent legions had been sown decades, if not centuries before Prospero and Nikea.

 

I would say that relates very much to the Heresy.

[A D-B]

I think maybe it matters more to me because I don't get the famous events. They were already reserved by the time I joined.

 

I've seen you mention that before and it really pisses me off. This is a project that has already been going for 6 years and is probably going to be over a decade from start to finish. I fully understand that you've got to plot out and assign the next two years of releases but the idea that the decision about who gets to write the Siege of Terra or the Fall of Caliban was made in 2006, a decade before those books are released seems really, really stupid. Frankly not all Heresy authors are equally skilled and not all authors contributions to the lore are equally well received, the decision about who gets to write the climax of this very long running, multi-author series shouldn't be made on a first come first serve basis. It should be done based on who can do the best job and get the best reaction from the fanbase. A decision that you can't make before a single book has hit the shelves.

 

Oh, man. It's not quite that extreme. When I joined, a lot of stuff was already done (Isstvan III, Eisenstein, Isstvan V) and in my first meeting, I found out a little more was already planned (Prospero, f'rex). I went to that first meeting hoping to ask to write a novel about Prospero, as it happens.

 

Other stuff is reserved in the sense of it being tied to that author's 40K work. Calth (or an Ultramarine novel) was off the cards, because Graham was tagged for that. The Blood Angels (which would've been my second choice after I found out Prospero was about to be written by Graham and Dan) were tagged because Jim was eventually going to do Signus Prime.

 

The same thing applies where I'm concerned, in that I'd get first refusal on a Night Lords novel, and I'd really like to be the first one to do a novel about the Eighth Legion. The other guys are unlikely to pitch one based on that; we're pals, after all.

 

I can't really go into detail about what's reserved in the future, but with the Age of Darkness, things are a lot looser because there's very little old lore to be reserved. Apart from the Siege of Terra, there are practically none of the old famous events left - it's either down to vague references or lines here and there from old IA articles, or - more accurately - it's up to us to make the events that will be famous in 5, 10, 15+ years. Now we're all filling in the gaps, so to speak, which is what my first post was about, and my angle on how it can work well.

[No Foes Remain]

I can't really go into detail about what's reserved in the future, but with the Age of Darkness, things are a lot looser because there's very little old lore to be reserved. Apart from the Siege of Terra, there are practically none of the old famous events left - it's either down to vague references or lines here and there from old IA articles, or - more accurately - it's up to us to make the events that will be famous in 5, 10, 15+ years. Now we're all filling in the gaps, so to speak, which is what my first post was about, and my angle on how it can work well.

 

So basically you're (BL as a whole, more specifically the HH 'guys') digging in the old archives and wiping the dust of IA articles to see if there is anything worth writting about and how you would go about doing that? Just to bridge what happens in the seven years of the Heresy?

[A D-B]

I can't really go into detail about what's reserved in the future, but with the Age of Darkness, things are a lot looser because there's very little old lore to be reserved. Apart from the Siege of Terra, there are practically none of the old famous events left - it's either down to vague references or lines here and there from old IA articles, or - more accurately - it's up to us to make the events that will be famous in 5, 10, 15+ years. Now we're all filling in the gaps, so to speak, which is what my first post was about, and my angle on how it can work well.

 

So basically you're (BL as a whole, more specifically the HH 'guys') digging in the old archives and wiping the dust of IA articles to see if there is anything worth writting about and how you would go about doing that? Just to bridge what happens in the seven years of the Heresy?

 

Not... exactly. There are a few obvious references (The Wolf and the Lion... The White Scars and the Space Wolves...) but you have seven years of all-out, full-scale galactic civil war between the Eighteen Legions and the wider Imperium before they reach Terra. There's no need to really dig, because 1) The references are mostly famous and obvious, and 2) If you can't think of a decent story in that setting, there's probably not that much hope for you as a writer (or a fan) [The general "you", not you personally, Cap.]. So, yeah, there's definitely research going on. But there are a slew of ideas we've not seen before, because that's really our mandate. The old lore was fine as an overview, but it's very, very thin in terms of a realistic narrative or a widespread civil war that tears apart a whole galaxy.

[No Foes Remain]

I can't really go into detail about what's reserved in the future, but with the Age of Darkness, things are a lot looser because there's very little old lore to be reserved. Apart from the Siege of Terra, there are practically none of the old famous events left - it's either down to vague references or lines here and there from old IA articles, or - more accurately - it's up to us to make the events that will be famous in 5, 10, 15+ years. Now we're all filling in the gaps, so to speak, which is what my first post was about, and my angle on how it can work well.

 

So basically you're (BL as a whole, more specifically the HH 'guys') digging in the old archives and wiping the dust of IA articles to see if there is anything worth writting about and how you would go about doing that? Just to bridge what happens in the seven years of the Heresy?

 

Not... exactly. There are a few obvious references (The Wolf and the Lion... The White Scars and the Space Wolves...) but you have seven years of all-out, full-scale galactic civil war between the Eighteen Legions and the wider Imperium before they reach Terra. There's no need to really dig, because 1) The references are mostly famous and obvious, and 2) If you can't think of a decent story in that setting, there's probably not that much hope for you as a writer (or a fan) [The general "you", not you personally, Cap.]. So, yeah, there's definitely research going on. But there are a slew of ideas we've not seen before, because that's really our mandate. The old lore was fine as an overview, but it's very, very thin in terms of a realistic narrative or a widespread civil war that tears apart a whole galaxy.

 

Ah, I get ya'. So you look into the old IA to see what could be done and other-wise discuss what could happen because of X in book Y and how Z would feel or respond or just see what would make a good story and set a waypoint in the HH series?

[Arachnid99]

Oh, man. It's not quite that extreme. When I joined, a lot of stuff was already done (Isstvan III, Eisenstein, Isstvan V) and in my first meeting, I found out a little more was already planned (Prospero, f'rex). I went to that first meeting hoping to ask to write a novel about Prospero, as it happens.

 

Other stuff is reserved in the sense of it being tied to that author's 40K work. Calth (or an Ultramarine novel) was off the cards, because Graham was tagged for that. The Blood Angels (which would've been my second choice after I found out Prospero was about to be written by Graham and Dan) were tagged because Jim was eventually going to do Signus Prime.

 

The same thing applies where I'm concerned, in that I'd get first refusal on a Night Lords novel, and I'd really like to be the first one to do a novel about the Eighth Legion. The other guys are unlikely to pitch one based on that; we're pals, after all.

 

I can't really go into detail about what's reserved in the future, but with the Age of Darkness, things are a lot looser because there's very little old lore to be reserved. Apart from the Siege of Terra, there are practically none of the old famous events left - it's either down to vague references or lines here and there from old IA articles, or - more accurately - it's up to us to make the events that will be famous in 5, 10, 15+ years. Now we're all filling in the gaps, so to speak, which is what my first post was about, and my angle on how it can work well.

 

Well that does seem a bit more reasonable and here's hoping you or Graham McNeill get the nod to do the Siege of Terra.

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

2. Flight of the Einstien (Garro and the start of the Inquisition, is the foundation for all the Garro/Loken short stories)

 

/agree 100%. This book should be right at the top with GiF. If you missed this book then much of what is to come will go over your head.

[Wade Garrett]

2. Flight of the Einstien (Garro and the start of the Inquisition, is the foundation for all the Garro/Loken short stories)

/agree 100%. This book should be right at the top with GiF. If you missed this book then much of what is to come will go over your head.

 

To be honest, I found Eisenstern pretty "meh". But that may be a matter of taste.

My favorite Horus Heresy books have been the ones like The First Heretic or A Thousand Sons, that really get into what makes a Legion and their Primarch tick. Eisenstern is apparently as close as we're going to get to a Death Guard book, and the only things things I really took away from it are that the Dusk Raiders used to use failed aspirants as squires/helots, and the Death Guard iniate try outs involved making your way through a maze of posionous/venomous plants and animals.

 

I never felt like the Death Guard's unique qualities got to shine like the Ultramarines's LOGISTICS, the Alpha Legion's sneakiness, or the Thousand Sons's sorcery and thirst for knowledge did in their HH outings.

[Rain]

I guess this is a biased list but I'd say Horus Rising, Galaxy in Flames, The First Heretic, Prospero Burns, and I guess Fulgrim. False Gods wasn't really that interesting even though it covers an important event (basically a fat guy stabs Horus so he goes evil. Another evil sword gimmick). Also I think that Horus Rising and Galaxy in Flames basically cover the Luna Wolves pretty well up to Istvaan. The First Heretic really goes to the source of the Heresy and is both a good story and a great "behind the scenes" look at what was going on before and up to Istvaan. Flight of the Eisenstien is boring and not really that important in the greater scheme, the ship escapes and Garro is a cool guy. Great, whatever.

 

Prospero Burns is good and gives a very unconventional look at the Wolves who I didn't even like going in and honestly still don't like, but the book is done very well and the attack on Prospero is an important plot point. Fulgrim covers important points as well but I thought it was a bad book, and in light of that it can be skipped especially as it largely overlaps with Galaxy in Flames anyway but your mileage may vary. Outside mention goes to Legion, which while not key to the overall plot per se was pretty much my favorite HH book, though The First Heretic is a close contender.

 

Edit: Oh yeah and Know No Fear of course. Another important plot point and good book. It's a bit bolter porn-y but it's still quite good, it's almost like a Graham McNeill book that I actually like, which makes sense as it was written by Abnett.

[Inquisitor Engel]

The same thing applies where I'm concerned, in that I'd get first refusal on a Night Lords novel, and I'd really like to be the first one to do a novel about the Eighth Legion. The other guys are unlikely to pitch one based on that; we're pals, after all.

 

While I'm disappointed you didn't get Signus Prime (though I did enjoy FTT) this makes total sense. Some people are just good at writing a specific Legion, some can do many quite well. The short story novels do seem to let people stretch their legs a bit though, which is sometimes good, sometimes not as good. There's the obvious example of "Know No Fear" and "Fulgrim."

 

Then again, you can get "Prospero Burns," which is, though still interesting, doesn't measure up to Dan's other books and "A Thousand Sons" comes off as way, way, way better because it's so contrasty. . I understand he had health issues while writing it, but it seems this might be a pitfall of the "I called it" system. Imagine Bill King getting to do the Space Wolves again! :)

 

Please do a Night Lords novel soon. Please.

 

Oh, and I'm super pleased with the World Eater stuff so far. So... you've got three Legions now. :D