Morticon Posted September 27, 2012 Author Share Posted September 27, 2012 I bet that poor Ork player can be found in a glass cage of emotion somewhere.... @Brother Tyler: I've spotted it, and I approve ;). Lets see how long it takes our fearless leader to find out ;) :) Got it :D And man, I chatted to Nigel yesterday when I went round to his shop. He said from the start of the tournament he had envisaged a BA-Ork final, he was just upset he couldnt give me as much of a challenge as he felt I deserved! Next time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teeef Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Vir triumphalis. First the titles then the triumph. I think the key point is, know your meta. I don't play tournaments so I will add my voice to others on the thread and thank you once again for letting me vicariously experience BA victories. I especially enjoy the accounts of your down moments, not hating by any means. Forgetting to move Mephiston in Game 2 and two perils in Game 4, hey, I can do that. Keeping your wits and overcoming that... well that how you win. I also enjoyed reading how focused you were on the objectives of each game and, in a sense, were unconcerned in the use of your units to meet those goals. The Game 3 opponent was a step behind you there. I suffer from wanting every unit to live – trite but true – winning takes sacrifice. Game 5: Putting Mephiston in the open and daring the opponent to take him out was ace. I liked how you put in the part about foregoing your BA nature before taking the, "baals to the wall" approach! Thanks also for the many pics of the tables. It creates a really good tutorial on using the various terrain features. Unfortunately pics cannot capture the flyer action at all. Not something you can fix but it makes that part hard to grasp. Rhetorical questions. How can you tell which monstrous creatures are flying when there are four of them with their bases on the table? What direction did they come from and the picture is it before or after they turned? Awesome reports and once again, congratulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 27, 2012 Author Share Posted September 27, 2012 Thanks Teef ! Some great comments there. Makes it all worthwhile! Also, knowing what people are learning from/finding interesting means I can pay more attention to it in the future. If there is one thing I can offer as far as a hint for tourney play to anyone its "Objective, objective, objective!" - basically keep focussed from turn one, hell, from placement of objectives (if thats the case) on what the objective is. I caught the two toughest opponents with their pants down because of it. As for the MCs, the opponent declared various movements each turn, so I just remembered that. The facing was wherever the heads were. As for coming down, only once out of all the games did the opponent ground his MCs. Everyone else was buzzing about like overgrown canaries. And they all deepstruck in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 I finally had time to read the batreps. Wow. Well done Mort (and really good reports too!) Nice to see the Blood Angles managing to defeat the demons. though it is dsiappointing you had to face 3 deamon armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 So is the general consensus that Mephiston in a Raven is pretty much an auto-include at 1500+ then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ushtarador Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 I wouldn't put mephi in the raven actually. The danger of coming up only in turn 3 or even 4 is too big. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 28, 2012 Author Share Posted September 28, 2012 So is the general consensus that Mephiston in a Raven is pretty much an auto-include at 1500+ then? Mephy AND a raven - quite possibly. Mephy IN a Raven, possibly not as Ushtarador mentioned. Still a helluva lot of points though, you will need to have some cheap/effective troops to make that work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Admetus Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 I'd be hesitant about both at 1500. That's nigh on a third of your army (depending on upgrades) at that level, you're looking at 450 points before you upgrade the storm raven. If they can counter your raven, and have enough dudes to tarpit Mephy or enough stuff that can kill Mephy, you're toast. Its also going to leave you pretty thin on the ground, or lacking in combat effectiveness elsewhere. 1750 would be my personal lower limit for using both, as at that limit you're essentially using a 1500 point list that had one of those in, and the other thrown in on top. I still maintain its possible to be competitive without either (got a batrep thread going and I've yet to touch either unit in it), but the real test will be ToS in 3 weeks. For my money, I'd take a Storm Raven over Meph where you can only get one or the other in a list, as I think its a better all-rounder and harder to counter (Meph can be tarpitted, farseer's will make him cry, terminators ruin his day, bystander will absolutely cream him one on one, a dedicated plasma squad could probably one-shot him), and its got a case for being one of the best fliers in the game. Definitely top 3 (duking it out with vendettas and night scythes for the top spot.. it wins in a vacuum but the others are better in the army as a whole). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 If you are deploying him on the table on his own... I'd be inclined to say Sanguinor with a Glaive Axe is better overall... Especially if you are going to take a lot of jump pack squads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 I still maintain its possible to be competitive without either .. We had an awesome discussion about this a long while back I believe. (may have even gotten a bit heated) My view is that it is very possible to be competitive without mephy, however I believe a list with him in it is even more competitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriel1303 Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Congratulations on the victory. Great write up and some very useful tips and tactics. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 Congratulations on the victory. Great write up and some very useful tips and tactics. Thanks. Cheers for the props mate. Anything in particular you found useful or insightful? Anything that stood out for you, or perhaps you hadnt thought of before? Reason I ask is that through the bulk of the batreps, people can miss that kinda stuff, and the chatting about it can often help other players/readers too! Let us know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Mort, did you feel that you actually outplayed the Daemon players in this tournament? Or did you feel the moons and stars aligned so that circumstances opened the opportunity for you to seize the victory? I'm still looking at these bat reps trying to work out how you managed to beat that 2nd Daemon list! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 Sama, It was a combo of both man. It's difficult to argue in a vacuum on account of the variables at play. When the 2nd player got his unfavoured list, that facilitated a set of occurrences, tactics and moves from my opponent. In response to those tactics etc. I reacted. I focused on the units that were there. I focused on the troops, and the screamers where possible. (remember I also lost Mephy quite cheaply in that game). Had things gone his way, and he had gotten his favoured list, his deployment would have been different, and as a result my tactics/target priority etc. In the 2nd Daemon game, although Mephy got Immovable Object, if he hadn't I would have just sat back and taken out all his troops and played for the VP. That was definitely the most comfortable Daemon game. In the 3rd, once again, I focused entirely on the scoring troops and sacrificed my guys so that I could hold the objective from 5th turn, and the backup being Mephy getting linebreaker. Also, remember that mission the ravens didnt come on in 2nd, and only 1 in 3rd!. So, to answer directly and with no caution to modesty, I definitely feel I outplayed them but..they were outplayed in the context of their poor (my good?) luck. If that makes sense? I hedged my bets on the 33% chance of game end, and it paid off. They could have played differently, conserved their troops, but under the circumstances, BA had the mobility and the firepower to get around it and be reactive to the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 I was definitely trying to be careful in my wording so as to not cast any allusions to you being 'lucky' in your wins, because you definitely were not. But I am just looking at the match ups and thinking how heavily against you they must have been. Very impressive play. Battling through 4 bad match ups to win must be so rewarding! Out of interest, what is your tournament circuit ruling on the Screamer/Flamer 'Daemon' rules? Do they get Eternal Warrior? Do they get 5++ and Fear? Do they get both? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 Not a prob matey, I understood totally what you meant. I also believe that tournies for a large part are about good match ups. This is under the assumption that play level is round about the same. I dont care if you're Tony Kopach or not, if you come up against a top level tourney player thats using your nemesis list, then I believe only luck will save you. I also went in knowing daemons would be plentiful, so I knew the vehicles would help. As for their rules, yup yup. They get all of the above. Fear, 5+ and EW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Yeah that's something that makes them definitely over powered/undercosted and needs to be dealt with in an FAQ asap. Because I cannot see how logically you can use both the Daemon rules simultaneously. They still die to rapid firing bolters though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 Whats the biggest argument against them getting EW? As far as i saw their codex says all models in the daemon army have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 In the pamphlet dex they have 'Save -' and the Rule 'Daemon' The issue is the version of the 'Daemon' special rule you use.... Chaos Daemon codex states that that you get Eternal Warrior and your save is Invulnerable. BRB states that Daemon special rule gives you a 5+ invun and you cause Fear. So really Screamers and Flamers should only get one or the other. A 5+ invulnerable save and no EW OR Eternal Warrior and no save. And as Codex trumps rulebook, they should really be EW and have no save at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Are you still fourth overall, or have you moved up a few places? Quit with the suspense! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 2, 2012 Author Share Posted October 2, 2012 Are you still fourth overall, or have you moved up a few places? Quit with the suspense! ;) The nationals rankings haven't been moved, but it's likely that I will move into 2nd position, depending when they drop the oldest figures. Also, there was a screw up regarding the last regionals, meaning the one I won was not counted. After that, and after this tournament, I should have been at pole position. ><; Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Great man! I would like to thank you for all the info. Now onto my own local tournament here :tu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 Great man! I would like to thank you for all the info. Now onto my own local tournament here :) Let us know how it goes, k? Win or lose ;) It will be a learning experience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 YAAAAAAAAAAY !!!!! :blink: They've updated the national rankings results, and for the first time since I got back to the country 2.5 years ago, I've managed to get to pole position!! WHOOP WHOOP!! http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb447/Brindleysa/rankin.jpg (sadly, it may be short lived on account of me missing a regionals bout this weekend ^_^ ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAwarrior43 Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Congrats Mort! So Where do you see your lists going forward from here? Would you still run a pure mech or is it time to switch up your game? -DA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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